Treacle Toes
Time
So if you are a 'lefty' you need to stay a 'worker' ?
Abusive. aggressive employee
- Thread starter 1927
- Start date
It was much more openly political in the NHS when I worked there as you'd expect but in a private company, far less so...
poster342002
PROPER leftwing socialist
It's called individualistic, corporate-ladderclimbing embourgification. To those who wish to follow such a path I say this: go ahead by all means - but don't try and kid yourself or others that you are still "one of us". You've taken on a role that you know involves hringing, firing and dislipining "uppity" workwers onbehalf of the capitalist employer. Your loyalty is now to "them" and not "us". You can't face both ways at once.
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
C'mon... one of the good things about Urban is it's diversity. Or are you suggesting that before joining Urban there needs to be a political leanings questionnaire to make sure everyone's the "right" sort of poster ? And has the "right" sort of opinions ?
Wonder how many members there'd be then ? LOL(And anyhow - this is the employment forum innit for employment questions ?)
no other wise we'd never have let poster numbers the troll in ....oh hang on am i actualy argueeing for this i am aren't i .... yes only then if we can back date it ...
poster342002
PROPER leftwing socialist
Yes. Or assume a bossmanship and accept you are no longer a lefty as your new role is inherantly at odds with leftwing politics.
Treacle Toes
Time
Can 'uppity' in some cases also mean those who don't honour their contract in some way? Therefore are not doing their job.
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
Yes - it is possible to be a two-faced hypocrite who advocates left-causes like workers rights at the same time as sacking and disciplining them for being uppity and disrespectful to their betters in the workplace itself.
because yet again your straw man cellar is over runeth with inhabitaints...
these are of course th eonly reason to sack or discapline peoople...
have you ever had a job other than paper selling one...
Orang Utan
Psychick Worrier Ov Geyoor
I would say so - how can you be a boss and yet on the side of the workers?
Treacle Toes
Time
Decent contracts, terms of employment, pay etc...?
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
according to numbers the troll it's anyone in any way who has been told off by the boss be it utterly legitimate or otherwise...
numbers the troll thinks that the worker can do no wrong....
number the troll also doens't know their arse formt heir elbow when it comes to employment legisalation or indeed another other left wing topic....
numbers is a freeper who is pretending to be a left winger in order to troll as one to discredit left wing thinking...
numbers has been spotted...
poster342002
PROPER leftwing socialist
That's the bosses side of the argument and they have no trouble being heard. I don't see it as the role of a socialist to aid it.
poster342002
PROPER leftwing socialist
Substantiate that or retract, please.
Treacle Toes
Time
It's not really just 'the bosses' side of the argument. I have been fired twice in my life. Both times I was unable to or not doing my job, therefore not honouring my contract. They were right to let me go.
Ooops well, that's a goodly chunk of the workforce then including Nurses (matrons), Doctors, consultants etc etc & a goodly chunk of the folks I know from the council estats where I was born, all up agin the wall
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
because you have to work within the system you can't say sod this i'm turnignt his department into an anarchist socialist non hirearchical section of the work place. You can however support and protect your staff and defend theri existing rights and legitimately attempt to get new ones for them. I think that there's far to much concentration on middle management (largely because this is as high up as most peopel who discuss it are in compaines, but it's hardly line managers or even their direct superiors who are to blame for the design or polices of the companies it's not like the even have a say in them they are simply in the same boat as the worker but paid slightly more and in extreme cases might fire them which will be bullets and gun provided by HR.
Bosses which is what originally people were ralyign against ie company owners Stock holders Share Holders not middle managment it's such a shit focus... we'll attack the workers on the second lowest rung to protect the ones underneith them however workers above them fuck em they are part of the system ... it all get's incredably partisan very quickely...
poster342002
PROPER leftwing socialist
There's a lot of truth that the ruling class has followed a policy of obsenely swelling the ranks of the boss-classes over the last 30 years in order to break down solidarity bewtween workers. Solidarity is hard to foster when you have workplaces where everyoen is someone else's boss.
The point is to fight to change this - not pretend it doesn't matter and pretend these embourgified types still solidarise with "their staff" regardless.
