Barbie vs Oppenheimer

[Mrs Miggins]

Can you hear what the actors are saying though dessiato ?

 

[Knotted]

Politically speaking Barbie looks more grown up.

 

[Gromit]

It comes across as good as you can get from a corporate product.

It does directly criticise Mattel but it also softens that criticism by most portraying the company as a cartoon version of itself in positive and negative ways.


It's hard to describe without getting into spoilers.

Mattel is aware of the historical criticism.
The movie is a chance to persuade the world that they're going to be good from now on as well as income diversification.

They've been trying for a while but feminism had continued to bear grudges.
They're trying to get on their side by admitting that hey feminists we hear you, we were dicks, we didn't realise, sorry, we're self aware now, we can change.

Whether the 'we want to be good' message is genuine or cynical business plan...

Whether or not the motive is pure I think they've pulled off a masterpiece of social manipulation.

 

[Petcha]

Mattel is aware of the historical criticism.
The movie is a chance to persuade the world that they're going to be good from now on as well as income diversification.

They've been trying for a while but feminism had continued to bear grudges.
They're trying to get on their side by admitting that hey feminists we hear you, we were dicks, we didn't realise, sorry, we're self aware now, we can change.

Whether the 'we want to be good' message is genuine or cynical business plan...

Whether or not the motive is pure I think they've pulled off a masterpiece of social manipulation.

Agreed. The film itself was so-so but if there was an Oscar for marketing/PR when they'd absolutely nail that. Millions of people actually paying to watch what is essentially an advert.

 

[pinkmonkey]

Saw Barbie earlier. Thought they hit it right out of the park. Lots of very funny lines and I wanted to stand up and cheer after the America Ferrera 'deprogramming' speech.

Can't help but wonder what Mattel thought of it all. (Yes, they probably sold more dolls as a result of the publicity but it's not exactly positive about them )

Eta

Spoiler

And Jeez, men 'impressing' you with their guitar playing, coming out with a load of old bollocks about The Godfather and explaining how to do software stuff. Gerwig's obviously been there, done that, got the t-shirt too.

I’ve freelanced directly for Mattel on Barbie before, designing some pretty out-there fashion to go in their style guide - the style guide goes to companies who have the license and they are bound to using the graphics and design suggestions in a certain way and it's pretty strict. You should see their resin boardroom table which is full of Barbie shoes. I've also worked as an employee for a company who had the license- I still have friends who work for them, they get it. I also freelanced for a company who had the license for Hello Kitty, Sanrios German head office felt like a Japanese investment bank. Everyone who worked there was dour, suited and booted. We sat in the boardroom in silence whilst they used a Hello Kitty coffee machine and poured out coffee into Hello Kitty cups. There will never be a Hello Kitty film like the Barbie one.

 

[dessiato]

Can you hear what the actors are saying though dessiato ?

Yes. But if the cinema you go to is anything like Parkway in Cleethorpes you'll need ear protection.

 

[Mrs Miggins]

Yes. But if the cinema you go to is anything like Parkway in Cleethorpes you'll need ear protection.

I'm going to the iMax so it's probably going to be quite loud!

 

[girasol]

I survived the Barbie-Oppenheimer double bill and I don’t recommend it | Stuart Heritage

The internet has become transfixed with the idea of watching Greta Gerwig’s bubblegum comedy next to Christopher Nolan’s dark drama but it proved to be a nightmarish combo

www.theguardian.com

I mean, watching them on the same day is a bit much! I couldn't take it...

 

[krtek a houby]

I survived the Barbie-Oppenheimer double bill and I don’t recommend it | Stuart Heritage

The internet has become transfixed with the idea of watching Greta Gerwig’s bubblegum comedy next to Christopher Nolan’s dark drama but it proved to be a nightmarish combo

www.theguardian.com

I mean, watching them on the same day is a bit much! I couldn't take it...

Reminds of an old local that had a cinema night that the double bill showed Airplane and United 93!

