Rock Against Racism 2024 Edition

[mx wcfc]

Tom Robinson band and Steel Pulse were on the posters for the 1978 Victoria Park Carnival. Others came on board after the posters were printed and flyposted. On the day Clash was the headline band. Others included Elvis Costello and Siouxsie and the Banshees. Jimmy Pursey of Sham 69 also made an appearance.

I was at the Victoria Park one. Gutted to read that I missed Siouxsie and the Banshees.

I did see Patrick Fitzgerald, as well as the Clash, TRB, Steel Pulse and X-Ray Spex. The Clash were the biggest band, but TRB played last, iirc.

Elvis Costello played the Brockwell Park one. Sham pulled out.

 

[Petcha]

Bit okd-fashioned and incorrect to label it ‘Rock’ against racism, isn’t it?

Yeh. Good call. Dance against racism would probably work a bit better. I hope it's not gonna be just a bunch of white indie/rock bands.

 

[DaveCinzano]

Rock Against Racism hasn't been revived, Love Music Hate Racism (“the successor organisation to the Rock Against Racism (RAR) movement which helped turn the tide against the National Front in the 1970s”) has.

 

[Fozzie Bear]

I was at an exhibition this weekend and they had a film of MCs from Egypt rapping over grime and some female MCs from London rapping of some modern "urban" music from Egypt. It was good.

I have no idea what music the racist pogrommers like, but you probably can't go wrong with aggy and urban.

Stormzy is at number one with Chase and Status, for example:

 

[Fozzie Bear]

For example, this lot are from Middlesbrough:

 

[Nanker Phelge]

This is a good read, although it gets quite repetitive as each individual involved tells their version of events:



This one does similar, but is less repetitive and goes onward to tell of Red Wedge and Artists Against Apartheid.

 

[DaveCinzano]

This is a good read, although it gets quite repetitive as each individual involved tells their version of events:

View attachment 438835

This one does similar, but is less repetitive and goes onward to tell of Red Wedge and Artists Against Apartheid.

View attachment 438834

For completeness' sake, there's also Renton's ones:

 

[belboid]

Not to mention the excellent (mostly) photo book

& a more analytical one

 

[ska invita]

I'm not against the concerts in general esp if they're free or get people into putting on more diy shows, I just don't think it necessarily does the useful (and much more difficult) job of speaking to/deprogramming people who have been radicalised by the far right (sorry, know that's for the other thread).

Did RAR do that in the 70s...in fact what claim to success can it really have?
Would British music culture have been any different without it?
It's before my time....

 

[Sue]

Also this documentary might be of interest:

White Riot — Modern Films

White Riot (dir. Rubika Shah) | Rubika Shah’s award-winning and energising film charts a vital national protest movement. Rock Against Racism (RAR) was formed in 1976, prompted by ‘music’s biggest colonialist’ Eric Clapton and his support of racist MP Enoch Powell.

www.modernfilms.com

 

[hitmouse]

Did RAR do that in the 70s...in fact what claim to success can it really have?
Would British music culture have been any different without it?
It's before my time....

I mean, before my time as well, but I'd say a fair bit - it's easy to look back from 2024 and go "oh of course punk was always anti-racist and anti-fascist, surely getting the Clash to play is just preaching to the converted" or whatever, but I'm not sure it would've seemed like that at the time, with the Pistols wearing swastikas, and indeed before RAR the Clash singing about a white riot probably seemed a fair bit more ambiguous.
I suppose a major difference between then and now is that the NF were actively trying to recruit punks and skins, cultures that were soundtracked by punk and, odd as it may seem from here, ska, and so there was a direct political usefulness to tying those subcultures to explicit anti-racist politics. I suppose today you can make a case for trying to keep black metal, industrial/neofolk, and oi as contested terrain, but I can't really imagine that NSBM fans, neofolk edgelords or even old-school skins are that central to the modern far-right's growth. In that sense I suppose something like FLAF is maybe better for carrying on RAR's legacy, but then FLAF are definitely not on the scale that RAR was.
Dunno what else could be helpful though - Gaming Against Racism? More lefty youtubers and tiktokers? I'm loath to suggest more of that as a solution to anything.

 

[hitmouse]

For completeness' sake, there's also Renton's ones:

View attachment 438838 View attachment 438839

And the other SWP David's book:

 

[ska invita]

I mean, before my time as well, but I'd say a fair bit - it's easy to look back from 2024 and go "oh of course punk was always anti-racist and anti-fascist, surely getting the Clash to play is just preaching to the converted" or whatever, but I'm not sure it would've seemed like that at the time, with the Pistols wearing swastikas, and indeed before RAR the Clash singing about a white riot probably seemed a fair bit more ambiguous.
I suppose a major difference between then and now is that the NF were actively trying to recruit punks and skins, cultures that were soundtracked by punk and, odd as it may seem from here, ska, and so there was a direct political usefulness to tying those subcultures to explicit anti-racist politics. I suppose today you can make a case for trying to keep black metal, industrial/neofolk, and oi as contested terrain, but I can't really imagine that NSBM fans, neofolk edgelords or even old-school skins are that central to the modern far-right's growth. In that sense I suppose something like FLAF is maybe better for carrying on RAR's legacy, but then FLAF are definitely not on the scale that RAR was.
Dunno what else could be helpful though - Gaming Against Racism? More lefty youtubers and tiktokers? I'm loath to suggest more of that as a solution to anything.

