Yes or No -AV referendum May 2011

[articul8]

Nothing in the above detracts from my point that they are both systems based on the transferring of preferences - which was the point I was making.

 

[Louis MacNeice]

Nothing in the above detracts from my point that they are both systems based on the transferring of preferences - which was the point I was making.

Liar.

 

[moochedit]

If the Tories didn't suspect this, why are they all opposed?

http://www.conservativeyes.org.uk/

4/03/2011 Launch of Conservative Yes

A group of senior conservative activists have today formally launched Conservative Yes, a campaign designed to encourage Conservative party members to Vote Yes in May.

 

[articul8]

Yes, and they have one AM and one councillor. Doesn't that say something?

This is how important they think it is:
http://conservativehome.blogs.com/thetorydiary/2011/03/baroness-warsi-tells-tory-activists-that-defeating-av-is-their-most-important-task-on-may-5th.html

 

[frogwoman]

Warsi is basically regarded as a bit of a loon within the party tho no? at least thats the impression i got.

 

[frogwoman]

"Denying the deficit" though!

Fantastic.

 

[articul8]

Warsi is basically regarded as a bit of a loon within the party tho no? at least thats the impression i got.

She is Co-Chairman - she is putting forward the priority of the national party and trying to get activists fired up to get the vote out for a No. You might think you're punishing Clegg by voting no, but you'll be delighting 99% of Tories in the country.

 

[frogwoman]

I dunno, her stuff criticising islamophobia (and by extension punishing cameron for saying it) didn't go down too well among the tory activists did it? not saying that she's anything other than a tory wankstain tho.

 

[frogwoman]

She is Co-Chairman - she is putting forward the priority of the national party and trying to get activists fired up to get the vote out for a No. You might think you're punishing Clegg by voting no, but you'll be delighting 99% of Tories in the country.

Is that to distinguish themselves from the Lib Dems tho because of personal differences/backstabbing etc or out of genuine conviction?

 

[articul8]

I think it's coming from the (majority) faction who want the Tories to govern with a majority and not compromise on their anti-European agenda, hang em flog em stuff etc.

 

[frogwoman]

Yes but it also more complex than that - It's a long discussion probably best done in another thread. More than happy to engage there. Labour will reap the benefits from public opposition to the coalitions' unpopularity to a very large extent.

Like these tories benefited from labour's unpopularity.

 

[frogwoman]

I think it's coming from the (majority) faction who want the Tories to govern with a majority and not compromise on their anti-European agenda, hang em flog em stuff etc.

Fair enough, but is Warsi representative of this lot - the hard(er)-right lot?

 

[Spanky Longhorn]

You might think you're punishing Clegg by voting no, but you'll be delighting 99% of Tories in the country.

You win some you lose some.

 

[frogwoman]

All the "yes" voters' arguments seem to consist of "look this famous person supports AV and the nasty old tories don't support it".

.

 

[articul8]

The Tories don't support it *for good reason* - it will reduce the chances of them ever forming a majority government ever again (remember the miners, the poll tax etc.?)

The LDs will get - and deserve to get - a hammering in the locals just as they got a hammering in Barnsley. But giving Clegg a slap is not worth strengthening the Tories and Cameron. Particularly when AV would free supporters of Greens, lefts and anti-cuts candidates to show their real 1st preferences rather than back Labour as the least worst option.

 

[redsquirrel]

The Tories don't support it *for good reason* - it will reduce the chances of them ever forming a majority government ever again (remember the miners, the poll tax etc.?)

You fucking liar - I've repeatedly presented evidence that this isn't true and yet you keep claiming this crap. Even produce some evidence or shut the fuck up.

 

[Streathamite]

She is Co-Chairman - she is putting forward the priority of the national party and trying to get activists fired up to get the vote out for a No. You might think you're punishing Clegg by voting no, but you'll be delighting 99% of Tories in the country.

so what?

 

[shagnasty]

Av is like getting a kick in the bollocks and given a sweet to ease the pain.Pr it is not ,Clegg as been well and truely short changed

 

[articul8]

You fucking liar - I've repeatedly presented evidence that this isn't true and yet you keep claiming this crap. Even produce some evidence or shut the fuck up.

you've done nothing of the sort - you've said it would still be possible for the Tories to get a majority. I agree but the chances will be significantly reduced.

Tories certainly worries about this:

But right now the biggest worry on every Tory MPs lips is the alternative vote referendum in May.... a change in the voting system, a change that one senior Tory MP told me would be like a dagger to the heart of the Conservative party. "It would never hold power outright again," he said.

http://www.channel4.com/news/backbench-dissent-threatens-camerons-coalition

 

[articul8]

so what?

Since when has helping to deliver Tory objectives been a good idea?

 

[moochedit]

Conference did not support a motion calling for a yes vote in the referendum on introducing the alternative vote system for elections in Britain.
There will now be further discussion in the party about what position to take in the referendum.

http://www.socialistworker.co.uk/art.php?id=23564

are the swappies split on this ?

 

[Proper Tidy]

http://www.socialistworker.co.uk/art.php?id=23564

are the swappies split on this ?

Lol. Dicks.

 

[articul8]

What party are you a member of PT, and what do you do for a living?

 

[Proper Tidy]

What party are you a member of PT, and what do you do for a living?

SP, and why the fuck do you want to know? I am not paid by any party/union/campaign/political organisation though.

 

[butchersapron]

What party are you a member of PT, and what do you do for a living?

Drunk mis-judged sunday night counter attack.

 

[Proper Tidy]

Innit

 

[articul8]

There was enough dissent in the SP to make for some debate at their conference I hear - even if the wrong call was made.

And why is my profession relevant where your's isn't. Come to that, Butchers - how do you earn a crust?

 

[butchersapron]

Have a think about why.

 

[articul8]

Why what?

 

[fractionMan]

Still banging that "you're a tory" drum then?

srsly?