What's your total annual income - anonymous poll

[danny la rouge]

Old Money vs New Money

What?

 

[Athos]

I think I just took a rather narrow view of culture than was implied. My mistake

No trouble old boy, say no more and I'll see you're not black-balled.

 

[chilango]

I don't think cultural capital is synonymous with being 'cultured' i.e. appreciating art and literature. Rather, it's the social things that assist someone in getting on, like knowing the right people, going to to right schools, hob-nobbing on golf courses and ski slopes, fitting in at posh clubs etc.

That's a mix of Social Capital (who you know) and Cultural Capital (what you know)...and habitus - "feeling like a fish in water" in various classed environments.

 

[Athos]

That's a mix of Social Capital (who you know) and Cultural Capital (what you know)...and habitus - "feeling like a fish in water" in various classed environments.

Alright Bourdieu!

 

[MickiQ]

What?

The Victorians divided the wealthy into those who inherited their money like the nobility and the the landed gentry and had class and manners versus the grubby industrialists who had made their fortunes and had ideas above their station.

 

[danny la rouge]

The Victorians divided the wealthy into those who inherited their money like the nobility and the the landed gentry and had class and manners versus the grubby industrialists who had made their fortunes and had ideas above their station.

Yes, I know what old and new money means. What I don’t get is what relevance it has to this discussion. And no, “new money” are not necessarily without social or cultural capital.

 

[Johnny Vodka]

Pretty much in the middle, which is fine and comfortable considering where I live, having a cheap mortgage and not having expensive tastes. Wouldn't like to raise a family on it though.

 

[danny la rouge]

That came across a bit fighty. Apologies.

 

[chilango]

For me, the "value" of these forms of Capital, is the ability to exchange them for each other

So can your Cultural Capital be exchanged for Economic Capital? Or vice versa? etc.

 

[Sasaferrato]

Old Money vs New Money

Didn't one very snotty Tory MP say of Michael Heseltine 'He had to buy his own furniture'.

 

[Elpenor]

Didn't one very snotty Tory MP say of Michael Heseltine 'He had to buy his own furniture'.

Alan Clark

 

[MickiQ]

Alan Clark

A man who could Phil The Greek a run for his money when it came to putting his foot in it.

 

[Sasaferrato]

No trouble old boy, say no more and I'll see you're not black-balled.

Funnily enough, the subject of being black-balled came up today in conversation.

Back in the day there was a man called Duncan Ferguson (served time for assaulting an opponent on the pitch) who played for Glasgow Rangers.

Someone was lunatic enough to put him up for membership of the Corkerhill Masonic Lodge in Glasgow.

Come the night of the vote to see whether he would be admitted, there wasn't room in the Lodge for all those who turned up, people who hadn't been seen for decades paid their Test fee so that they could vote. The queue was literally out the door.

Well, the votes were cast, the votes were counted, and he wasn't admitted. Reportedly he asked his sponsor 'Was there a black ball?', to which his sponsor replied 'Have you ever seen sheep shit?'.

 

[Athos]

Funnily enough, the subject of being black-balled came up today in conversation.

Back in the day there was a man called Duncan Ferguson (served time for assaulting an opponent on the pitch) who played for Glasgow Rangers.

Someone was lunatic enough to put him up for membership of the Corkerhill Masonic Lodge in Glasgow.

Come the night of the vote to see whether he would be admitted, there wasn't room in the Lodge for all those who turned up, people who hadn't been seen for decades paid their Test fee so that they could vote. The queue was literally out the door.

Well, the votes were cast, the votes were counted, and he wasn't admitted. Reportedly he asked his sponsor 'Was there a black ball?', to which his sponsor replied 'Have you ever seen sheep shit?'.

They don't make 'em like Big Dunc and more.

Thank god.

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

ffs, am going to Glasgow on Friday, should I invest in a suit of armor?

 

[Orang Utan]

Didn't one very snotty Tory MP say of Michael Heseltine 'He had to buy his own furniture'.

It is sort of a class signifier though - my flat is full of inherited furniture and there are family paintings from generations ago on the walls - hard to pretend you’re not middle class with things like that in the background!

 

[Sasaferrato]

Bring a w

ffs, am going to Glasgow on Friday, should I invest in a suit of armor?

