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The Rational Proof of God's Existence

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Money is an independent and autonomous force with the ability to reproduce, the power to rule the world, and the ability to control the minds of its inhabitants.
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No it isn't. That's a rhetorical assertion you are trying to use in order to have us accept your method of argument before you say something similar about satan and then god. Money does not have agency.
 
ZWord said:
But even when they give it away, the demand of the money that it grows incessantly, through interest, remains, whoever owns the pot of money, humanity has to be exploited in order to keep the pot growing.
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The owner of the money can always put it under the bed and let it shrink and some do.

ZWord said:
And when I hear of hurricanes and tsunamis, I wonder if these somehow reflect the inchoate frustration of humanity with ourself, and show that we have yet to grasp our true divine power.
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They don't. They existed long before there were any humans. Jesus, you'd think the sun revolves around us too. The laws of the universe don't give a shit if there are humanoids toddling about the place.
 
I can see the argument phil. My viewpoint, and one that I have expressed repeatedly, is that this is one way of expressing the complex system of modern materialism and capitalism, but by no means the only one. The fact that your assertions and logical steps are not exclusive, nor even water-tight means that this can never be a proof of god, but only one interpretation of modern systems. One that I don't agree with. Gurrier is lucidly explaining a different way of looking at things, as you yourself are beginning to recognise I think.

Nevertheless do carry on, it's entertaining and providing some good discussion of modern systems.
 
And now for the simple explanation

You are one clever fucker phil but surely you over complicate. Yes God exists because everything exists. God is in a word infinity. everything is energy. Matter is just energy in a denser form. This energy goes on forever. And if you dont believe me on that just take a look at Einsteins work on the subject. It'd be a brave man who calls einstein a liar. Besides if energy does end. Where does it end? Why would it end?

There you go

Infinity

or as some like to call it God. ;)
 
ZWord said:
Well if we haven't been enslaved by a malign spirit or the demand of money for incessant growth into exploiting the planet and each other, even to the extent of destroying our ecosystem, and eventually our civilisation, why exactly are we doing it? And why can't we stop?
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Tragedy of the commons?
 
Surley this is all mental masturbation...... I sure hope you all enjoy it. Me. Ive got my faith in God. It makes my life more meaningful. I cant think of a logical reason for not choosing faith personally? :p
P.S. lets all make a humming noise
 
POST TO PHIL:

Phil, doesn't it worry you that we're 66 pages into your shit and no-one believes a word of your bollox?

Love
IMHO
 
IMHO said:
POST TO PHIL:

Phil, doesn't it worry you that we're 66 pages into your shit and no-one believes a word of your bollox?

Love
IMHO
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Aren't you the one that either the Editor or Johnny Canuck (or quite possibly both) just described as having "a written version of Tourette's syndrome?" I think they're right.
 
P.P.S. As I said before >sigh< if god always existed, then so could matter/energy/whatever. The best sale for a "god" you'll get is creative intelligence being part and parcel of matter/energy. In other words, the INTELLITRON. A theoretical particle which is creative inetlligence existing WITHIN atomic structure. That is matter/energy/inelligence/god all rolled into one.

The whole thing having always existed.
 
deeplight said:
Surley this is all mental masturbation...... I sure hope you all enjoy it. Me. Ive got my faith in God. It makes my life more meaningful. I cant think of a logical reason for not choosing faith personally? :p
P.S. lets all make a humming noise
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I can't imagine why you'd believe in God on "faith." In fact, I'd go so far as to say that if you take God's existence on "faith," you don't truly believe in Him at all.
 
phildwyer said:
Aren't you the one that either the Editor or Johnny Canuck (or quite possibly both) just described as having "a written version of Tourette's syndrome?" I think they're right.
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I've no idea. But to re-phrase (and I hope you'll answer the question): doesn't it bother you that we're 66 pages into this and no-one believes you have even THE MAKING of a case?
 
IMHO said:
I've no idea. But to re-phrase (and I hope you'll answer the question): doesn't it bother you that we're 66 pages into this and no-one believes you have even THE MAKING of a case?
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I'm doing a bit better than you with your "intellitron," you nutter.
 
IMHO said:
P.P.S. As I said before >sigh< if god always existed, then so could matter/energy/whatever. The best sale for a "god" you'll get is creative intelligence being part and parcel of matter/energy. In other words, the INTELLITRON. A theoretical particle which is creative inetlligence existing WITHIN atomic structure. That is matter/energy/inelligence/god all rolled into one.

The whole thing having always existed.
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Would you like to make a comment on this, Phil, which rather blows you out of the water?
 
IMHO said:
Destroy my simple argument. Can't, can you?
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It wasn't an argument it was a hypothesis, there's a difference. It's generally incubent on the proposer of the hypothesis to come up with some proof before hassling for a rebuttal.
 
IMHO said:
Destroy my simple argument. Can't, can you?
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Oh alright. Your argument is wrong because it collapses a binary opposition into an artificial unity. You want to say that mind and matter are the same thing, when in fact they constitute a mutually definitive polarity.
 
maomao said:
It wasn't an argument it was a hypothesis, there's a difference. It's generally incubent on the proposer of the hypothesis to come up with some proof before hassling for a rebuttal.
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Whatever you want to call it, Phil The Great can't desroy it.
 
phildwyer said:
Oh alright. Your argument is wrong because it collapses a binary opposition into an artificial unity. You want to say that mind and matter are the same thing, when in fact they constitute a mutually definitive polarity.
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Oh all right. Your argument is wrong because it contains mutually opposing nanomectrical dispositions. :rolleyes:
 
IMHO said:
P.P.S. As I said before >sigh< if god always existed, then so could matter/energy/whatever. The best sale for a "god" you'll get is creative intelligence being part and parcel of matter/energy. In other words, the INTELLITRON. A theoretical particle which is creative inetlligence existing WITHIN atomic structure. That is matter/energy/inelligence/god all rolled into one.

The whole thing having always existed.
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You really can't get around this, can you, Phil :D
 
phildwyer said:
Oh alright. Your argument is wrong because it collapses a binary opposition into an artificial unity. You want to say that mind and matter are the same thing, when in fact they constitute a mutually definitive polarity.
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And who defines them as binary oppositions?

Seems like you've mistaken dialetics conceptual toolbox for actual reality. Go finger Engels bumhole you daft wee boy!
 
ZWord said:
How can he be the troll, when it's his thread? And I haven't seen you engage with phil in any real debate. Start your own thread, and if he annoys you on that, then you can say he's trolling.
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Actually you're wrong: trolls do start their own threads either for the purpose of winding up other posters, or to start fights (and then claim they were wronged), or to use the thread to set up fights between posters. Phil has conformed to at least one of those criteria.

Oh, and I have engaged him as have many others...he is lying when he says that I haven't, he has accused gurrier of the same thing. If he doesn't like what you've said he either belittles or insults you. I thought gurrier made some excellent points, phil didn't take too kindly to having his 'argument' debunked and proceeded to insult him. Do you think that's right or fair?

Please have a look at all his posts from the beginning of this thread to the end. On this page alone he has referred to others as "nutters" or has, in some other way, insulted their intelligence. You see, phil thinks he is superior to the rest of us; his intellect is the greater and the things he says are the wittiest...but it is all in his head.

You should also have a look at his thread titles...this one in particular has a provocative title. This is a very good example of how to wind up posters and start fights.
http://www.urban75.net/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=3430107&postcount=1
 
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