Woolwich soldier killed (was "Did cops just shoot 2 dead in woolwich?")

[likesfish]

Some adherents to the UAF, who frankly haven't got a clue, are saying 'why hasn't this been reported on the TV news' - death of of an elderly man stabbed brutally coming home from prayers at his local mosque.

Ffs when ukip have more of a clue you know your in trouble at times like this if you cant say the right thing shut the fuck up.
You may have an intelligent truthful point to make but its more than likely you will come across as your being a massive cunt.

 

[treelover]

I think this would be great, but that the UAF would call it racist.

Its appalling that on much of the left blogo-sphere, there are reams of articles about U.k foreign policy and the EDL, but nothing on Chaudary, the radical mullahs who are spreading this ideology, its sickening and tbh , I don't want to be part of it. The STWC statement and SEYMOURS Lenin blog, S.U, all basically just go on about the EDL and UK FP, HNH no articles this week on the extremists, I have no doubt that it will be the same in the 'real word'

of course foreign policy has a part to play in this radicalisation, but the left criticised the right when it used brevik's actions to justify its views on immigration, the left shouldn't do the same now.

 

[treelover]

Ffs when ukip have more of a clue you know your in trouble at times like this if you cant say the right thing shut the fuck up.
You may have an intelligent truthful point to make but its more than likely you will come across as your being a massive cunt.

Its really revealing that UKIP are being uncharacteristically silent on this, they know they are going to be a 'beneficiary' of this terrible event, the media should be asking , just why they are so quiet.

btw, spiney, good luck with your possibly 'one man' campaign for sanity on the campus

 

[malatesta32]

Its appalling that on much of the left blogo-sphere, there are reams of articles about U.k foreign policy and the EDL, but nothing on Chaudary, the radical mullahs who are spreading this ideology, its sickening and tbh , I don't want to be part of it. The STWC statement and SEYMOURS Lenin blog, S.U, all basically just go on about the EDL and UK FP, HNH no articles this week on the extremists, I have no doubt that it will be the same in the 'real word'

of course foreign policy has a part to play in this radicalisation, but the left criticised the right when it used brevik's actions to justify its views on immigration, the left shouldn't do the same now.

trees, maybe because the 'islamic threat' is so tiny and practically invisible whereas the EDL are a pissed bunch of racists presenting an immediate threat to public order and both they and BNP are capitalising on the dead guy. the killing in woolwich is a freak event and very difficult to prevent. lone woflism and all that. chadhary is a clown. if he isnt state or heavily monitored i'll vote UKIP.

 

[malatesta32]

also UKip ae being quiet as BNP and EDL are clearly exploiting the situation to boost waning public profile.

 

[butchersapron]

trees, maybe because the 'islamic threat' is so tiny and practically invisible whereas the EDL are a pissed bunch of racists presenting an immediate threat to public order and both they and BNP are capitalising on the dead guy. the killing in woolwich is a freak event and very difficult to prevent. lone woflism and all that. chadhary is a clown. if he isnt state or heavily monitored i'll vote UKIP.

You think the EDL threat is large compared to that of radcial islam? Really?

 

[malatesta32]

no i dont, i think it is larger and more visible.

 

[where to]

trees, maybe because the 'islamic threat' is so tiny and practically invisible whereas the EDL are a pissed bunch of racists presenting an immediate threat to public order and both they and BNP are capitalising on the dead guy. the killing in woolwich is a freak event and very difficult to prevent. lone woflism and all that. chadhary is a clown. if he isnt state or heavily monitored i'll vote UKIP.

That post is preposterous. You sound in denial about what happened this week. It was real.

 

[J Ed]

Its appalling that on much of the left blogo-sphere, there are reams of articles about U.k foreign policy and the EDL, but nothing on Chaudary, the radical mullahs who are spreading this ideology, its sickening and tbh , I don't want to be part of it. The STWC statement and SEYMOURS Lenin blog, S.U, all basically just go on about the EDL and UK FP, HNH no articles this week on the extremists, I have no doubt that it will be the same in the 'real word'

of course foreign policy has a part to play in this radicalisation, but the left criticised the right when it used brevik's actions to justify its views on immigration, the left shouldn't do the same now.

Agreed completely, I'm just disgusted by it all.

 

[malatesta32]

Its really revealing that UKIP are being uncharacteristically silent on this, they know they are going to be a 'beneficiary' of this terrible event, the media should be asking , just why they are so quiet.

they dont need to exploit it like bnp/edl as they are doing quite well all things considered.

 

[where to]

no i dont, i think it is larger and more visible.

In what way?

 

[malatesta32]

That post is preposterous. You sound in denial about what happened this week. It was real.

i am pointing out that there is a difference in policing EDL demos and lone wolf type things. the islamic threat is tiny. if it wasnt how come there arent loads of arrests etc?

 

[malatesta32]

In what way?

that EDL are a visible presence and easy to police whereas assholes like those 2 guys are very difficult to monitor all the time. there was a guy on radio 4 on thursday i think saying that plod doesnt have enough resources to monitor everybody all the time.