 

[Shippou-Sensei]

Reminds of an old local that had a cinema night that the double bill showed Airplane and United 93!

Maybe they should have done zero hour instead

 

[chilango]

Just back in from seeing Barbie.

I thought it was great.

Sure, it is an often incoherent (both in form and function) and inconsistent mess, but it chock full of slap in the face one liners. Given the film's reach and audience even a few of those hitting home is a win.

I can see why the far-right hate it.

 

[baldrick]

Also just back in from seeing Barbie

Not earth shattering or anything, but really good fun. And the number of people with 15 second cameos where you think "Oh! It's him!"

Very enjoyable I thought

 

[Orang Utan]

I survived the Barbie-Oppenheimer double bill and I don’t recommend it | Stuart Heritage

The internet has become transfixed with the idea of watching Greta Gerwig’s bubblegum comedy next to Christopher Nolan’s dark drama but it proved to be a nightmarish combo

www.theguardian.com

I mean, watching them on the same day is a bit much! I couldn't take it...

I don’t get why it would be an issue.
Would probably watch the Barbie after the Oppenheimer if I was doing a double. Like main course followed by pudding

 

[newme]

I don’t get why it would be an issue.
Would probably watch the Barbie after the Oppenheimer if I was doing a double. Like main course followed by pudding

People have to produce copy to get it published, complaining about something gets clicks.

 

[Johnny Vodka]

Now I want to see it.

 

[Sue]

Now I want to see it.

View attachment 384349

Apparently the Mail didn't like it either so y'know...

 

[Orang Utan]

Now I want to see it.

View attachment 384349

 

[MrCurry]

Just home from watching Barbie and I have to agree with Ben Shapiro (about the wokeness at least), which not something I’m comfortable saying! Woke it may be, but visually it’s pretty amazing.

Was thought provoking at times, but I wonder what kids who see this movie will make of the message which seems to veer a little bit too far towards “men are idiots“ for my liking, but there was at least one male character, Alan, who wasn’t portrayed as toxic and brainless, so I guess that’s balance.

Overall, worth a watch I think, but didn’t wow me in the way all the hype led me to expect. But that’s the movies for you, I guess.

 

[Dom Traynor]

Just home from watching Barbie and I have to agree with Ben Shapiro (about the wokeness at least), which not something I’m comfortable saying! Woke it may be, but visually it’s pretty amazing.

Was thought provoking at times, but I wonder what kids who see this movie will make of the message which seems to veer a little bit too far towards “men are idiots“ for my liking, but there was at least one male character, Alan, who wasn’t portrayed as toxic and brainless, so I guess that’s balance.

Overall, worth a watch I think, but didn’t wow me in the way all the hype led me to expect. But that’s the movies for you, I guess.

What is wokeness to you? Why is a narrative in which men are mainly portrayed as idiots woke?

 

[moomoo]

Barbie was great! We loved that half of Sex Education were in it. It was super fun and most of it went over the 10 year old boys head and he just chuckled a lot.

 

[Sue]

Just home from watching Barbie and I have to agree with Ben Shapiro (about the wokeness at least), which not something I’m comfortable saying! Woke it may be, but visually it’s pretty amazing.

I'm interested to know what you mean by 'woke'.

Was thought provoking at times, but I wonder what kids who see this movie will make of the message which seems to veer a little bit too far towards “men are idiots“ for my liking, but there was at least one male character, Alan, who wasn’t portrayed as toxic and brainless, so I guess that’s balance.

Interesting. Do you think this ever happens the other way round and, if so, what do you wonder about that?

 

[belboid]

it’s no Lego Movie, but Barbie was fucking funny in places. The Stephen Malkmus line made me laugh loudest, for being absolutely spot on as well as its unexpectedness. Well balanced between anti-Mattel cynicism and live of the product.

And Rob B Ken was actually a real Ken doll from 2009

 

[MrCurry]

I'm interested to know what you mean by 'woke'.


Interesting. Do you think this ever happens the other way round and, if so, what do you wonder about that?

