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Are we really going to sit by while they destroy the NHS?

Thats fuckin shocking. And why it sticks in my craw when I hear politicians saying how hard they work. Dr Woodall is properly working hard and doing the most important jobs, when he is worried, we all should be worried.

Quotes:

15 mins downtime in 12 hr continuous working.

End of shift 0001, should be standby for 9 hours, but told as no GP to cover population of 70,000 in neighbouring area, would need to prepare for callout

Back to me, and a tangent:

When we spend the weekend glorifying how well the richest woman in the country has done it annoys me that she is unwilling to put her hand in her pocket and make a difference to this rapidly worsening situation that her subjects are facing
 
From the Guardian


Charge patients for hospital stays to help fund NHS, says report​

Health experts warn move would ‘depart from founding principles of a tax-funded public service’

Denis Campbell Health policy editor
Sun 24 Jul 2022 18.00 BST


Patients would be charged £8 a day when in hospital under proposals from a former health service boss to raise more money for the NHS.
Prof Stephen Smith is also urging ministers to bring in charges of £4 to £8 to help cover the costs of medical equipment that patients need, such as hearing aids and walking devices.

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People over 60 should also start paying for their prescriptions, to help raise more revenue for an underfunded NHS that is under “unsustainable” pressure from rising demand, said Smith.
Rising public dissatisfaction with the health service and patients’ unprecedented waits for GP care, ambulances and routine operations mean ministers need to urgently instigate a review of how the NHS is funded, which should include the creation of “co-payments” for some services.
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Smith, the former chair of the East Kent acute hospital trust, has set out his ideas in a new book published by the thinktank RadixUK. Its trustees include the ex-Conservative health secretary Andrew Lansley and the Labour MP Stephen Kinnock.
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“I think the public would be prepared to pay some additional charges,” said Smith, who has also served on the boards of the Great Ormond Street and Imperial College Healthcare NHS trusts in London. Means-testing would ensure the poor were not affected unfairly, he added.
People should pay a fee of £8 for every day they are in hospital receiving medical care or undergoing rehabilitation, up to a maximum of 28 days a year, added Smith, who said his idea was based on the system in Germany, where patients are charged €10 a night.
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More money could also be raised for the NHS through financial penalties for abusing the NHS by repeatedly missing appointments, a hypothecated tax to bring in extra income for the NHS and social care, and tax breaks for high earners who take out private medical insurance.
However, Dr John Puntis, the co-chair of the campaign group Keep Our NHS Public, accused Smith of advancing “harebrained ideas” and “zombie policies” which would end the basis on which the service has operated since its creation in 1948, including that it is paid for by general taxation.
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“Charging people to cover part of the cost of a hospital stay would be a fundamental departure from the founding principles of the NHS and show that the longstanding consensus on a tax-funded public service model of healthcare has been truly abandoned,” said Puntis.
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The government should instead generate more money for the NHS through capital gains tax, corporation tax and taxing private wealth, financial speculation and tax-dodging, he added.
Smith’s ideas come days after the head of the Royal College of GPs warned that family doctor services are under such strain that patients may have to start paying for them, in the same way that most already pay to see a dentist.
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So a week's statutory sick pay is what, under 100? And over half of that has just gone on this new 'needing medical care' tax. Fuck.
 
Although tbh, fuck the guardian for even plugging this think tank bullshit. The story here is basically person paid to say 'lets fuck the NHS to death' says, 'let's fuck the NHS to death'.
 
Profits is just what got us into this mess.

Agency staff, touted as a super way to have all the staff that could ever be dreamed of, all ready to go at just a phonecall, workers would have a fine choice of better paid roles. Turns out that putting more layers of management into labour supply only makes money for the agencies and fucks up existing workers.
 
Chilli.s said:
Profits is just what got us into this mess.

Agency staff, touted as a super way to have all the staff that could ever be dreamed of, all ready to go at just a phonecall, workers would have a fine choice of better paid roles. Turns out that putting more layers of management into labour supply only makes money for the agencies and fucks up existing workers.
Click to expand...

