...and Yemen!
- Thread starter chilango
- Start date
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
The parallels are there; the Houthi's still operate as the de-facto government of most of populated Yemen and the Red sea coast despite constant Saudi bombardment for 8 years.
klang
klang
Part of me thinks that naivety is at play here...along the lines of 'hell, we got this far, we have taken over a country, we have the artlillery....lets cause a bit of havoc and get involved in international politices, why not?'
Lol, i dunno though
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
Yeah, pretty clear to see how the de-facto state might feel that emboldened, especially with friends with the kit.
klang
klang
Saudi isn't the first power to test yemen and to fail miserably. Attempts stretch back all the way to the otoman empire.
agricola
a genuine importer of owls
Fortunately there is a convergence in Israeli politics at present that sees the person most responsible for this horror happening, the person most responsible for the political chaos in Israel over the past few years and the person most responsible for the ongoing massacres of Palestinians being the same person.
Everything would be vastly better for everyone involved if he was removed - even when he is not personally to blame for some things, he inevitably makes those things worse.
Humberto
dreamin man
So an escalation or widening. Who is the party to blame for that?
They don't learn. They think they can blunder around wherever they like, causing destruction and misery and take no responsibilty for the consequences.
Political leaders can change course, they just choose not to because of their own shortcomings and weakness.
It's the 'Israel has the right to defend itself' line, apparently Arabs don't have that right in their view. They only have base motivations.
They rarely speak for me and they don't here. People told them that there would be consequences. But they knew better they thought.
They don't learn. They think they can blunder around wherever they like, causing destruction and misery and take no responsibilty for the consequences.
Political leaders can change course, they just choose not to because of their own shortcomings and weakness.
It's the 'Israel has the right to defend itself' line, apparently Arabs don't have that right in their view. They only have base motivations.
They rarely speak for me and they don't here. People told them that there would be consequences. But they knew better they thought.
klang
klang
A big turning point for yemen happened in November 1990 when yemen by chance held a guest seat on the UN security council.
Yemen rejected a proposal on allowing iraq to withdraw from Kuwait within 15 days or face military action.
Only 2 nations voted against it, cuba and yemen.
The usa and the world bank issued a joint statement, stating that this was 'yemens most expensive mistake in history' and swiftly haulted all foreign aid to yemen, whilst systematically de-valuing the yemeni rial.
Saudi arabia vowed to 'keep yemen weak' and expelled over one million yemeni migrant workers at less than a months notice.
Prior to this event us aid and remmitance from yemeni labourers in saudi arabia made up a good 50% of yemens gdp.
The impact of this is still incredibly devastating.
The political leaders have held a very straight line wrt this agreement.
Their actions are not shaped by their weaknesses and shortcomings, but by a need to suppress dissident.
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The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
Not part of the be greater good of humanity though as they support the Palestinians
teqniq
DisMembered
They have had huge Palestine solidarity demonstrations too.
klang
klang
One million means every 20th man, woman and child in yemen is taking part in a protest.
Considering that mainly adult men participate in demos, one in 7 or 8 men would have been participating.
Without wanting to dismiss the individual's voice on the street, the sheer volume of demos in Sana'a is often linked to the tribes and tribal alliances. Their reach is huge and it can't be underestimated how efficiently and quickly they can mobilise.
Eg - the early days of the arab spring started as a very grassroots movement, with students and other activists occupying universities and town squares, squatting with tents, resisting arrest and intimidation.
As the movement grew and could not be scared away, it soon became clear that this had turned into a serious thread to salehs rule, so snipers and hitmen were emloyed to crush the protests of a few thousand activists.
Saleh's grip on power still got weaker by the day, and eventually his very own tribal alliance, the Hashid, turned against him, vowing to oust him. Overnight the demos in Sana'a grew to hundreds of thousands tribesmen marching together with students, activists, freedom fighters, and feminists.
It didn't look too different to the pic topcat posted above, only that there were no houthi flags seen at the time.
Disclaimer - of course i don't know how much the tribes mobilised for the demos held over the last few days....each and every individual person marching has their very own set of reasons for doung so.
klang
klang
The question still remains what is there to hit....
I think destroying supply lines and communication facilities will have the biggest impact. Houthis are nestled away in the mountains, and need to transport heavy artillery. They rely on a 'network' of about 5 or 6 paved roads connecting the various cities. The most important 2 roads are probably Sana'a - Hodeida and Sada - Sana'a - Taiz - Aden.
Destructing these lines would have a massive impact on the houthi's capabilities to attack shipping.
The vast majority of the country can only be reached by small 4x4s, foot, or camel.
However, these roads are also a life line for ordinary people as they not only allow fast travel, but are also essential for the distribution of aid, which millions of yemenis came to rely on.
