And next, Syria?
- Thread starter Idris2002
- Start date
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
...and we're off. Now we get Iraq late 2003 scenario added to the mix.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Wasn't sure where to put this:
Syria: the frontbench’s silence over Ghouta shames the Labour Party
Why is Labour’s position so bad?
The Labour leadership’s failures on Syria’s can be traced to the legacy of “campist” politics, the hangover of the old Cold War politics in to the 21st century which still sees “the Western camp” as the main enemy, regardless of the actions and imperialist nature of regimes like Russia, and the brutal dictatorship and unbridled neo-liberal capitalism of Assad’s Syria. A whole generation of socialist activists were educated to view the world this way, and its this which informs their position on Syria.
This is apparent when you examine the politics of those advising the frontbench on Syria. In 2015 Corbyn’s main advisor on Syria – who briefed the parliamentary Labour Party before the 2015 vote on intervention – was journalist Patrick Cockburn. Cockburn has made no secret of his regime sympathies, calling openly for the UK military to work with the Assad regime against ISIS. Another culprit is Seumas Milne. Milne is Executive Director of Strategy and Communications for the Labour Party and is well known for his campist politics. Milne is on record as stating focusing on Russian and Syrian regime atrocities in Syria “sometimes diverts attention from other atrocities”. Its hard to imagine similar statements being made about US atrocities in the Vietnam war, or US and UK atrocities in the Iraq war. Both of them, coupled with Stop The War and its troop of pro-Assad commentators have had a malign effect on Labour’s position on Syria.
Any criticism of Labour over its stance on Syria is liable to bring on a deluge of rancorous apologism from soft and hardline Assadists within the Labour Party and the Stop The War movement. It is absolutely necessary though to challenge them on this. Civilians throughout Syria are being subject to attacks which would provoke mass demonstrations if they were inflicted on Palestinians, yet they are met with silence by Britain’s anti-war organisations and ostensibly anti-war politicians. This situation must change.
The Syrian conflict will be as defining an event for the 21st century as the Palestine-Israeli conflict was for the 20th. To have a Labour leadership promulgating what is essentially a pro-regime line is abhorrent and a betrayal of basic anti-war and anti-imperialist principles which the Labour frontbench claim to hold.
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More.
See also:
Labour’s Syria Policy: Now you see it, now you don’t
The policy of Labour’s front bench with regard to the conflict and humanitarian crisis in Syria is a strange thing – most of the time it’s an echoing silence but occasionally it’s punctured by strange statements that those of us who follow the Syrian situation closely, and solidarise with the victims of the Assad dictatorship, struggle to make sense of.
...
These episodes indicate that the Labour front bench not only has a poor grasp of what is taking place in Syria, but that it appears to be dependent on very unreliable sources. They will continue to make these sorts of gaffes if they do not consult more widely on Syria. Again, this is not difficult to do: we have a wealth of expert knowledge on Syria in our Universities; we have active solidarity organisations of the sort who are listened to by Labour when they are linked to causes like Palestine; and we have a network of organisations based in the Syrian community involved in advocacy and humanitarian relief work which gives them a rich insight into the situation on the ground in Syria. To my knowledge the Labour front bench has never spoken to any of these organisations. Why?
Syria: the frontbench’s silence over Ghouta shames the Labour Party
Why is Labour’s position so bad?
The Labour leadership’s failures on Syria’s can be traced to the legacy of “campist” politics, the hangover of the old Cold War politics in to the 21st century which still sees “the Western camp” as the main enemy, regardless of the actions and imperialist nature of regimes like Russia, and the brutal dictatorship and unbridled neo-liberal capitalism of Assad’s Syria. A whole generation of socialist activists were educated to view the world this way, and its this which informs their position on Syria.
This is apparent when you examine the politics of those advising the frontbench on Syria. In 2015 Corbyn’s main advisor on Syria – who briefed the parliamentary Labour Party before the 2015 vote on intervention – was journalist Patrick Cockburn. Cockburn has made no secret of his regime sympathies, calling openly for the UK military to work with the Assad regime against ISIS. Another culprit is Seumas Milne. Milne is Executive Director of Strategy and Communications for the Labour Party and is well known for his campist politics. Milne is on record as stating focusing on Russian and Syrian regime atrocities in Syria “sometimes diverts attention from other atrocities”. Its hard to imagine similar statements being made about US atrocities in the Vietnam war, or US and UK atrocities in the Iraq war. Both of them, coupled with Stop The War and its troop of pro-Assad commentators have had a malign effect on Labour’s position on Syria.