“If we under pay permanent staff and over pay consultants or emergency staff to cover absolutely nothing will go wrong”

Unsurprisingly that just means all your perm staff quit to do temp roles elsewhere. Especially when your not investing in training or giving them good working conditions
 
Artaxerxes said:
“If we under pay permanent staff and over pay consultants or emergency staff to cover absolutely nothing will go wrong”

Unsurprisingly that just means all your perm staff quit to do temp roles elsewhere. Especially when your not investing in training or giving them good working conditions
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Yeah, its those misty eyed management theories that seem to include the all unions are bad idea too. Wasnt it Thatcher that sold this crock of shyte to us all
 
Added into the mix now is the huge over seas nursing programme. Those nurses are being absolutely shafted- it's like Windrush all over again.

They are promised wondrous opportunities here in the UK but the reality is that a lot of them are working at an unregistered band 4 pay while waiting to tale and pass their OSCES that allows them a registration pin and to have a band 5 wage.

Certainly in Bristol They are struggling to find affordable places to live and general competition for housing + racism means they are unable to bring their children/ partners over, as they start off in a room in a HMO.

It's all well and good to invite people from other countries over to increase the NHS staffing levels...but you have to provide some kind of infrastructure.


It's just fucked.
 
The nurses no longer care because they can't afford to care or even engage with the sheer workload, bad working conditions and lord knows what else.
However when a person is screaming out in pain and none of the staff care, it really does turn your stomach.
Triple the waiting time for sick patients to be seen, insane waiting times and constant cancellations are the norm. 13 hours is usually the bare minimum wait time.

if I could afford private, I think I would sadly. The Tories therefore win.

We are such a weak willed country, no wonder they take the mick out of public services and key workers, etc.
 
Thistlewaite said:
The nurses no longer care because they can't afford to care or even engage with the sheer workload, bad working conditions and lord knows what else.
However when a person is screaming out in pain and none of the staff care, it really does turn your stomach.
Triple the waiting time for sick patients to be seen, insane waiting times and constant cancellations are the norm. 13 hours is usually the bare minimum wait time.

if I could afford private, I think I would sadly. The Tories therefore win.

We are such a weak willed country, no wonder they take the mick out of public services and key workers, etc.
Click to expand...
Sorry you have had a shit experience.
I care and my colleagues care.

All going private ensures is that you are treated quickly.

The UK is short-staffed in healthcare and going private does not change that. Most of the NHS nurses I work with also do agency shifts and work at private hospitals.

There are certain surgical procedures such as Radical Laparascopic prosectomy that require specialist equipment that only the NHS hospital has, meaning that private patients come to an NHS hospital and are treated by NHS staff.

Yes it's completely broken and recruiting is not the issue it's retaining staff that is the problem.

You are absolutely bang on regarding waiting times.

Yesterday it was me (unregistered) and two nurses looking after two theatre lists, that's admission and recovery. Shoulders, hip replacements and knee replacements. Only one patient got moved on to a ward. The other in patients had to stay with us, we had to continue caring for them whilst still receiving patients with an airway from theatre (so can not leave them till its out). Luckily we had a few daycases who were discharged.

Also helping is relatives being allowed in again as they help ease the patients in most cases.

But absolutely shocking that anyone should be left in pain and I hope you have complained! Please complain.
 
kalidarkone said:
Sorry you have had a shit experience.
I care and my colleagues care.

All going private ensures is that you are treated quickly.

The UK is short-staffed in healthcare and going private does not change that. Most of the NHS nurses I work with also do agency shifts and work at private hospitals.

There are certain surgical procedures such as Radical Laparascopic prosectomy that require specialist equipment that only the NHS hospital has, meaning that private patients come to an NHS hospital and are treated by NHS staff.

Yes it's completely broken and recruiting is not the issue it's retaining staff that is the problem.

You are absolutely bang on regarding waiting times.