Bring a warm jacket. It's 3.8C outside at the moment. It was 4C at noonish.

 

[BigMoaner]

What did you spend it on?

The energy crisis

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

Bring a w

Bring a warm jacket. It's 3.8C outside at the moment. It was 4C at noonish.

Not much difference to Godalming tbf.

 

[scifisam]

£29k, plus PIP, and I get £26pa in disability tax credit that is much more valuable than it sounds, since it's got me the extra cost of living payments and gets me free prescriptions and dental care and a small amount towards my glasses, and Help To Save and a couple of other things. Basically that £26 has turned into around £1,600 this year, or £1,900 including Help To Save.

I live in inner London, but have a housing association flat, so I'm doing OK.

 

[AverageJoe]

Funnily enough, the subject of being black-balled came up today in conversation.

Back in the day there was a man called Duncan Ferguson (served time for assaulting an opponent on the pitch) who played for Glasgow Rangers.

Someone was lunatic enough to put him up for membership of the Corkerhill Masonic Lodge in Glasgow.

Come the night of the vote to see whether he would be admitted, there wasn't room in the Lodge for all those who turned up, people who hadn't been seen for decades paid their Test fee so that they could vote. The queue was literally out the door.

Well, the votes were cast, the votes were counted, and he wasn't admitted. Reportedly he asked his sponsor 'Was there a black ball?', to which his sponsor replied 'Have you ever seen sheep shit?'.

Burglary attempts at his homesEdit​

In 2001, two burglars broke into Ferguson's home in Rufford, Lancashire. Ferguson confronted them and was able to detain one of them, who subsequently spent three days in hospital.[56] The second man managed to flee but was eventually caught. Both men were sentenced to 15 months' imprisonment for their actions.

In January 2003, Ferguson caught another burglar at his home in Formby, Merseyside; the burglar attacked Ferguson, who retaliated. The burglar was hospitalised and later alleged that Ferguson had assaulted him, but this was dismissed by police.[56][57]

Convictions for physical altercationsEdit​

Ferguson has had four convictions for assault – two arising from taxi rank scuffles,[3] one an altercation with a fisherman in an Anstruther pub,[3] and one for his on-field headbutt on Raith Rovers defender John McStay in 1994 while playing for Rangers, which resulted in a rare conviction for an on-the-field incident.

The first incident led to a £100 fine for headbutting a policeman and a £25 fine for a Breach of the Peace,[58] while the second resulted in a £200 fine for punching and kicking a supporter on crutches. He was sentenced to a year's probation for the third offence.[59] For the 1994 on-the-field headbutting, he received and served a three-month jail term for assault.[60] Ferguson's troubles with the law and his imprisonment inspired Finnish composer Osmo Tapio Räihälä to write a symphonic poem as a "musical portrait" of Ferguson, titled Barlinnie Nine.


Why the fuck would you think its a good idea to try and break into Duncan Fergusons home!!!

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

Burglary attempts at his homesEdit​

In 2001, two burglars broke into Ferguson's home in Rufford, Lancashire. Ferguson confronted them and was able to detain one of them, who subsequently spent three days in hospital.[56] The second man managed to flee but was eventually caught. Both men were sentenced to 15 months' imprisonment for their actions.

In January 2003, Ferguson caught another burglar at his home in Formby, Merseyside; the burglar attacked Ferguson, who retaliated. The burglar was hospitalised and later alleged that Ferguson had assaulted him, but this was dismissed by police.[56][57]

Convictions for physical altercationsEdit​

Ferguson has had four convictions for assault – two arising from taxi rank scuffles,[3] one an altercation with a fisherman in an Anstruther pub,[3] and one for his on-field headbutt on Raith Rovers defender John McStay in 1994 while playing for Rangers, which resulted in a rare conviction for an on-the-field incident.

The first incident led to a £100 fine for headbutting a policeman and a £25 fine for a Breach of the Peace,[58] while the second resulted in a £200 fine for punching and kicking a supporter on crutches. He was sentenced to a year's probation for the third offence.[59] For the 1994 on-the-field headbutting, he received and served a three-month jail term for assault.[60] Ferguson's troubles with the law and his imprisonment inspired Finnish composer Osmo Tapio Räihälä to write a symphonic poem as a "musical portrait" of Ferguson, titled Barlinnie Nine.