Depends if there have to be automatically "sides" or if you want to work as a "team" - where I am - if we don't work as a team, the company don't get contracts and we are all out of jobs potentially - so it's a good incentive to work together
Anyhow - speaking of work - I better get on with some
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
everythign you have ever posted on employment rights or left wign thinking is evidence enough of some one who doens't understand the prinicpals or indeed have any practical mehtod of implamenting it.
you reacitonary deleberate knee jerk posting style and your entire repitioure of usless catch phrase poltics.
All buuilt and designed as a freeper troll....
as i have said before Got your number freeper boy...
and let's face it no one but no one thinks you are a credible source of radical or left wing poltics you are jsut here to attempt to misdirect and turn people off left wing poltics with your constant embittered moaning...
even if you are not then you antics are such a good aprody of this that it achives the same ends.
so either you are a freeper troll or doing such a plausable impression of one as makes no difference...
QED
Or perhaps people want to get on and improve things for themselves ?
Anyhow - ends derail & clears of to do some work
poster342002
PROPER leftwing socialist
That's a good point and I'd say that the former are the old, "classic" petit-bourgeoise whilst the latter are the "new" petit-bourgeioise. In my experience, anyway, it's the corporate-ladderclimbers in the second category who are the nastiest to those beneath them inthe heirarchy. Others' experience may be different, though.
poster342002
PROPER leftwing socialist
Or perhaps people want to get on and improve things for themselves ?
This sort of individual advancement is at the expense of collective solidarity and accross-the-board improvements for all. It becomes an alternative to solidarity.
poster342002
PROPER leftwing socialist
So, basically, nothing at all. And you, of course, are the Great Arbiter of what is "correct" or acceptable leftwing thought.
I don't know why I took you off ignore.
_angel_
.
So the corner shop who employs someone part time to stack the shelves is 'corporate ladder climbing'?
Or just needs a bit of a hand because they are up at about 5am and don't close till 10pm?
Nurses and teachers are corporate ladder climbers?? I doubt most of them think of themselves as any other than a nurse or teacher to tell you the truth.
poster342002
PROPER leftwing socialist
No, those are the old "classic" petit-bourgoeise. They don't really have a corporate ladder to climb - unless their business expands dramaticallly.
With them (and others who fall within what I call the "new petit-bourgeoisie") it depends on if they start trying to climb the corporate ladder within their employers and become responsble for hiring, firing and disciplining workers. it's at that point that a line is crossed, imo.
GarfieldLeChat
fucking awesome but wrong
laughs and points... that man has no and i mean no sense of irony...
coming from the 'propper' left wing socialist, who conitnually rubbishes the Left yet when asked to define this homogonious grouping of disperate and different organsieations or define their aims he stutters and stumbles and then founces ro threats people with ignoring them until they go away...
not one question answered in their entire posting career of any significance not one defintion preovide yet continuouis runnign down and degridation of anthing which numbers the troll doens't think is appropreate, oddly and every time these are issues which it serves the right wing agenda to have pushed off topic and into bollcks back biting and dogma and it's always numebrs the troll...
Got your numbers son ...
go play els where for you the trolling is over...
poster342002
PROPER leftwing socialist
Yeah, yadda yadda yadda .. whatever, garfield. I'm tired of going round in circles with you.
Think what you like. Hurl insults if it gives you a nice warm feeling inside. I really couldn't care less for your opinions anymore.
Think what you like. Hurl insults if it gives you a nice warm feeling inside. I really couldn't care less for your opinions anymore.
_angel_
.
I don't know much about nursing but AFAIK hiring /firing teachers only goes with the head teacher who are in quite a different position to a head of year, for example. I think.
Although a lot of times with them being forced to be run like businesses and not got enough money they have (heads) to make redundancies that are out of their control.
Head teachers seem a different thing altogether to 'ordinary' teachers as far as I can tell.. I couldn't claim to know the set up in nursing.
But it's the much reviled human nature to do it
People are individuals and not everyone wants solidarity rammed down their throats - tbh it seems to me that your idea of solidarity might well equate to a kind of dictatorship type of solidarity
if you see what I mean *Determines to come back later at lunchtime or summat*
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