8ball
Decolonise colons!
They sound quite a lot like the Jedi Council.
Secular Buddhism
- Thread starter danny la rouge
- Start date
They sound quite a lot like the Jedi Council.
ChrisC
Well-Known Member
Introduction
This could have gone under Health or under Philosophy, but it’s about a way of thinking, practices and wisdom that I’ve found helpful in working towards better mental harmony and health.
Some of you will know that I’ve struggled with depression for many years now. I have good spells and bad spells, but it’s always been there. On the way back up from my most recent dip, I came across a group of ideas that can loosely be called Secular Buddhism. There is no unified international canon that all Secular Buddhists sign up to, rather it is a variety of ways that people find what is useful from Buddhist wisdom and practice while leaving to one side any metaphysical or supernatural claims that the various traditional schools of Buddhism might put forward.
Awakening
I had tried mediating at various points over the years, and always found my experiences unsatisfactory, as if I was either missing something fundamental, or there was actually nothing useful to be found. In my teens, I tried following Christmas Humphries’ instructions on mediation, and was just baffled. In recent years, I had tried Headspace, and couldn’t work out what on earth the guy was on about. Because of these and other failed attempts, I had, in my cynical way, settled on the latter explanation – there was nothing useful to be found in it.
Then I stumbled across a video by Martine Batchelor and it suddenly made sense to me. It turns out that I was expecting too much straight away, and that it’s actually a far simpler process than anyone had thus far given me to believe. Being willing to give it a try, because I needed a way to find calm in my life, and a way to find equilibrium in my mind, I had finally found a method that looked like it was going to work for me.
Therapeutic value
Having read through a number of books on the ways that modern psychology, neuroscience and therapy find use in meditation and other Buddhist insights, I have to say it makes a great deal of sense, and I’ve found a great deal that has been of practical benefit to me in compassion focused therapy and in books such as Buddha’s Brain. There is stuff here that works. For me at any rate. Though this isn’t a silver bullet, but a process.
Secular Buddhism? Don’t leave it vague for us!
Having said that there’s no one “Secular Buddhism”, the Massachusetts-based Secular Buddhist Association has a set of Guiding Principles, which includes the following:
Secular Buddhism understands Siddhattha Gotama as a human being, having lived within the cultural context of his time.
Secular Buddhism understands the four noble truths as an accurate, empirical description of the experience of living, and as a methodology of understanding, social behavior, and mental development.
Secular Buddhism is naturalistic, in that it references natural causes and effects, demonstrable in the known world.
Secular Buddhism is form independent, making it flexible for integration into daily life in a variety of cultural contexts.
Secular Buddhism is inclusive, fostering learning and practice across cultural and traditional bounds.
Secular Buddhism values the stories of Buddhist traditions as metaphorical expressions of meaningful and practical lessons.
Secular Buddhism values the texts of Buddhist traditions as tools for study, learning, and practice.
Secular Buddhism values individual preference and creativity on the forms of practice appropriate to them.
These seem sensible to me as a starting point for a dialogue or exploration. A jumping off point. Buddhism lends itself to a secular mindset, because there is no creation myth or creator god. But it does have powerful tools that can have real and powerful impact on one’s sense of wellbeing. It’s a way of using the mind to shape the mind, and a way of finding an understandable framework for that project. It’s a way of giving purpose to the goal of training the mind.
Enlightenment
Of course, various traditional schools of Buddhism have supernatural elements. Tibetan Buddhism, for example, is notably burdened with ritual and superstition. But it is possible to find a core of fundamentals common to all schools of Buddhism that are entirely consistent with modern psychology, and which provide a helpful way of seeing yourself and your reactions to the world, and, importantly, of getting yourself into better shape for dealing with what life throws at you.
So, I will not ever believe in literal reincarnation, and I don’t see Enlightenment as meaning anything metaphysical. And while I may not be ready quite yet to call my self “A Buddhist”, I am enjoying the exploration so far. I’m not looking for rational, because I don’t think the human mind is rational. But what I’ve found is a way which makes sense to me of navigating the mind that evolution saddled us with: in the words of Hanson & Mendius, (2009), “a lizard, fighting with a squirrel, fighting with a monkey”.
