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Terrorist attack NZ, 50 dead, many injured

Daily Heil running a story of how the wee blond kid turned bad after travelling to Pakistan and North Korea.
 
elbows said:
Its not surprising at all.

People are far, far more susceptible to explanations they hear from other people, and how this stuff informs their worldview, especially when their own lives havent lived up to their expectations and they are looking for someone to blame or some grand struggle they can cast themselves in.

Despite ther much greater level of immersion, I dont really place fears about computer games in a different category to fears about the amount of mindless, consequence-free violence in films. Mostly because I dont usually consider these things to be root causes or primary drivers.
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tbh I'm suspicious of all explanations of this kind of thing that don't focus on the ideology. A hateful ideology fuels r/w white supremacist terrorism every bit as much as, say, Islamist terrorism. The circumstances of the individual terrorists that lead them to adopt that ideology are going to vary. Just as you're unlikely to find too many answers as to why girls from London joined ISIS by looking at those girls' lives in London, I doubt you will find any particular reason why any of these terrorists should have adopted this ideology from their lives in NZ.
 
littlebabyjesus said:
tbh I'm suspicious of all explanations of this kind of thing that don't focus on the ideology. A hateful ideology fuels r/w white supremacist terrorism every bit as much as, say, Islamist terrorism. The circumstances of the individual terrorists that lead them to adopt that ideology are going to vary. Just as you're unlikely to find too many answers as to why girls from London joined ISIS by looking at those girls' lives in London, I doubt you will find any particular reason why any of these terrorists should have adopted this ideology from their lives in NZ.
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especially when yer man said that he had that ideology before he came to nz
 
littlebabyjesus said:
tbh I'm suspicious of all explanations of this kind of thing that don't focus on the ideology. A hateful ideology fuels r/w white supremacist terrorism every bit as much as, say, Islamist terrorism. The circumstances of the individual terrorists that lead them to adopt that ideology are going to vary. Just as you're unlikely to find too many answers as to why girls from London joined ISIS by looking at those girls' lives in London, I doubt you will find any particular reason why any of these terrorists should have adopted this ideology from their lives in NZ.
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I would almost always expect to find stuff in a persons actual life that can help explain what ideologies they took on board, and how far they decided to go with such things. There are other factors too, in the same way that siblings brought up with very similar experiences can take very different paths depending on personality and peers and more.
 
elbows said:
I would almost always expect to find stuff in a persons actual life that can help explain what ideologies they took on board, and how far they decided to go with such things. There are other factors too, in the same way that siblings brought up with very similar experiences can take very different paths depending on personality and peers and more.
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yeh, to look back to hannibal lecter, remember what he says about we covet what we see - and i suppose people learn to hate from what they see too, esp if it can be brought easily to them via the internet.
 
elbows said:
I would almost always expect to find stuff in a persons actual life that can help explain what ideologies they took on board, and how far they decided to go with such things. There are other factors too, in the same way that siblings brought up with very similar experiences can take very different paths depending on personality and peers and more.
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Perhaps. But they may turn out to be very ordinary reasons - the same kinds of reasons that might lead others to join very different kinds of subcultures. People like Anders Breivik, for instance, or Shamima Begum for that matter, strike me above all for the banality of their evilness. There are no good reasons why they turned that way at all really.
 
Hang all the gunmen and woman, from a huge wooden cross, that's on fire, over a lagoon of large, hungry, christian, salt water crocodiles.
 
Argonia said:
What's remarkable is how many people play violent video games but never go on to do anything like this.
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The terrible thing about the video in the mundane casualness of it, no screaming no panic, Humans become just moving masses to engage and kill and no one shoots back, risk free, systematic killing. I thought call of duty in cheat mode when I saw it

No doubt the fuckers involved are all insignificant, no mark, losers in life
 
littlebabyjesus said:
Perhaps. But they may turn out to be very ordinary reasons - the same kinds of reasons that might lead others to join very different kinds of subcultures. People like Anders Breivik, for instance, or Shamima Begum for that matter, strike me above all for the banality of their evilness. There are no good reasons why they turned that way at all really.
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Well, when I am looking for reasons, I do not limit myself to some sort of liberal judgement of what counts as a 'good reason'. The reason does not have to be in any way good, rational, justified, something we can use as a guide or try to eliminate to cut-off future acts of hate, for me to have an interest in understanding it.
 