Any criticism of Labour over its stance on Syria is liable to bring on a deluge of rancorous apologism from soft and hardline Assadists within the Labour Party and the Stop The War movement. It is absolutely necessary though to challenge them on this. Civilians throughout Syria are being subject to attacks which would provoke mass demonstrations if they were inflicted on Palestinians, yet they are met with silence by Britain’s anti-war organisations and ostensibly anti-war politicians. This situation must change.
The Syrian conflict will be as defining an event for the 21st century as the Palestine-Israeli conflict was for the 20th. To have a Labour leadership promulgating what is essentially a pro-regime line is abhorrent and a betrayal of basic anti-war and anti-imperialist principles which the Labour frontbench claim to hold.
------
More.
See also:
Labour’s Syria Policy: Now you see it, now you don’t
The policy of Labour’s front bench with regard to the conflict and humanitarian crisis in Syria is a strange thing – most of the time it’s an echoing silence but occasionally it’s punctured by strange statements that those of us who follow the Syrian situation closely, and solidarise with the victims of the Assad dictatorship, struggle to make sense of.
...
These episodes indicate that the Labour front bench not only has a poor grasp of what is taking place in Syria, but that it appears to be dependent on very unreliable sources. They will continue to make these sorts of gaffes if they do not consult more widely on Syria. Again, this is not difficult to do: we have a wealth of expert knowledge on Syria in our Universities; we have active solidarity organisations of the sort who are listened to by Labour when they are linked to causes like Palestine; and we have a network of organisations based in the Syrian community involved in advocacy and humanitarian relief work which gives them a rich insight into the situation on the ground in Syria. To my knowledge the Labour front bench has never spoken to any of these organisations. Why?
teqniq
DisMembered
Jeremiah18.17
Well-Known Member
Is the Clarion an AWL project or does it have influence from other groups?
(Not that I have a knee jerk reaction to the AWL like some do, just interested)
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Incidentally, Tim Hayward - Beeleyite loon and full professor at Edinburgh University tried to get Joey in trouble recently by reporting him to the university authorities for opposing his bullshit about the white helmets. Either to shut him up or get him expelled.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Couldn't tell you tbh - clearly AWL involved and i think it may have grown out of their involvement in momentum. But i don't really follow this sort of labour-momentum-left that closely. Oddly enough, the sort of people involved in that locally are the sort of loons who support assad and are open to 'questioning the holocaust'.
teqniq
DisMembered
In Damascus, Solidarity with Besieged East Ghouta is Dangerous · Global Voices
Meanwhile on Twitter there are more reports of chlorine gas being dropped on Ghouta.
Meanwhile on Twitter there are more reports of chlorine gas being dropped on Ghouta.
teqniq
DisMembered
e2a not is all as it appears but still grim
Image of Syrian boy in desert triggers sympathy – and then a backlash
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rekil
to menny cranks
UN report on rape in Syria.
Thousands of Women, Men, Children Raped in Syria's War: U.N. Report
Full Report pdf
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
The 250 AQ fighters in EG speak
We representatives of institutions, CSOs activists, humanitarian workers, local councils’ members, and media activists announce the formation of a civilian block in East Ghouta to represent the civilians and their will and aspirations in the situation of their absented voice about what is taking place in East Ghouta.
A- To take the necessary measures for immediate cease-fire, to stop the shelling and storming by pro-Assad military forces of villages and towns of Eastern Ghouta, and for the implementation of UN Security Council Resolution 2401 through immediate, negotiated and peaceful manner, especially after several initiatives were put forward by the people of the eastern Ghouta to expel Jabhat Al Nusra and resume peace talks in Geneva.
C- That civilians in Eastern Ghouta – represented by the Provincial Council, Local Councils and civil society organizations – should become a negotiating partner in all negotiations and settlements related to East Ghouta discussed by national, international or local actors, and that they decide their own fate and that they are provided with all the support to do that.
F- That there be sufficient international pressure, by all means, to compel the regime and its allies, especially the Russian Federation, to lift the siege on Eastern Ghouta and open humanitarian crossings, and stop the systematic starvation practiced by the Syrian regime against civilians.
We representatives of institutions, CSOs activists, humanitarian workers, local councils’ members, and media activists announce the formation of a civilian block in East Ghouta to represent the civilians and their will and aspirations in the situation of their absented voice about what is taking place in East Ghouta.