If anyone’s interest is piqued, I’d be happy for you to join me on the journey. If you just want to call me a hippy, fill your boots, but not on this thread, if you don’t mind.
Some resources:
Secular Buddhism:
Books -
Batchelor, Stephen. (1997) Buddhism Without Beliefs. Riverhead Books.
Batchelor, Stephen. (2010) Confession of a Buddhist Atheist. Random House.
Wright, Robert. (2017) Why Buddhism is True: The Science and Philosophy of Meditation and Enlightenment. Simon & Schuster.
(I aim to read more of Stephen Batchelor’s books: I like his writing).
Podcasts –
The Secular Buddhist Podcast: The Secular Buddhist Podcast Archives | Secular Buddhist Association
- From the Secular Buddhist Association, Mass. Hosted by Ted Meissner. I like the style of these podcasts and the host.
Secular Buddhism: Secular Buddhism: 1 - What Is Secular Buddhism? on Apple Podcasts
- Noah Rashetta. Not related to the SBA, and I’m not so keen on his style. But the first 5 podcasts are a good general grounding in Buddhist theory, and there are some good interviews. (Notably with Stephen Batchelor and Robert Wright).
Meditation:
Batchelor, Martine. (2001). Meditation for Life. Wisdom Publications.
Martine Batchelor’s videos on Tricycle: https://tricycle.org/trikedaily/meditation-month-mindfulness/
Apps –
Oak meditation
- Free, basic, cheerful. Does the job.
Insight Timer
- More content, but while there’s plenty of free stuff, the premium product is expensive. (Therefore, I haven’t ventured into the paid-for content).
Therapy and psychology:
Hanson, Rick, and Mendius, Richard, (2009). Buddha’s Brain, the practical neuroscience of happiness, love & wisdom. New Harbinger.
Gilbert, Paul. (2010), The Compassionate Mind. Constable.
- Probably more technically involved than you need, which is why you might want to consider…
Irons, Chris and Beaumont, Elaine. (2017). The Compassionate Mind Workbook. Robinson.
- Like it says: a workbook. Requires you to work through stuff, some of which is emotionally difficult. You may need someone you trust to support you at times.
Kolts, Russell and Chodron, Thubten. (2012). Living with an Open Heart. Robinson.
- Not such a commitment: you can dip in and out.
Buddhism:
Ponlop, Dzogchen. (2011). Rebel Buddha, a guide to a revolution of mind. Shambala.
Skinner, Julian Daizan. (2017). Practical Zen – meditation and beyond. Singing Dragon.
(Skinner has a meditation app, Zenways. It’s free, but I didn’t think much of it personally).
Traditional texts:
The Dhammapada, (2015) Penguin Classics, No. 80. Penguin.
Bodhi, Bhikkhu (ed), (2005), In the Buddha’s Words, discourses from the Pali Canon. Wisdom.
As a Buddhist Agnostic, which is similar to Secular Buddhism I suppose. I just thought I'd give you my take on the lack of info about creation in Buddhism You see a common thread in Buddhism is cycles. Infinite cycles of life death and creation. The universe or multiverse if you wanna go further was not created by any one or anything. It just is and it to goes through birth and death cycles like everything else. Spring turns to Summer, Summer turns to Autumn and Autumn to Winter and so it goes on. So in Buddhism it is viewed that reality the universe, multiverse whatever you want to call it has cycles to.
I'm not preaching this as fact cos in my opinion no one really knows what's going on, but I find the concept rather compelling.
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
Yes, the whole samsara, infinite rebirth thing. I’ve read a sutra (I think in the Pali Canon) where the Buddha is reported to have described an eon as being as long as it takes to erode a mountain with [some soft implement I can’t remember, but at any rate ill-suited to flattening mountains]. So it was definitely part of his cosmology.
Karen Armstrong in her biography/philosophical history, Buddha, says that rebirth was a relatively new development in Indian cosmology when Gotama was active, being a break from the Vedic orthodoxy of pre-urban Indian. I don’t know enough about the pre-Upanishad Vedic religion, but that surprised me: I’d always thought that reincarnation was in with the foundations in the ancestry of Hinduism and Jainism.