Yesterday it was me (unregistered) and two nurses looking after two theatre lists, that's admission and recovery. Shoulders, hip replacements and knee replacements. Only one patient got moved on to a ward. The other in patients had to stay with us, we had to continue caring for them whilst still receiving patients with an airway from theatre (so can not leave them till its out). Luckily we had a few daycases who were discharged.

Also helping is relatives being allowed in again as they help ease the patients in most cases.

But absolutely shocking that anyone should be left in pain and I hope you have complained! Please complain.
Click to expand...
Hey there.

First of all, may I say what a thoughtful and well explained post this was.

Sadly, it was a negative experience because the nurses were so overworked they had no time to really "care."
As for the man in complete pain, I imagine he did complain. i hope he did anyway.

Yes, I am aware about the private care sectors flaws because of a television drama called "This Is Going To Hurt." However the only reason i would want private is literally for the waiting time. I expect a 4 - 5 hour wait but over 12 hours to be treated is horrendous.

Respect to all you do for the country and under such difficulties too, I can relate somewhat. Sorry if I sound hypocritical but I do respect the NHS and all staff that work there on principle but I am terrified of being ill because they wouldn't be able to see me or care for me at all. I'm also scared for my family becoming ill as no one would really care if they were left in the waiting room for (non ward) for over 12 hours, suffering. Worst case scenario is death due to not being seen. That is literally my lasting impression of the NHS now.
 
Thistlewaite said:
Hey there.

First of all, may I say what a thoughtful and well explained post this was.

Sadly, it was a negative experience because the nurses were so overworked they had no time to really "care."
As for the man in complete pain, I imagine he did complain. i hope he did anyway.

Yes, I am aware about the private care sectors flaws because of a television drama called "This Is Going To Hurt." However the only reason i would want private is literally for the waiting time. I expect a 4 - 5 hour wait but over 12 hours to be treated is horrendous.

Respect to all you do for the country and under such difficulties too, I can relate somewhat. Sorry if I sound hypocritical but I do respect the NHS and all staff that work there on principle but I am terrified of being ill because they wouldn't be able to see me or care for me at all. I'm also scared for my family becoming ill as no one would really care if they were left in the waiting room for (non ward) for over 12 hours, suffering. Worst case scenario is death due to not being seen. That is literally my lasting impression of the NHS now.
Click to expand...
I never thought in a million years I would say this.....but if I had the means and needed urgent healthcare then I would 100 % go private in order to bypass the flawed appointment system within primary and acute care.

I am really aware of the lack of basic communication with patients next of kin and for this reason I make it my business ( despite it not strictly being my job, but AFAIK it comes under the remit of patient care and advocating for the patient and their interests) so for example when I know patients are waiting in reception, but we have no room for them I let them know and keep them updated on where they are on the surgery list how longs it's going to be, if anything changes. And I always ask them if there is anyone they want me to call to let them know know that they are out of theatre.

Despite staff shortages and volume of patients basic pastoral care should be in place. It's not hard to do.
 
kalidarkone said:
I never thought in a million years I would say this.....but if I had the means and needed urgent healthcare then I would 100 % go private in order to bypass the flawed appointment system within primary and acute care.

I am really aware of the lack of basic communication with patients next of kin and for this reason I make it my business ( despite it not strictly being my job, but AFAIK it comes under the remit of patient care and advocating for the patient and their interests) so for example when I know patients are waiting in reception, but we have no room for them I let them know and keep them updated on where they are on the surgery list how longs it's going to be, if anything changes. And I always ask them if there is anyone they want me to call to let them know know that they are out of theatre.

Despite staff shortages and volume of patients basic pastoral care should be in place. It's not hard to do.
Click to expand...
Bless you.

You know something, it was awful to wait iver half a day but basic communication and pastoral comfort would have made a huge impression on me. Please remember that as patients, I assure you IT MEANS SO MUCH.
Keep being utterly amazing.

I felt like cattle or like I was at the vets waiting to be diagnosed then put down.
 
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