 

[J Ed]

trees, maybe because the 'islamic threat' is so tiny and practically invisible whereas the EDL are a pissed bunch of racists presenting an immediate threat to public order and both they and BNP are capitalising on the dead guy. the killing in woolwich is a freak event and very difficult to prevent. lone woflism and all that. chadhary is a clown. if he isnt state or heavily monitored i'll vote UKIP.

People in Islamic Societies have been calling for the death of LGBT people, Muslims from other sects, the oppression of women and even worse in most universities in this country for years. It's only tiny and invisible to people because those who should look refuse to.

 

[treelover]

How can a left, particularly an academic left which spends ages minutely dissecting todays societies and far right minutae totally ignore what J Ed and others have been been posting about what goes on in the campuses? Its not new either, twenty years ago, (not ten) Hizbut were organising on my old campus, not a word from the SWP, etc, Special Branch were called in, the left knew about it, the same week, a ridiculous letter came to the Union from someone purporting to be from C18, mass hysteria from them and a call to have a mass demo, which thankfully was resisted.

 

[malatesta32]

yes i know. they are twats. but they dont actually DO anything do they apart from preach to the converted. 'It's only tiny and invisible to people because those who should look refuse to.' like who?

 

[likesfish]

Which proves the point somepeople are fucking clueless there is a time and a place.
When DI died had to physically restrain somebody who wanted to talk to the daily mail on behalf of brighton unemployed centre
Because that would have done the org so much credit not.

 

[J Ed]

yes i know. they are twats. but they dont actually DO anything do they apart from preach to the converted. 'It's only tiny and invisible to people because those who should look refuse to.' like who?

Several students who have been radicalised by these societies have gone on to become terrorists, including possibly the latest attackers.

 

[J Ed]

How can a left, particularly an academic left which spends ages minutely dissecting todays societies and far right minutae totally ignore what J Ed and others have been been posting about what goes on in the campuses? Its not new either, twenty years ago, (not ten) Hizbut were organising on my old campus, not a word from the SWP, etc, Special Branch were called in, the left knew about it, the same week, a ridiculous letter came to the Union from someone purporting to be from C18, mass hysteria from them and a call to have a mass demo, which thankfully was resisted.

Seriously? This has been going on for twenty years? For fuck sake.

 

[malatesta32]

i know but im not sure what you mean when you say those 'who should be looking but are refusing?'

 

[treelover]

yes i know. they are twats. but they dont actually DO anything do they apart from preach to the converted. 'It's only tiny and invisible to people because those who should look refuse to.' like who?

eh, didn't you read the Guardian article about SHU that J Ed posted up, one of the Islamic Societies members blew himself up in Tel Aviv killing innocents, didn't you read they they 'groom' young students, especially international ones who may be in a later position to do something about it..

useful idiots indeed.

btw, a I've mentioned before, a friend of mine from STWC days, a lovely bloke, tried to set up a 'reform muslim' group, he was shocked and quite alarmed by the responses he got.

 

[malatesta32]

no i didnt. who are supposed to be watching but arent? thats 1 incident. lets not blow it out of proportion. im not denying they are twats and dangerous but the 'threat' seems considerably larger than the actuality. im not denying that there are a few out there.

 

[J Ed]

i know but im not sure what you mean when you say those 'who should be looking but are refusing?'

Anti-fascist student activists, student politicians in the student unions where it is happening and ultimately the NUS.

 

[where to]

that EDL are a visible presence and easy to police whereas assholes like those 2 guys are very difficult to monitor all the time. there was a guy on radio 4 on thursday i think saying that plod doesnt have enough resources to monitor everybody all the time.

So who why are Edl the massive threat we should be getting all worked up about? In your own words theyre just pissed up racists that the police are well on top of.

You're going round in circles.

 

[malatesta32]

i am not saying they are a 'massive threat' i said they are bigger and more visible than the islamic bellends.

 

[JimW]

Seriously? This has been going on for twenty years? For fuck sake.

Lot of it about when I was at SOAS getting on for twenty years ago. I got involved in having a go against it on an individual basis but i was a bit semi-detached from student politics (mature student and did degree in two chunks with time out to work in the middle).

 

[likesfish]

Its really revealing that UKIP are being uncharacteristically silent on this, they know they are going to be a 'beneficiary' of this terrible event, the media should be asking , just why they are so quiet.

btw, spiney, good luck with your possibly 'one man' campaign for sanity on the campus

Maybe they actually have some party discipline after all?

 

[J Ed]

no i didnt. who are supposed to be watching but arent? thats 1 incident. lets not blow it out of proportion. im not denying they are twats and dangerous but the 'threat' seems considerably larger than the actuality. im not denying that there are a few out there.

It isn't just one case though, is it?

Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab, the Detroit shoebomber, was the head of the Islamic Society at UCL.

How many more examples do you need?

 

[treelover]

Big part of the left has a history on this sort of looking away, Russia, Hungary, Checkozovakia(sic)

 

[where to]

i am not saying they are a 'massive threat' i said they are bigger and more visible than the islamic bellends.

You said Edl are a threat to public order but Islamist extremists are not. Its ludicrous.