For me, though, there’s no evidence that rebirth happens, and although I can’t rule out evidence ever emerging, I find it difficult to see how such an transfer of consciousness (or “atman”) from a dying brain to a pre-natal or natal brain of indeterminate species would occur. In terms of what the mechanics of the procedure would be. So I’m quite happy to go further than a strictly agnostic view on that one, and stick my neck out to say I think it’s reasonable to actively disbelieve.
I can happily put it to one side, and just say it was part of the world view of the culture, and not really relevant to my meditation practice here and now. But if other people find it useful as a metaphor or even if they want to believe in it, that’s fine too. It’s certainly not worth upsetting anyone by arguing with them over it.
I’m interested, do you attend a sangha or meditation group? If so, are the others in it agnostic/secular or “pragmatic” Buddhists? Or is it a mix? And how is that for you? Does it sit OL with you if others are more literal in their beliefs?
ChrisC
Well-Known Member
A collection of all sorts really. I did dabble with Triratna. However, I eventually found them a bit sickening in as much to say, I felt they were being friendly because that's how it should be. False modestly in a way. Also I didn't like the history of it's founder Sangharakshita. Apparently he had homosexual sex by convincing his target's to let go of attachments to heterosexuality. I thought it was very manipulative.
Right, on to answer your question. I love the talks on YouTube by Ajhan Brahm.
I also attend a Thich Nhat Han group in Leigh on Sea. Now they tell you how it is in an honest friendly way.
As for Tibetan Buddhism I found it a little too esoteric for my liking. Although I quite like Mingyur Rinpoche also on YouTube.
Hope that answers your question.
Metta to you and all that...
Right, on to answer your question. I love the talks on YouTube by Ajhan Brahm.
I also attend a Thich Nhat Han group in Leigh on Sea. Now they tell you how it is in an honest friendly way.
As for Tibetan Buddhism I found it a little too esoteric for my liking. Although I quite like Mingyur Rinpoche also on YouTube.
Hope that answers your question.
Metta to you and all that...
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
Thanks. I appreciate you taking the time to discuss this with a newbie: I’ve not yet ventured into the real world of groups, but I share your unease with Triratna, from what I’ve read, and unfortunately they seem to be the nearest group to me geographically, although I’m planning to move back to Glasgow soon, so I may pluck up the courage to try out groups there.
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
Dunblane.
There’s a Pragmatic Buddhist group that meets in Stirling on Thursdays, but I’m busy with a standing engagement on Thursdays. But like I say, we’re hoping to flit in the next couple of months, so I’ll check out groups where I end up. I know there a couple of flavours of Zen and some Theravadins, including an actual Sri Lankan community, and various other groups in Glasgow.
ChrisC
Well-Known Member
Might I recommend.
BuddhaNet - Worldwide Buddhist Information and Education Network
It can be a little old, but I've found local groups on there over the years. Great resource too. [emoji16][emoji106]
Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk
BuddhaNet - Worldwide Buddhist Information and Education Network
It can be a little old, but I've found local groups on there over the years. Great resource too. [emoji16][emoji106]
Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk
ChrisC
Well-Known Member
World Buddhist Directory - Presented by BuddhaNet.Net
Scottish groups. Quite a number actually. If they are still running. I'll leave it up to you to check.
Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk
Scottish groups. Quite a number actually. If they are still running. I'll leave it up to you to check.
Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
That’s great, thanks. I’ll download that app.
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
Can’t seem to get my App Store to recognise it. I’ve tried searching the terms too.
Still, it’s a handy site. I’ve bookmarked it.
Still, it’s a handy site. I’ve bookmarked it.
HoratioCuthbert
Deep seated inconsequence
Introduction
This could have gone under Health or under Philosophy, but it’s about a way of thinking, practices and wisdom that I’ve found helpful in working towards better mental harmony and health.
Some of you will know that I’ve struggled with depression for many years now. I have good spells and bad spells, but it’s always been there. On the way back up from my most recent dip, I came across a group of ideas that can loosely be called Secular Buddhism. There is no unified international canon that all Secular Buddhists sign up to, rather it is a variety of ways that people find what is useful from Buddhist wisdom and practice while leaving to one side any metaphysical or supernatural claims that the various traditional schools of Buddhism might put forward.