The bit of the loonosphere I peeped at seems to have decided that this actually happened but over here, Gemma O'Doherty, who was nominated to be a presidential candidate by Clare Daly, Mick Wallace and assorted headbangers, has been going on about false flags and globalists all day.
 
littlebabyjesus said:
tbh I'm suspicious of all explanations of this kind of thing that don't focus on the ideology. A hateful ideology fuels r/w white supremacist terrorism every bit as much as, say, Islamist terrorism. The circumstances of the individual terrorists that lead them to adopt that ideology are going to vary. Just as you're unlikely to find too many answers as to why girls from London joined ISIS by looking at those girls' lives in London, I doubt you will find any particular reason why any of these terrorists should have adopted this ideology from their lives in NZ.
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''Nothing but hatred'' is ringing out, and the ''manifesto'' document is vanishing from servers as we speak.

It's a shame IMO because the stuff he comes out with in it is not like Breivik's, rambling, incoherent, or on the surface especially hateful. It's fearful - it's saturated with fear of invaders, but it's pretty calm and considered and refers to well-known ideas and people. The writer refers to themselves as an eco-fascist and lays out a simple, coherent case for why he thinks eco-fascism and apartheid are the answers to the world's problems. He admires the Chinese state, Oswald Moseley and Candace Owens.

I think more could be made of it to actually put it on display and take it to pieces, publicly and calmly. Brushing it under the carpet is IMO a terrible idea, because people who want to read it will find it and read it, and the fact it's being ''censored'' will only increase its value to them. Mystifying it in that way gives a pamphlet of fearful rubbish about The White Race more power than it could ever gain by itself, just being read and understood as exactly what it is.

Anyway. That concludes my Bad Opinion of the Day.
 
killer b said:
Why? It's totally meaningless. His twitter mentions are a constant stream of abuse & gotchas and has been for years, like every politician - yet his behaviour is unchanged, his popularity is undiminished.
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James Felton sums it up below. I agree with you he won't change, his base does think muslims are out there trying to undermine their British way of life - and he'll pander to it. I do, however, like to see people like him called out.

 
Outside a Manchester mosque apparently

D1tVQnqX0AAm8M5
 
elbows said:
Its not surprising at all.

People are far, far more susceptible to explanations they hear from other people, and how this stuff informs their worldview, especially when their own lives havent lived up to their expectations and they are looking for someone to blame or some grand struggle they can cast themselves in.

Despite ther much greater level of immersion, I dont really place fears about computer games in a different category to fears about the amount of mindless, consequence-free violence in films. Mostly because I dont usually consider these things to be root causes or primary drivers.
Click to expand...

I don't think it's the content of the games, per se, it's that they can provide a hard to moderate/monitor on-line space for the far right to recruit in.
 
Last edited:
mojo pixy said:
''Nothing but hatred'' is ringing out, and the ''manifesto'' document is vanishing from servers as we speak.

It's a shame IMO because the stuff he comes out with in it is not like Breivik's, rambling, incoherent, or on the surface especially hateful. It's fearful - it's saturated with fear of invaders, but it's pretty calm and considered and refers to well-known ideas and people. The writer refers to themselves as an eco-fascist and lays out a simple, coherent case for why he thinks eco-fascism and apartheid are the answers to the world's problems. He admires the Chinese state, Oswald Moseley and Candace Owens.

I think more could be made of it to actually put it on display and take it to pieces, publicly and calmly. Brushing it under the carpet is IMO a terrible idea, because people who want to read it will find it and read it, and the fact it's being ''censored'' will only increase its value to them. Mystifying it in that way gives a pamphlet of fearful rubbish about The White Race more power than it could ever gain by itself, just being read and understood as exactly what it is.

Anyway. That concludes my Bad Opinion of the Day.
Click to expand...
I guess to add to that, disaffection and alienation can lead people in many different directions. I agree with you that we shouldn't be afraid of exposing these things to the world. They are kind of the end point, though. Just as Melanie Phillips has to accept her share of the blame for Anders Breivik, many people will have contributed to this person's journey towards here. Every politician who uses the issue of immigration to scaremonger and further their own ends, for instance.
 
There are times when my abhorrence of the death penalty is tested to its limits. How much will it cost to keep those responsible in jail for life?
 
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