The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
Has zilch impact or credibility even within the far right. Its just a rump of fantacists and anti fascists who have nothing better to do.
Beating the Fascists: The authorised history of Anti-Fascist Action
- Thread starter cogg
- Start date
Has zilch impact or credibility even within the far right. Its just a rump of fantacists and anti fascists who have nothing better to do.
Fedayn
Well-Known Member
There's a few serious heads from over here on it. They're more influential elsewhere mind.
malatesta32
Not Serb. No, Really!
i think the infidels are still using anti-semitism - tho calling it 'zionism' which is a byword for antisemitism - and there are still a clutch of deniers on shirtfront as well as a bunch of 88s, 28s, 18 etc. the bnp and fuffies have tried to get rid of deniers like batty barnes as most voters find nazis repellent and the 2nd world war as morally correct. street fascism has focussed away from the jews - mainly because of assimilation and a tiny visible presence of hassidim/orthodox in UK - and on to 'muslims' - a byword for 'pakis.' they say islam is not a race so we're not racist, but its odd that the majority of 'visible' muslims all happen to be brown. what a coincidence! as for the state thing steps, to use old CB Radio terminology - i 10/4 that good buddy! over and out!
MellySingsDoom
Decimated by the shrapnel of his rhetoric
Just to add to Mal's reply to senor 39thStep - I've noticed recently that a lot of so-called "national anarchists" in Europe (particularly in Germany) have taken the lead from Troy Southgate and used "anti-Zionism" as an entryist tactic to disseminate coded anti-Semitic propaganda (and also what they call their version of "anti-capitalism"). Whilst I'd definitely agree with senor 39th that Islamophobia is still way, way more popular within Euro-fascist circles, this new form of coded anti-Semitism is a real and very worrying development indeed...
malatesta32
Not Serb. No, Really!
good stuff that!
malatesta32
Not Serb. No, Really!
i meant no quarter, not the stuff on anti-smtism!
Whilst it is obviously extremely tactically sensible for fascists to put the old anti semitism into the background whilst they major on Islamaphobia in Europe generally - given, as has been said here, the low profile of Jews in Europe nowadays . It is nevertheless VERY difficult for the fascists to now dispense with anti semitism as a core element of their ideology. Anti semitism , whether simply the "Jewish banker" stereotype, or the even more paranoid USA Militia style "ZOG" ie "Zionist Occupation Government" stuff , and "secret World Government" paranoid stuff - still drawing on the old "Protocols of the Elders of Zion" nonsense, has bitten so deep into the world fascist viewpoint that the ideological flexibility of pre wwII fascism has to an extent been lost. It's now quite difficult to write the Jews OUT of this core villain role in the world fascism "story" - and of course the current world banking crisis gives all the old poisonous stuff credence yet again. So I don't think we'll actually see anti semitism fade from fascist ideology - it will remain more as the "big secret" to which recruits drawn in around anti muslim prejudice will next be indoctrinated into as they move deeper into fascist organisations.
For the fascists I actually think this is a major problem - because although the existing anti semitic ideology is internally reasonably consistent (barmy and wrong but nevertheless part of a clear "narrative" with deep historical roots), it robs fascism of flexibility, and acts as a "red warning marker" as to the true nature of a particular organisation - a very BAD thing for populist movements trying to ride waves of popular discontent, without provoking a harsh "response" from the anti fascist Left. The NF in France does appear to have managed to bury this core anti semitism in its political posturing , to its advantage, but I assume (with no direct knowledge whether this is so) that the higher echelons of the NF are still saturated with all the old anti Semitic stuff.
For the fascists I actually think this is a major problem - because although the existing anti semitic ideology is internally reasonably consistent (barmy and wrong but nevertheless part of a clear "narrative" with deep historical roots), it robs fascism of flexibility, and acts as a "red warning marker" as to the true nature of a particular organisation - a very BAD thing for populist movements trying to ride waves of popular discontent, without provoking a harsh "response" from the anti fascist Left. The NF in France does appear to have managed to bury this core anti semitism in its political posturing , to its advantage, but I assume (with no direct knowledge whether this is so) that the higher echelons of the NF are still saturated with all the old anti Semitic stuff.
malatesta32
Not Serb. No, Really!
briefly, ayatollah, i still think visibility is key to prejudice on the far right. most jews are assimilated in the UK, the more obvious/orthodox have a tiny presence in all but a few places, golders green (obviously!), manchester etc whereas the 'everyday racist' can see the asian community and focus their resentment on them. this is on the microscale but on a macroscale the zog thing - which is bizarrely contradictory (jewish communism & capitalism???) is still held onto by hardcore but obscure to many.