Awakening
I had tried mediating at various points over the years, and always found my experiences unsatisfactory, as if I was either missing something fundamental, or there was actually nothing useful to be found. In my teens, I tried following Christmas Humphries’ instructions on mediation, and was just baffled. In recent years, I had tried Headspace, and couldn’t work out what on earth the guy was on about. Because of these and other failed attempts, I had, in my cynical way, settled on the latter explanation – there was nothing useful to be found in it.
Then I stumbled across a video by Martine Batchelor and it suddenly made sense to me. It turns out that I was expecting too much straight away, and that it’s actually a far simpler process than anyone had thus far given me to believe. Being willing to give it a try, because I needed a way to find calm in my life, and a way to find equilibrium in my mind, I had finally found a method that looked like it was going to work for me.
Therapeutic value
Having read through a number of books on the ways that modern psychology, neuroscience and therapy find use in meditation and other Buddhist insights, I have to say it makes a great deal of sense, and I’ve found a great deal that has been of practical benefit to me in compassion focused therapy and in books such as Buddha’s Brain. There is stuff here that works. For me at any rate. Though this isn’t a silver bullet, but a process.
Secular Buddhism? Don’t leave it vague for us!
Having said that there’s no one “Secular Buddhism”, the Massachusetts-based Secular Buddhist Association has a set of Guiding Principles, which includes the following:
Secular Buddhism understands Siddhattha Gotama as a human being, having lived within the cultural context of his time.
Secular Buddhism understands the four noble truths as an accurate, empirical description of the experience of living, and as a methodology of understanding, social behavior, and mental development.
Secular Buddhism is naturalistic, in that it references natural causes and effects, demonstrable in the known world.
Secular Buddhism is form independent, making it flexible for integration into daily life in a variety of cultural contexts.
Secular Buddhism is inclusive, fostering learning and practice across cultural and traditional bounds.
Secular Buddhism values the stories of Buddhist traditions as metaphorical expressions of meaningful and practical lessons.
Secular Buddhism values the texts of Buddhist traditions as tools for study, learning, and practice.
Secular Buddhism values individual preference and creativity on the forms of practice appropriate to them.
These seem sensible to me as a starting point for a dialogue or exploration. A jumping off point. Buddhism lends itself to a secular mindset, because there is no creation myth or creator god. But it does have powerful tools that can have real and powerful impact on one’s sense of wellbeing. It’s a way of using the mind to shape the mind, and a way of finding an understandable framework for that project. It’s a way of giving purpose to the goal of training the mind.
Enlightenment
Of course, various traditional schools of Buddhism have supernatural elements. Tibetan Buddhism, for example, is notably burdened with ritual and superstition. But it is possible to find a core of fundamentals common to all schools of Buddhism that are entirely consistent with modern psychology, and which provide a helpful way of seeing yourself and your reactions to the world, and, importantly, of getting yourself into better shape for dealing with what life throws at you.
So, I will not ever believe in literal reincarnation, and I don’t see Enlightenment as meaning anything metaphysical. And while I may not be ready quite yet to call my self “A Buddhist”, I am enjoying the exploration so far. I’m not looking for rational, because I don’t think the human mind is rational. But what I’ve found is a way which makes sense to me of navigating the mind that evolution saddled us with: in the words of Hanson & Mendius, (2009), “a lizard, fighting with a squirrel, fighting with a monkey”.
If anyone’s interest is piqued, I’d be happy for you to join me on the journey. If you just want to call me a hippy, fill your boots, but not on this thread, if you don’t mind.
Some resources:
Secular Buddhism:
Books -
Batchelor, Stephen. (1997) Buddhism Without Beliefs. Riverhead Books.
Batchelor, Stephen. (2010) Confession of a Buddhist Atheist. Random House.
Wright, Robert. (2017) Why Buddhism is True: The Science and Philosophy of Meditation and Enlightenment. Simon & Schuster.
(I aim to read more of Stephen Batchelor’s books: I like his writing).
Podcasts –
The Secular Buddhist Podcast: The Secular Buddhist Podcast Archives | Secular Buddhist Association
- From the Secular Buddhist Association, Mass. Hosted by Ted Meissner. I like the style of these podcasts and the host.
Secular Buddhism: Secular Buddhism: 1 - What Is Secular Buddhism? on Apple Podcasts
- Noah Rashetta. Not related to the SBA, and I’m not so keen on his style. But the first 5 podcasts are a good general grounding in Buddhist theory, and there are some good interviews. (Notably with Stephen Batchelor and Robert Wright).