Thanks.... Yes good points... The situation dynamics cultural norms so different today though.

As to what else would work... Yes, such a hard one to answer

 

[krtek a houby]

Could see bands like Kid Kapichi and Bob Vylan attracting the younger crowd

 

[Smokeandsteam]

Dunno what else could be helpful though - Gaming Against Racism? More lefty youtubers and tiktokers? I'm loath to suggest more of that as a solution to anything.

That’s the glaring problem isn’t it? Music has lost its centrality to youth culture. Now it’s just another thing to be largely consumed online.

As such, this relaunch already has the feel of nostalgia to it.

I’d also add that I’ve got no idea what music those in their teens and twenties in Hartlepool or Middlesbrough are listening to, but I’m pretty sure it’s not Nadine Shah or the frankly awful and shit politics possessing Idles. The fact it’s being launched in London is equally telling.

Some of the images posted in this thread are iconic, sadly I doubt in 40 years those in theit twenties now will be doing the same…

 

[Fozzie Bear]

That’s the glaring problem isn’t it? Music has lost its centrality to youth culture. Now it’s just another thing to be largely consumed online.

In fact, there isn’t anything like the mass youth culture of the seventies now. So there are few big unifying things that can bring people together in the same way.

Big free music events could possibly still do it I think though, especially if there’s isn’t much else to do. Like, it’s worth doing well. But no way is it a magic bullet.

 

[zedr]

Could see bands like Kid Kapichi and Bob Vylan attracting the younger crowd

But the kids who listen to them would already be converts. They're not going to be shifting the perspectives of people who are willing to go and set fire to asylum hotels or post racist shit online.

It sounds silly, but I think memes are such a huge and powerful social force and I think a lot of teenagers use and share videos and images as part of their social bonding. The alt-right used this very powerfully back in the late tens. Gaming and YouTube are also the big other spheres but as hitmouse says encouraging more 'leftist' YouTubers and twitch streamers sounds awful.

Probably also useful to remember that many of the ppl involved in the riots were not young. Seems like most of the people sentenced are in their 30s, 40s and above. What culture and media are they consuming, and how do people reach out to them?

 

[hitmouse]

Thinking about the Charli XCX thing, it feels like Charli XCX is a big thing, but then I don't even know if Brat Summer is an album first and a meme second or the other way around. And even Brat Summer isn't quite universal, I imagine there must be a few people somewhere who aren't that bothered about Brat Summer.

 

[danny la rouge]

Thinking about the Charli XCX thing, it feels like Charli XCX is a big thing, but then I don't even know if Brat Summer is an album first and a meme second or the other way around. And even Brat Summer isn't quite universal, I imagine there must be a few people somewhere who aren't that bothered about Brat Summer.

I mean, that is a particularly obnoxious shade of green.

 

[zedr]

Thinking about the Charli XCX thing, it feels like Charli XCX is a big thing, but then I don't even know if Brat Summer is an album first and a meme second or the other way around. And even Brat Summer isn't quite universal, I imagine there must be a few people somewhere who aren't that bothered about Brat Summer.

Isnt Brat Summer a late 20s / early 30s sort of demographic meme? I'd also be very shocked if Brat was on the playlist of any of the rioters tho with the breakdown of genres and scenes who knows.

 

[hitmouse]

Isnt Brat Summer a late 20s / early 30s sort of demographic meme?

Probably?

 

[Fozzie Bear]

In fact, there isn’t anything like the mass youth culture of the seventies now. So there are few big unifying things that can bring people together in the same way.

Outside of sports and the pandemic the most recent mass culture event was the death of the monarch.

So maybe something could be done with that, in the interval before Paloma Faith goes on.

 

[krtek a houby]

Outside of sports and the pandemic the most recent mass culture event was the death of the monarch.

So maybe something could be done with that, in the interval before Paloma Faith goes on.

A Queen tribute act, or an execution?

 

[mx wcfc]

Tom Robinson band and Steel Pulse were on the posters for the 1978 Victoria Park Carnival. Others came on board after the posters were printed and flyposted. On the day Clash was the headline band. Others included Elvis Costello and Siouxsie and the Banshees. Jimmy Pursey of Sham 69 also made an appearance.

Like I said, I didn't see the Banshees. I have googled, and I'm pretty sure Siouxsie and the the Banshees didn't play the Victoria Park gig, or the one in Brockwell Park that I also went to.

I don't remember them ever being near anything RAR, tbh.