Why the fuck would you think its a good idea to try and break into Duncan Fergusons home!!!

Oh just fucking great.

Does BA offer an exemption on knives being carried on Glasgow flights, or do they offer them out to passengers on arrival?

 

[story]

That poll is a joke, there is no way there are 20 people in here with incomes greater than £100k..

The arsehole SUV thread would suggest otherwise tho

 

[story]

It’s interesting that “cultural capital” is being brought up as being MC. Do WC people not read or appreciate art? To my mind, books and learning are cheap and classless. Just depends what you do with your time. A lot of very rich people (by such a standard) have no cultural capital at all. We own our house outright - something that is down to accident rather than design. We had very little options in the mid-90s and buying was cheaper than renting at the time so it’s just how it worked out. Both of us have families with no cash (and no chance of an inheritance) - something which has always made us financially cautious (& self-sufficient) so securing the house meant no holidays for well over 15 years. Having money behind you allows you to take risks and fail with no consequences. I went to Uni with people like this who just took it for granted and mocked me for supposedly being unadventurous. Clearing the mortgage means we have greater peace of mind so much of what earn between us goes towards putting some “hay in the barn” for a vague retirement date 15 or so years down the line. Still living carefully.

You need leisure in order to read, ponder, visit art galleries, make art, discuss ideas etc. And cash.

It’s not that wc doesn’t have cultural capital it’s that cultural capital demands disposable income. WC who manage it are compelled by their interests/need to prioritise it at the expense of savings and capital.

 

[story]

I don't think cultural capital is synonymous with being 'cultured' i.e. appreciating art and literature. Rather, it's the social things that assist someone in getting on, like knowing the right people, going to to right schools, hob-nobbing on golf courses and ski slopes, fitting in at posh clubs etc.

Not true. There’s a ponzI scheme aspect at the top end of creative art that relies on this stuff but there’s also a whole bunch of hard won hard scrabble starving in the squat art that happens when people sacrifice all the ladder climbing stuff. And that’s mainly men, cos women are doing the laundry and finding the bargain food to feed the family on at the expense of their own dreams.

 

[story]

Nobody is 'self-made', even if they don't have those sorts of advantages; everyone in this country benefits from the NHS, roads, the safety net of benefits, education (even the privately educated rely on other being state educated), etc., etc.

More and more you need to self advocate on orde to access any of the umbrella help or the safety net.

THatcher’s enterprise intititive scheme made a difference to a lot of people. The comparable things these days are either non existence, hidebound with things you have to prove and demonstrate or so invisible that no one knows about them.

 

[emanymton]

I think the thread is suffering from mass confusion between household income and personal income, to be honest. Household income of over 100k is, as we’ve seen, relatively common. Personal income over 100k is not.

Remember that personal income is not evenly distributed — wealthier people tend to marry other wealthier people. If one member of a couple earns more than 60k, there is an excellent chance that the other will earn more than 40k. And those kind of levels of income are not that uncommon in London (hence the preposterous house prices — the average mortgage payment in London is an astonishing 75% of the average wage).

And issues around net and gross income.

Also something I had not considered at first is that given the demographic on here a number of people are either retired or comming to the end of their working life and have reduced the hours they work, or changed career completely, so while their income may have dropped they are otherwise well off.

At the other end of the scale what about people on low income who also get housing benefit, universal credit or similar. Should they be added on?

So what I think we are all learning is that this question is really not as simple as it appears.

 

[Buddy Bradley]

That poll is a joke, there is no way there are 20 people in here with incomes greater than £100k..

Over £100k is easily achievable in today's market for IT wonks, and there are quite a few of those on here (because they have the opportunity to dick about on the internet all day).

 

[weltweit]

Over £100k is easily achievable in today's market for IT wonks, and there are quite a few of those on here (because they have the opportunity to dick about on the internet all day).

Yes, I suppose that is true ..

 

[story]

I’m noticing that the ones here who have higher incomes and better finances are those who also seem more literate and comfortable, capable when discussing it. Someone said they thought I was MC and bad with money. Yeah, that’s probably right. My N London sister married into the MC and landed in a place where financial literacy was part of the conversation. It wasn’t in our birth family, and since I had no real affinity for the MC, I never ended up chatting ££ stuff with mates or colleagues, so ended up “bad with money”.