tube party on june 1st?

[nosos]

My point is that it's easy to find aggressive drunks on the tube most nights who seem to think their carriage is a lounge-on-wheels.!

But what does this have to do with their drinking rather than their being drunk? The former is the issue here, the latter isn't.

 

[Guineveretoo]

To many people , drinking alcohol on public transport is antisocial, as much as the twat in the hoodie with tinny rap blaring out on a mobile phone.

Why?

 

[nosos]

It's just that I want the journey to my gig to be part of the evening out, rather than a boring chore, and it can be a nice, civilised beginning to the evening, to have a can of lager on the bus.

Absolutely! At the end of a night out in London I used to like walking/tube home with a can of guiness and then have a spliff when I get in. Nice way to wind down from an evening.

 

[Spymaster]

So the issue at hand is: how much trouble do people drinking on the tube actually cause in virtue of their drinking rather than their perhaps being drunk?

Why?

Why is it about how much trouble is caused by these people?

How about the fact that their drinking makes for a less pleasant experience for many of their fellow travellers?

 

[ajdown]

So this does represent an erosion of civil liberty.

But how many people, seriously, will it affect?

The greater good of the many is far more important than the desires of the individual.

If 99.9% of people never drank on the tube anyway, or are in support of the ban, then the 0.1% who did drink and are against it, just have to put up with it or risk suffering the effects of breaking the law.

 

[Guineveretoo]

Simply asking Ed if he supports my right to do so on public transport. No different to what he wants to do but it's fucking bad manners.

But that's about manners, not legislation/bans.

Personally, it wouldn't worry me at all if you ate a curry whilst sitting next to me, and I am fully aware that lots of people do fart on public transport!

 

[editor]

Why?

Why is it about how much trouble is caused by these people?

How about the fact that their drinking makes for a less pleasant experience for many of their fellow travellers?

Be sure to construct a meaningful argument as to why someone quietly having a can of beer makes for a more unpleasant experience than someone, say, quietly drinking from a bottle of water, and why we need legislation for this.

Thanks.

 

[nosos]

Why is it about how much trouble is caused by these people?

You've yet to explain what trouble is caused by their drinking! What trouble caused by people being drunk is obvious & not in dispute but it's irrelevent to the issue: this ban won't stop drunk people getting on the tube. Please, from the bottom of my heart, I implore you to actually explain to me in concrete terms what harm people drinking on the tube does to those members of the public who aren't repulsed by the smell of alcohol (I'm repulsed by the smell of meat but I don't think that gives a right to demand others be banned from eating meat in front of me) and don't seemingly harbour some deep-seated antagonism to people who drink, the psychological reasons for which I can only begin to speculate about (although reading ajdown's posts on another thread offers a few suggestions).

Edit: I misread your past post. You think people should be banned from doing stuff if it makes it less pleasent for you? Have you ever actually thought through how free anyone would be if this were applied reciprically? If anything that impinged on the pleasure of another were banned we would, literarly be living in a totalitarian state. Accepting people's right to do things you disaprove of is a basic requirement of life in a free society. Get over yourself.

 

[ajdown]

Why?

The smell, for a start.

 

[lights.out.london]

But what does this have to do with their drinking rather than their being drunk? The former is the issue here, the latter isn't.

I think we'll end up going round in circles (no party available!).

It's a tube train. Save the ales for the bar.

"Rights"? Bolloxology.

 

[London_Calling]

But how many people, seriously, will it affect?

The greater good of the many is far more important than the desires of the individual.

If 99.9% of people never drank on the tube anyway, or are in support of the ban, then the 0.1% who did drink and are against it, just have to put up with it or risk suffering the effects of breaking the law.

I'm just stating a fact. The issue itself I find amusing, not least for the indignant enthusiasm of so many for this advertising-led culture of drinking.

 

[lights.out.london]

I'm just stating a fact. The issue itself I find amusing, not least for the indignant enthusiasm of so many for this advertising-led culture of drinking.

^ interesting

 

[nosos]

The greater good of the many is far more important than the desires of the individual.

What "greater good" is being served here? What harm is being inflicted? What good is being achieved by enforcing this ban? The self-righteousness to rational content ratio of your argument (as well as spymaster's) is really quite stunningly shit here.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

The smell, for a start.