Meditation:
Batchelor, Martine. (2001). Meditation for Life. Wisdom Publications.
Martine Batchelor’s videos on Tricycle: https://tricycle.org/trikedaily/meditation-month-mindfulness/
Apps –
Oak meditation
- Free, basic, cheerful. Does the job.
Insight Timer
- More content, but while there’s plenty of free stuff, the premium product is expensive. (Therefore, I haven’t ventured into the paid-for content).
Therapy and psychology:
Hanson, Rick, and Mendius, Richard, (2009). Buddha’s Brain, the practical neuroscience of happiness, love & wisdom. New Harbinger.
Gilbert, Paul. (2010), The Compassionate Mind. Constable.
- Probably more technically involved than you need, which is why you might want to consider…
Irons, Chris and Beaumont, Elaine. (2017). The Compassionate Mind Workbook. Robinson.
- Like it says: a workbook. Requires you to work through stuff, some of which is emotionally difficult. You may need someone you trust to support you at times.
Kolts, Russell and Chodron, Thubten. (2012). Living with an Open Heart. Robinson.
- Not such a commitment: you can dip in and out.
Buddhism:
Ponlop, Dzogchen. (2011). Rebel Buddha, a guide to a revolution of mind. Shambala.
Skinner, Julian Daizan. (2017). Practical Zen – meditation and beyond. Singing Dragon.
(Skinner has a meditation app, Zenways. It’s free, but I didn’t think much of it personally).
Traditional texts:
The Dhammapada, (2015) Penguin Classics, No. 80. Penguin.
Bodhi, Bhikkhu (ed), (2005), In the Buddha’s Words, discourses from the Pali Canon. Wisdom.
Interesting. I thought once I had entered a meditative state when playing the same three chords on my guitar for ages. I’m sure the bass used to help with this too, but these days, the more jumpy I am, the less inclined I am to do things that were once relaxing. It’s like an addiction to adrenaline.
Ramble ramble, anyway also just subscribing out of interest, could do with something that helps.
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
How’s the meditation going, Urban sangha?
I’m hitting a bit of difficulty right now. I’m obviously judging and expecting, because I’m getting irritable and restless during practice. Anyone got any tips for that?
I’m hitting a bit of difficulty right now. I’m obviously judging and expecting, because I’m getting irritable and restless during practice. Anyone got any tips for that?
8ball
Decolonise colons!
When you say "judging and expecting", is it a kind of "impatient" irritability you are talking about, or something deeper?
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
Yeah, impatience. I'm clearly expecting meditation to go a certain way, then getting annoyed when it isn't going "right".
elbows
Well-Known Member
I've not got far with meditation myself (due to try again once my hay fever season is over). But the thing you describe does very much sound like one of the main hurdles to effective meditation, that many, many people go through and most books etc on the subject spend a long time talking about as a result. Its probably not the easiest thing to crack, but once you do crack it, you've probably made it to successful meditation!
8ball
Decolonise colons!
This last bit could be both true and massively unproductive.
GAHH!!!!
DOING!!!
IT!!
WRONG!!!
FECK!!!
elbows
Well-Known Member
Been a long time since I read any bits of books either, but I could possibly approximate some of the ways they might go on about this stuff. Not the practical solutions though, I cant remember those.
You cant force it, for that would be like pushing against a cloud. Or like doomed attempts to tackle insomnia, sleep just wont come when forced.
You are getting somewhere, but parts of your mind that are refusing to be quiet and still are finding new ways to resist.
You cant force it, for that would be like pushing against a cloud. Or like doomed attempts to tackle insomnia, sleep just wont come when forced.
You are getting somewhere, but parts of your mind that are refusing to be quiet and still are finding new ways to resist.
elbows
Well-Known Member
Must have done something right in the first place to even reach that stage. So, not doing the whole thing wrong, but facing resistance that must be overcome.
elbows
Well-Known Member
I came up with a model for this that was almost half-convincing to me once, but not really, I dont actually believe it at all. I was just trying to get something that would even vaguely fit. Especially given things like personality changes after head injury. So I came up with something along the lines of this side of our self being external, with parts of the brain being a simple aerial/receiver or some other kind of connection to something beyond.