I have no doubt it happens the other way around too and I would wonder equally how unhealthy it might be for kids to see negative images of women in those cases.

Woke I don’t know if I have a great definition for. Probably it is a word that has different inferences for people depending on their politics and I don’t mean it as a criticism of the movie, but it is nonetheless noticeable how even handedly the casting of the barbie and Ken “multiples” as they are called in the movie are distributed among black, white and Asian actors, plus the whole concept of gender politics and feminism around which the theme of the movie revolves does appear to be within the realm the umbrella term woke refers to.

In case you suspect me of sneaking misogyny, I do not use the word ”woke” as some kind of swearword to imply the movie is politically wrong. Having googled for clarification it seems it was coined by US conservatives or at least seized upon and dragged away from the original meaning of being aware of injustice.

 

[girasol]

I don’t get why it would be an issue.
Would probably watch the Barbie after the Oppenheimer if I was doing a double. Like main course followed by pudding

Some people need to digest/process what they watch before moving on to the next thing? I certainly do. It would feel a bit odd to watch something cheerful/uplifting after watching something traumatising. Even when I'm watching something at home - if I watch something particularly dense or thought provoking/traumatic I can't just move on to the next thing without decompressing.

Similarly, if I watched Barbie first then moved to Oppenheimer, all the uplift from Barbie would be dissipated, gone and forgotten. What a waste!

I mean, that's literally what he said in the article, so if you didn't get that then you won't get my explanation either

 

[smmudge]

Was thought provoking at times, but I wonder what kids who see this movie will make of the message which seems to veer a little bit too far towards “men are idiots“ for my liking, but there was at least one male character, Alan, who wasn’t portrayed as toxic and brainless, so I guess that’s balance.

Er yeah I don't think the portrayal of all the men as idiots, brainless, toxic or incidental side character was a "near miss". It was completely intended and basically the entire point of the film, which seems to have passed you by somewhat.

 

[MrCurry]

Er yeah I don't think the portrayal of all the men as idiots, brainless, toxic or incidental side character was a "near miss". It was completely intended and basically the entire point of the film, which seems to have passed you by somewhat.

No, I don’t think it passed me by. I think I noticed it and commented.

 

[ruffneck23]

 

[Gromit]

Er yeah I don't think the portrayal of all the men as idiots, brainless, toxic or incidental side character was a "near miss". It was completely intended and basically the entire point of the film, which seems to have passed you by somewhat.

I'd just like to point out that Barbie, Ken and Alan are dolls. Not men or women.
Dolls in alternate universe that did not 100% inverse mirror the real world but was an inverse of sorts.

Basically the entire point of the film that seems to be passing by everyone.

Spoiler

Ken's entire understanding of the patriarchy was flawed. He thought horses was an integral part.

 

[Shippou-Sensei]

Nevermind was just repeating myself

 

[Sue]

I have no doubt it happens the other way around too and I would wonder equally how unhealthy it might be for kids to see negative images of women in those cases.

Woke I don’t know if I have a great definition for. Probably it is a word that has different inferences for people depending on their politics and I don’t mean it as a criticism of the movie, but it is nonetheless noticeable how even handedly the casting of the barbie and Ken “multiples” as they are called in the movie are distributed among black, white and Asian actors, plus the whole concept of gender politics and feminism around which the theme of the movie revolves does appear to be within the realm the umbrella term woke refers to.

Those are good things though, surely? Yet here you seem to use it as a criticism (and Ben Shapiro certainly was):

Just home from watching Barbie and I have to agree with Ben Shapiro (about the wokeness at least), which not something I’m comfortable saying! Woke it may be, but visually it’s pretty amazing.

Probably best to stick to words you know the meaning of really:

In case you suspect me of sneaking misogyny, I do not use the word ”woke” as some kind of swearword to imply the movie is politically wrong. Having googled for clarification it seems it was coined by US conservatives or at least seized upon and dragged away from the original meaning of being aware of injustice.

This might make interesting listening though BBC Sounds - Woke: The Journey of a Word - Available Episodes