That is a ridiculous reason, unless you also support banning everything that smells from the tube, in which case it is still ridiculous but at least consistent.

 

[nosos]

I think we'll end up going round in circles (no party available!).

It's a tube train. Save the ales for the bar.

"Rights"? Bolloxology.

Look I'm asking for a simple answer to a polite question. All you're doing is repeating "I don't think people should drink on the tube" ad nauseum. I get you to think that. Care to offer reasons why others should also think that? Or is that an unreasonable imposition?

 

[Guineveretoo]

It will affect me because, whenever I go to JAMM for an Offline, I like to have a can of lager on the way there.

Are you seriously suggesting that 99.9% of the population support the ban? You are deluded, if so!

 

[nosos]

90%+ of the population presumably don't give a shit either way

 

[Guineveretoo]

The smell, for a start.

So the smell from my can of lager offends you that much that it must be banned, even though it probably wouldn't smell at all compared to all the drunks who have downed their pints before they get on the bus/tube?

 

[DotCommunist]

I'm just stating a fact. The issue itself I find amusing, not least for the indignant enthusiasm of so many for this advertising-led culture of drinking.

Alcohol sales are no more or less advertising led then everything else. The culture of drinking is a wee bit older than WKD adverts and the Portmann Group.

 

[nosos]

So the smell from my can of lager offends you that much, even though it probably wouldn't smell at all compared to all the drunks who have downed their pints before they get on the bus/tube?

Big sweaty people who smell make my journey less pleasent. Am I right to ask that they ban them from the tube?

 

[ajdown]

What "greater good" is being served here? What harm is being inflicted? What good is being achieved by enforcing this ban? The self-righteousness to rational content ratio of your argument (as well as spymaster's) is really quite stunningly shit here.

You're obviously against the ban.

Why is your desire to drink alcohol on public transport more important than the desire of the 100 other people in that carriage/bus not to be around someone drinking alcohol?

It's no secret I don't like alcohol. I'm not trying to stop everyone drinking alcohol, just a desire to avoid having to put up with people drinking in inappropriate situations.

There are many, many places where people can consume alcohol freely 24 hours a day either without infringing on the rights of other people, or with like minded individuals.

 

[lights.out.london]

Look I'm asking for a simple answer to a polite question. All you're doing is repeating "I don't think people should drink on the tube" ad nauseum. I get you to think that. Care to offer reasons why others should also think that? Or is that an unreasonable imposition?

Alcohol.

Unlicenced public space.

Inappropriate.
ABC123.

 

[London_Calling]

Alcohol sales are no more or less advertising led then everything else. The culture of drinking is a wee bit older than WKD adverts and the Portmann Group.

If you think the point is that simple, best you find other people to respond to.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

Alcohol.

Unlicenced public space.

Inappropriate.
ABC123.

But that makes no sense as an argument.

 

[bluestreak]

But why is it inappropriate?

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Big sweaty people who smell make my journey less pleasent. Am I right to ask that they ban them from the tube?

Absolutely

 

[ajdown]

That is a ridiculous reason, unless you also support banning everything that smells from the tube, in which case it is still ridiculous but at least consistent.

I have no problem banning smelly food (ie greasy chicken boxes) on public transport either.

Smelly people isn't such an easy option because of the heat on the tube especially during the summer.

 

[scifisam]

Alcohol.

Unlicenced public space.

Inappropriate.
ABC123.

You're.

Still.

Just.

Repeating.

Yourself.

 

[nosos]

Why is your desire to drink alcohol on public transport more important than the desire of the 100 other people in that carriage/bus not to be around someone drinking alcohol?

(a) I doubt all that many of those 100 people particularly care
(b) You've yet to explain what harm people drinking does other than offend you given your own hang ups
(c) You've yet to explain why it's reasonable for you to impose your own hang ups on others
(d) You've yet to say whether you accept the consequences of everyone being able to impose their own hang ups

Unless some real harm's being done then don't legislate. This seems the most obvious thing in the world to me & if we live in a liberal society it ought to be common sense. Please disagree with the principle or explain why the harm done to you is such that it justifies legislation.

 

[lights.out.london]

But that makes no sense as an argument.

*bangs head on desk*

It's a train/bus/tram. Not a bar. Not a pub. Not a club. Not your front room. No need to drink on tubes and buses. No need at all.