I'm usually better at finding flaws in these things than solutions/explanations though. For example I am rather struck by the extent which the total size of the human population has grown. For this and other reasons, if I really felt the need to develop some cohesive beliefs on this front, I would likely end up deemphasising the individual. I am part of something bigger that will go on once I am gone, but I will still be gone.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
This "transfer of consciousness" thing doesn't gel very well with the rest of what I have read about Buddhism.
For instance, we all exist in the moment, and it is "attachment" that keeps drawing us away from this simple truth.
So, if we die and "something else" is born, with none of our knowledge, none of our skills, none of our genetic proclivities, or the developmental history into which they bloomed into a full human personality, then what exactly *is* it that has apparently been passed on?
To all intents and purposes, that's basically someone else.
On another note, last night I fell unconscious for a bit, then on waking this morning, all that stuff was retained, or came back to me in the moment of waking, and the story I tell myself is that "I" fell asleep last night, and then woke up in the morning.
What was actually "kept" in that time *apart* from the body, the memories etc., though.
How do I know I wasn't someone else yesterday and just woke up with these memories today?
All a bit hackneyed in a "Zhuangzi and the butterfly" kind of way, but taking a vantage point that is a little closer to the truth of everything being in the moment, these questions start to look a little absurd. They are like the 'Caprine Proof Of The Existence Of God' - nothing there but shadows cast by the mis-wielding of half-understood words and ideas.
elbows
Well-Known Member
Did a quick search and the sort of stuff in the Expectations and Ego sections of the following are exactly the sort of thing I expected to find, and I'm sure there are hundreds of similar variations of this stuff out there.
meditation-frustration-what-to-do-when-you-want-to-quit
meditation-frustration-what-to-do-when-you-want-to-quit
elbows
Well-Known Member
Yeah. I would rather listen to Harry Dean Stanton going on about the void. The art of letting go is something I am much more interested in than trying to convince myself that I I I I bloody I will continue in some form.
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
It’s a reference to the Buddhist idea that we create stories to tie together situations and emotions, but forget that the story is only an interpretation of the combined emotion and situation, not a fact.My little meditation app sent me a little notification saying:
"Who would you be if you didn't believe the stories you create about yourself?"
Don't understand that one - am I meant to feel grateful about not being a dissociative psychotic?
For example, I notice a friend on the other side of the street, and so smile and wave. I’m feeling a bit down. My friend doesn’t look at me, and keeps walking.
I start to think “what have I done to upset Emily? How can I put it right?” Before long it is a fact that Emily is upset with me, rather than she didn’t notice me, she was in a hurry to get to a hospital appointment she was worried about, or someone else had hailed her at the same time, and I hadn’t noticed. What we do is go home thinking “I’ve lost another friend. I’m a loser”.
The only facts here are “Emily didn’t notice me” and “I’m feeling a bit down”. The rest is only a story. We need to start to separate out the story from the observable facts. This is one of the skills of mindfulness.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
It seems a bit flippant about discernment in which parts of the meaning structure are safe to chip away at.
So I'm going down the street and I notice Emily and wave - she keeps walking.
She didn't recognise me - why could that be?
Because THAT'S NOT EMILY.
That person must have killed Emily and is using her skin as a grotesque suit.
I owe it to poor Emily to blow this sinister gig open. The police aren't going to listen to me.
I know - I'll have to find a really sharp knife so I can cut Emily's skin off this monster - then they'll believe me!!
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
We can notice how we are feeling. We can notice events in our visual perception.It seems a bit flippant about discernment in which parts of the meaning structure are safe to chip away at.
So I'm going down the street and I notice Emily and wave - she keeps walking.
She didn't recognise me - why could that be?
Because THAT'S NOT EMILY.
That person must have killed Emily and is using her skin as a grotesque suit.
I owe it to poor Emily to blow this sinister gig open. The police aren't going to listen to me.
I know - I'll have to find a really sharp knife so I can cut Emily's skin off this monster - then they'll believe me!!
Explanations for the event and feelings - like Emily skin suits - can also be noticed, as thoughts that arise. A bit of detachment will allow us to see that the Emily Skin Suit Scenario is unlikely, and can surely be cleared up next time we see Emily.