You are obviously correct , Malatesta, that for the general grass roots supporter of populist Far Right movements , it is the most visible "outsider group" that the movement will focus on in its "building on prejudice" campaigns --- can be Asians, blacks, Gypsies, Poles. Gays, etc, etc. For fascism as a long term movement with a coherent world view, an ideology, however, all these short term prejudice-based campaigns tend (or have done since the ideological hegemony of German anti semitic Nazism in the late 1930's) to revolve around the "core" world villain concept of the "World Jewish Conspiracy.
Thus fascists may campaign against black communities, black immigration - but once the casual bigot is drawn into the movement it is made clear that it is World Jewry which has imported blacks (Muslims, etc. etc) into the West to "mongrelise the White Race" (The Jewish "race" keeping itself "pure" in contrast). The "plot" of "World Jewry" against ther "White Race" is seen as the permanent core dynamic of history, far more significant than the economic features of "Communism" or "Capitalism" - both of which are seen merely as fig leaves for Jewish control - hence no ideological problem for fascism as seeing the Jewish commissar in the Kremlin and the Jewish banker as allies in the trans historical racial struggle of Jew against the White Race. It's such a different frame of reference to that of the Socialist Left, that it is actually often hard to grasp how fundamentally different the true fascist viewpoint is from ours. The ideology seems obscure to us, and the average bigot too - but it IS a coherent and powerful ideology, that in periods of crisis , like now, provides disgruntled citizens with a world view which APPEARS to explain things like the banking crisis, the perceived threat to white communities presented by multiculturalism, Britain's failing status in the world,the failure of the major political parties to deal with the concerns of unemployed or simply frightened white people. etc. So I wouldn't dismiss anti semitic fascist ideology as some obscurantist hangover from the past - it is still a potentially powerful and dangerous counter ideology to that of radical Socialism in a economic and social crisis.
Thus fascists may campaign against black communities, black immigration - but once the casual bigot is drawn into the movement it is made clear that it is World Jewry which has imported blacks (Muslims, etc. etc) into the West to "mongrelise the White Race" (The Jewish "race" keeping itself "pure" in contrast). The "plot" of "World Jewry" against ther "White Race" is seen as the permanent core dynamic of history, far more significant than the economic features of "Communism" or "Capitalism" - both of which are seen merely as fig leaves for Jewish control - hence no ideological problem for fascism as seeing the Jewish commissar in the Kremlin and the Jewish banker as allies in the trans historical racial struggle of Jew against the White Race. It's such a different frame of reference to that of the Socialist Left, that it is actually often hard to grasp how fundamentally different the true fascist viewpoint is from ours. The ideology seems obscure to us, and the average bigot too - but it IS a coherent and powerful ideology, that in periods of crisis , like now, provides disgruntled citizens with a world view which APPEARS to explain things like the banking crisis, the perceived threat to white communities presented by multiculturalism, Britain's failing status in the world,the failure of the major political parties to deal with the concerns of unemployed or simply frightened white people. etc. So I wouldn't dismiss anti semitic fascist ideology as some obscurantist hangover from the past - it is still a potentially powerful and dangerous counter ideology to that of radical Socialism in a economic and social crisis.
Fedayn
Well-Known Member
Not read it but Baron is a loathsome racist scumbag with very clear links to the far-right
Red Storm
M14
From the bit of googleing it looked that way. I was unsure because it was published under Anglo-Hebrew publishers.
love detective
there's no love too small
it's not a book, it's like a 10 page pamphlet that makes your eyes bleed
Baron's a complete nutter.
Red Storm
M14
I can confirm this is true.
Deareg
Well-Known Member
It just felt like a book.
I thought red action had some folk in it who were very sympathetic to the republican cause?
Deareg
Well-Known Member
Might not be fake, join or support? Red Action did produce stickers with a slogan along those lines, can't remember the exact wording.
Why did you think it was a fake?
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
i think ultimately in britain that's a dead ideology as there are so few jews in britain.
i'd disagree with the assessment of scumfront as irrelevant, agree re: in britain but not so much in other countries, america especially.
Deareg
Well-Known Member
If it said 'join' then it probably was fake.
Fair enough.
From experience there is actually shit loads of anti semitism amongst Muslims.
love detective
there's no love too small
it said join red action
Red Storm
M14
It looked fake. Looked like the top of a real RA sticker with text put beneath it. Text looked wrong. Had a sillouet (sp? On my phone) of a person with a gun on it. It wasn't an image either, you could highlight the text which shouldn't happen of it was an image, should it?
It did say join too.
Beneath the sticker was some factually incorrect information about an RA convicted of Republican terrorism too.
It did say join too.
Beneath the sticker was some factually incorrect information about an RA convicted of Republican terrorism too.
Red Storm
M14
Ah so they've removed 'Red Action' and put 'IRA'?
love detective
there's no love too small
it says join red action though, not join the IRA
Deareg
Well-Known Member
My mind must be playing tricks on me because that is more or less the sticker that I thought I remembered.
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