Targetting houthi's capabilities will inevitably cause suffering amongst the civilian population, even if they were spared from direct hits.
Larry O'Hara
Well-Known Member
You’re joking arent you? Its f..ing cold in Gaza too and they have no readily available food or fuelThe shipping lanes must remain clear of threat for the greater good of humanity. It is a cold winter. Heating oil must be readily available. I support the decision of the world's two greatest navies to repulse attacks on neutral shipping
What kind of weapons are the US and UK using to strike Yemen’s Houthis?
Here’s what we know about the weapons and military hardware employed by the US and the UK on their strikes on Yemen.www.yahoo.com
hitmouse
music obfuscation technology
Thanks to klang for your posts on this thread, they've been really helpful. Do you have anything you'd recommend as being a good, short, accessible piece of background on the houthis and their history to share? I've already been seeing a bit of daft cheerleading for them from people who probably wouldn't have been able to find Yemen on a map last week (thinking of elsewhere, not on here), and sure that's only going to intensify.
teqniq
DisMembered
If you search the thread there's a lot more info with links to be found. I've certainly posted some but klang has much more in-depth knowledge
klang
klang
Not really, sorry. I wouldn't know where to start, if looking for bite size. There is a very long and complex history behind the rise of the houthis....it is very important to understand the saleh years since the unification in 1990 to make any sort of sense of where we are now.
That was my approach, anyway.
I'm sure there will be a lot new essays, blogs and thoughts on the subject popping up over the next few weeks and months, now that the houthis have morphed from an obscure mountain tribe into a guerilla force impacting on international politics.
I will share links if i come across anything of value, and i hope others will do the same.
In the meantime i can recommend this book as a very good introduction to the saleh years up to just before the arab spring:
klang
klang
Yes this thread is a pretty good recourse for compiled random links
Brian Whitaker's blog may be useful for background information on Yemen though I don't think it's really being updated any more.
Yemen
News reports and articles Latest news about Yemen A compilation from multiple sources Brian Whitaker's blog posts and other articles about Yemen Online news sources for Yemen
al-bab.com
klang
klang
From the link:Brian Whitaker's blog may be useful for background information on Yemen though I don't think it's really being updated any more.
Yemen
News reports and articles Latest news about Yemen A compilation from multiple sources Brian Whitaker's blog posts and other articles about Yemen Online news sources for Yemen
The Houthi rebellion
In 2014, Houthi rebels from the far north of Yemen, backed by supporters of ousted president Ali Abdullah Saleh, over-ran the capital, Sanaa. Saleh's sucessor, President Abd Rabbuh Mansur Hadi, fled to the southern city of Aden and later to Saudi Arabia as the Houthi/Saleh alliance rapidly...
al-bab.com
I'm sure that's a good book, but unfortunately it's price is just offensive to me.
klang
klang
A history of modern Yemen : Dresch, Paul : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive
xviii, 285 p. : 24 cm
archive.org
bcuster
Well-Known Member
Then the Houthi should attack Israel’s ships, not neutrals…
klang
klang
Again:
The rise of the houthis and their military capabilities does not come out of nowhere, but is a consequence of a century old western attitude towards yemen and the wider middle east.
It comes at a direct result of two world wars, imperialism, the more recent conflicts in the ME, racism, institutional anti semitism, short sighted politics, globalisation, surpression, divide-and-rule tactics, colonialism, and countless other factors.
One doesn't have to be an expert in middle eastern politics to realise that the houthis were not an inevitability and they weren't wished for by the yemeni people.
The dangers of the west's meddlings in yemen have been discussed and warned against by academics, activists, scholars, artists and small folk all over the world, but most importantly, yemenis themselves have been expressing very clear opinions on their grievances and where their country should head to.....only to be ignored and shat on, bombed and starved to death.
For the record - i don't think the houthis should be bombing anything, israeli or not.
But i realise that groups like the houthis exist and strive in places that experience crisis.
Yemen experiences the deepest crisis in its millenia old history.
It is a country on the brink of famine, is crippled by avoidable diseases like cholera, is running out of drinking water, has no functioning infrastructure nor government, and experiences a very reach culturel heritage being destroyed in front of its eyes.
The houthis don't present an answer to yemens problems, but they fill a vacuum, an avoidable vacuum created by wetern policies.
To say 'the houthis should be bombing this but not that' is naive and patronising at best, and plays into the hands of the houthis at worst.
Larry O'Hara
Well-Known Member
The US and UK for sure are not neutrals: or if they were, would also be launching strikes on the IDF to prevent genocide. Now there’s a thought
klang
klang
Been thinking similar.
At least in the eyes of the houthis there are no neutrals.
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