A- To take the necessary measures for immediate cease-fire, to stop the shelling and storming by pro-Assad military forces of villages and towns of Eastern Ghouta, and for the implementation of UN Security Council Resolution 2401 through immediate, negotiated and peaceful manner, especially after several initiatives were put forward by the people of the eastern Ghouta to expel Jabhat Al Nusra and resume peace talks in Geneva.
C- That civilians in Eastern Ghouta – represented by the Provincial Council, Local Councils and civil society organizations – should become a negotiating partner in all negotiations and settlements related to East Ghouta discussed by national, international or local actors, and that they decide their own fate and that they are provided with all the support to do that.
F- That there be sufficient international pressure, by all means, to compel the regime and its allies, especially the Russian Federation, to lift the siege on Eastern Ghouta and open humanitarian crossings, and stop the systematic starvation practiced by the Syrian regime against civilians.
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Geri
wasn't born to follow
Eastern Ghouta has fallen. I know it was only a matter of time, but I am devastated by the pictures of Assad soldiers taking selfies with captured women and children and the buses taking people to an unknown fate. People who have been besieged for five years, huddled together in basements for survival, are being forced to swear allegiance to Assad before they are even given a bottle of water.
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Riklet
procrastinación
Awful news from East Ghouta.
In the north things are fucked too with the Turks busy meddling. Can the Kurds hold on to freed regions given the sides lining up against them? Big worry is what the heck to do with all the islamists and other scum they have as prisoners... I wouldnt take the risk, frankly.
In the north things are fucked too with the Turks busy meddling. Can the Kurds hold on to freed regions given the sides lining up against them? Big worry is what the heck to do with all the islamists and other scum they have as prisoners... I wouldnt take the risk, frankly.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
The sides lining up against them? They are lining up with the regime.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Looks like another regime chemical attack on douma, east ghouta tonight (suggestions of sarin/chlorine mix) - early reports have 40+ civilians dead.
teqniq
DisMembered
It appears to be not connected as a response to the chemical attack on Douma. Israel had reportedly been reconnoitring in the area with drones about 3 days beforehand. Which leaves the usual reasons why Israel may have carried out the attack, namely to deny arms shipments into Lebanon by Shia militias or not so usual reasons that Israel is also apparently alarmed by noises coming from the Trump administration about pulling out of Syria and this is a ploy to get them to stay.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Why? To send clear messages to Iran - not Syria - that they are approaching doing things that Israel doesn't want them to do. Not the first time nor the last.
btw arms into lebanon from iran have tended to do by sea or via air from damascus - maybe something new was being tried in this case. Or it could be to do with their claims of Iran building their own arms factories in syria aimed at Israel. They have a whole host of stuff they can come up with.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Regime to formally steal land and property of the millions it has dispalced by air-strike, barrel bomb, chemical attack and starvation:
Syria: 'Absentees law' could see millions of refugees lose lands
As thousands of Syrians flee their homes in Eastern Ghouta to escape a fierce air and ground offensive led by pro-government forces, President Bashar al-Assad has introduced a new law which can potentially see the state confiscating the lands of millions of displaced people.
Law Number 10, introduced earlier this week, calls on Syrians to register their private properties with the Ministry of Local Administration within 30 days.
...
Legal experts have been quick to liken the recently introduced legislation to the Israeli Absentees' Property Law.
...
"It is impossible for me to go back home to prove my right to my lands and properties," the 27-year-old, who owns two homes and an electronics shop in Hammouria, told Al Jazeera.
"If I attempt to do so, I'll either be killed or arrested by pro-government forces," added Abu Jawad who fled to the northwestern province of Idlib earlier this month.
Syria: 'Absentees law' could see millions of refugees lose lands
As thousands of Syrians flee their homes in Eastern Ghouta to escape a fierce air and ground offensive led by pro-government forces, President Bashar al-Assad has introduced a new law which can potentially see the state confiscating the lands of millions of displaced people.
Law Number 10, introduced earlier this week, calls on Syrians to register their private properties with the Ministry of Local Administration within 30 days.
...
Legal experts have been quick to liken the recently introduced legislation to the Israeli Absentees' Property Law.
...
"It is impossible for me to go back home to prove my right to my lands and properties," the 27-year-old, who owns two homes and an electronics shop in Hammouria, told Al Jazeera.
"If I attempt to do so, I'll either be killed or arrested by pro-government forces," added Abu Jawad who fled to the northwestern province of Idlib earlier this month.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Guardian calls for more regime chemical attacks to bring assad victory closer - only thing to end the killing. Make two, three, many Doumas!
Only Assad’s victory will end Syria’s civil war. The west can do nothing
Only Assad’s victory will end Syria’s civil war. The west can do nothing
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