 

[belboid]

Like I said, I didn't see the Banshees. I have googled, and I'm pretty sure Siouxsie and the the Banshees didn't play the Victoria Park gig, or the one in Brockwell Park that I also went to.

I don't remember them ever being near anything RAR, tbh.

I am sure you're right. Siouxsie was one of the ones who wore a swastika, to be 'provocative'

From an old melody maker piece:


The Banshees refuse to do a RAR gig.

Siouxsie: "The main thing is that you don't know where the money's going." (They plan to do some charity gigs in the not-too-distant future). John: "If you don't object to Jews or blacks or pink men or whatever, why should we play an RAR gig? There's an inverted snobbery there. If I was black, I'd be very insulted by RAR."

Siouxsie: "I'd rather do something like Rock Against Rabbit-Breeding. Men planting their sperm and watching women's bellies grow, when they don't have the means to support children, is very frightening." Then a little later: "I hate the extreme left and the extreme right because they're both wrong."


Great musicians often have shit politics, sadly.

 

[Serge Forward]

I was at this one, in 1978. And the March from Strangeways to Alexandra Park.

Link here: The "Northern Rock Against Racism Carnival.

They got the sound system from the Deeply Dale people. I was at that as well.

 

[Serge Forward]

Double post.

 

[tony.c]

Like I said, I didn't see the Banshees. I have googled, and I'm pretty sure Siouxsie and the the Banshees didn't play the Victoria Park gig, or the one in Brockwell Park that I also went to.

I don't remember them ever being near anything RAR, tbh.

Yes you are right. Sorry, I didn't remember correctly. I was thinking of Polly Styrene and X-Ray Spex. I didn't know that much about punk at that time, and almost fifty years later I only remembered it was a female punk singer.

 

[hitmouse]

I am sure you're right. Siouxsie was one of the ones who wore a swastika, to be 'provocative'

From an old melody maker piece:


The Banshees refuse to do a RAR gig.

Siouxsie: "The main thing is that you don't know where the money's going." (They plan to do some charity gigs in the not-too-distant future). John: "If you don't object to Jews or blacks or pink men or whatever, why should we play an RAR gig? There's an inverted snobbery there. If I was black, I'd be very insulted by RAR."

Siouxsie: "I'd rather do something like Rock Against Rabbit-Breeding. Men planting their sperm and watching women's bellies grow, when they don't have the means to support children, is very frightening." Then a little later: "I hate the extreme left and the extreme right because they're both wrong."


Great musicians often have shit politics, sadly.

Some decidedly dodgy lyrical content as well, eg:

Skinheads in the Hong Kong Garden

On this day 40 years ago, Siouxsie and the Banshees released their debut single, ‘Hong Kong Garden’. Here’s what Siouxsie said about the song in an interview with Uncut magazine i…

creaseslikeknives.wordpress.com

Which is another reason why I reckon the original RAR had genuine value, in terms of making sure the politics of that moment were defined by the Clash/Specials/Gang of Four end of things more than the Banshees.

Also, people have been discussing how unlikely this is to reach participants/sympathisers of the riots, and I reckon that's true, but I suppose it is also the case that there's other stuff that can be useful as well. Like, getting people to make the jump from just not being that keen on racism to actively identifying as antifascists or antiracists is worthwhile, as is getting them from just identifying as antifascists to being in active contact with antifascist organisations, ready to turn up to mobilisations and so on. So I suppose this will still be worth it if the next generation of squads comes from the Paloma Faith fanbase?

 

[Fozzie Bear]

Also worth pointing out that the posturing seemed to be time-limted:

"In 1981 a friend and I went to a Banshees gig in Bracknell. As the band went on, the hall was invaded by a relatively large and particularly vicious bunch of skinheads. The first song was begun, the first Seig Heils competed for attention. You may remember that, as a member of punk’s first in-crowd, Siouxsie had been especially fond of wearing the swastika. She had some making up to do and, by the shocked look on her usually inscrutable face, she knew it.

The room was awash with evil vibes. Security was conspicuous by its absence.

The song was abruptly ended, and Siouxsie left the stage. Chaos ensued and the meatheads scented blood. Just as my mate and I were deciding whether to cut and run, a cheer went up. Siouxsie bounded back onstage, resplendent in a Star of David T-shirt. ‘This one’s called “Israel”, she hollered into the void, ‘and you cunts’ – she picked out some bald heads in the centre of the room- ‘CAN JUST KISS MY FUCKING ARSE!!!’

The song began and, to a man and woman, every frightened skinny goth-type turned and stared at said cunts. Now these Nazi scum were obviously not the brightest sparks you ever met. But they were bright enough to realize that, pale and straggly as most of us were, we outnumbered them about

20 to 1. They slunk out. The gig was wonderful. ‘Israel’ is still my favourite Banshees song.”

Garry Mulholland in “This Is Uncool – The 500 Greatest Singles since Punk and Disco”

(I daresay the lyrics to "Israel" haven't stood the test of time either, but you get the point...)