Redcar Save Our Steel, Port Talbot and UK steelworks fight for their future

[Sprocket.]

A perfect storm then - given that so many of the best welders are retired or approaching retirement now, having not been replaced.

Yes just as we are about to embark on a new generation of nuclear power stations.
But I must admit some of the best welders I have been privileged to work with have been Chinese and South Korean craftspeople,
maybe they will migrate over here to help us out in the future, specialist skills are always welcome during shortages.

 

[billy_bob]

 

[Artaxerxes]

Dailymash sums things up well.

 

[treelover]

It makes me sigh to hear that Camerloon and his cabinet wait until the axe falls before convening an 'emergency' meeting about the crisis in the steel industry, just seen this announcement,

Nationalisation not the answer to steel crisis, says David Cameron

And I am strangely not shocked, this laissez faire attitude to manufacturing is criminal and successive governments have been guilty of looking the other way whilst cheap inferior products drive workers here to despair and unemployment.

For years, until the beginning of 2015, the Chinese Governments reduced export tax on alloy steels, the amount of Boron, Chromium and copper within their steel to allow the dodging of paying this tax flooded the world markets with cheap, potentially dangerous products.
The amount of Boron in steel which is well over the standards set have allowed thousands of tons of Re Bar into construction sites across the planet.
Boron makes this steel more difficult to weld correctly as it requires more specialist welds to be used, these are only apparent up to 48 hours after the weld has cooled, when fracturing at the weld point becomes visible by that time most are encased in concrete.
Ah well, as long as the multi millionaire's families are not involved in any disasters everything will be okay and besides the welders will be blamed more than likely!

Are you saying we can expect more Ronan Point type scenarios?

 

[treelover]

Paul Mason on it

Steel crisis: they do not give a shit — Mosquito Ridge

Not seen him as angry as that for quite a while, the Sheffield/Rotherham connection?

 

[teqniq]

I originally posted these on the other Redcar thread reposted here as I still think especially in light of recent developments that they are relevant.

Well quelle surprise it would appear that ministers are prepared to crawl so far up the people's republic of China's arse it would need cave rescue to to extract them. I wonder who and how many palms have been greased?

Ministers 'blocking higher Chinese steel tariffs' - BBC News

UK ministers were among the "ringleaders" blocking higher tariffs on Chinese steel, the body representing the UK steel industry has told AMs.

UK Steel policy chief Dominic King also accused the EU of saying to Chinese producers "please dump here".

In January, Tata announced it was cutting 750 steel jobs in Port Talbot, out of more than 1,000 going in the UK.

Welsh Secretary Stephen Crabb said the UK government would continue to do "all it can" to help the industry.

Leading figures from the steel sector were giving evidence to the assembly's enterprise and business committee on Thursday.

Also, I can't see this being talked about/reported anywhere else but Twitter



E2a

Company supplying Swedish steel for Navy's warships is owned by Tory donor

 

[Sprocket.]

Are you saying we can expect more Ronan Point type scenarios?

You can never say never, but it should be a concern. The problems were being reported from a few years back, they have allegedly been corrected but you have to be aware and wondering. What if some have developed faults since fabrication.
Hopefully we never find out.

 

[Smokeandsteam]

Not seen him as angry as that for quite a while, the Sheffield/Rotherham connection?

Possibly, but he has quit Channel 4 and gone freelance so he possibly also feels less constrained?

 

[weltweit]

Interesting article by Paul Mason with which I largely agree.

Although you could be a neoliberal and believe in the market but take action because of market abuses, namely the dumping of cheap steel by the Chinese. Not only British politicians but also the EU should be pushing for this, otherwise the owners of EU Steel Inc will have no option but to close down.

 

[gawkrodger]

and from the Torygraph

Britain sacrifices steel industry to curry favour with China

 

[brogdale]

Interesting article by Paul Mason with which I largely agree.

Although you could be a neoliberal and believe in the market but take action because of market abuses, namely the dumping of cheap steel by the Chinese. Not only British politicians but also the EU should be pushing for this, otherwise the owners of EU Steel Inc will have no option but to close down.

Spirited, I'll say that, but any article that states...

Looking at the self-created shambles Cameron is trying to handle now, I begin to doubt whether this cabinet would have even saved the banks in 2008 had it been in power.

...leaves you wondering if Mason really does know who's in power.

 

[J Ed]

Spirited, I'll say that, but any article that states...

​

...leaves you wondering if Mason really does know who's in power.

Here, or in the US prior to Obama...

 

[weltweit]

Are there steel plants facing closure in Germany or France or Spain? I expect they are experiencing the same issues of dumped Chinese steel.

 

[brogdale]

Could have gone in a number of threads, but this most relevant...

 

[treelover]

He says you can't be sentimental. etc, where on earth did he get his moderate Mr Jovial Nice Guy reputation from?

 

[Geoffrey Kerr]

Steel v Banks: Why they're different when it comes to a government bail-out what a load of rubbish from the BBC who are apologists for the government. Big money matters more than Human Beings to these people.

 

[weltweit]

Radio news is saying there have been numerous meetings between Tata and UK government ministers in recent months.

 

[William of Walworth]

and from the Torygraph

Britain sacrifices steel industry to curry favour with China

Heavy Brexit-oriented spin in that article.

But TBF, even a Telegraph-loather like me would find it tough to disagree with plenty of that.

 

[weltweit]

I hear mutterings that government is prevented from helping the steel industry directly by EU rules, but they did not prevent the Labour government nationalising the banks!

 

[William of Walworth]

Paul Mason on it

Steel crisis: they do not give a shit — Mosquito Ridge

From that far, far better than the Telegraph article :

Repeat after me. They do not give a shit.

Spot on

 

[agricola]

Heavy Brexit-oriented spin in that article.

But TBF, even a Telegraph-loather like me would find it tough to disagree with plenty of that.

This is an area where European policy is terrible though, largely (as AEP points out) because of our government's influence.

 

[William of Walworth]

This is an area where European policy is terrible though, largely (as AEP points out) because of our government's influence.

I would agree about EU policy being inadequate. To say the least and to understate wildly.

But right now, I'm more inclined to blame Tories (and the utterly unrestricted free market that Tories like Javid absolutely love) than "Brussels Bureaucrats".

The latter have been slow, inefficient bureaucrats.

And in a far from close race for condemnation : Cameron hasn't given a shit.

agricola : You yourself said earlier up that the UK steel industry should/could have been the most viable and successful in the world, if I recall your post correctly.

Is the EU (and whatever policy that's well open to criticism from them), really to blame for everything?

 

[agricola]

I would agree about EU policy being inadequate. To say the least and to understate wildly.

But right now, I'm more inclined to blame Tories (and the utterly unrestricted free market that Tories like Javid absolutely love) than "Brussels Bureaucrats".

The latter have been slow, inefficient bureaucrats.

And in a far from close race for condemnation : Cameron hasn't given a shit.

agricola : You yourself said earlier up that the UK steel industry should/could have been the most viable and successful in the world, if I recall your post correctly.

Is the EU (and whatever policy that's well open to criticism from them), really to blame for everything?

The EU has been bad over this, but as whilst it is their policy much of the inspiration behind it has been successive British governments; this shower are the worst but its hard to think of any one of them post-1979 that would have acted any differently.

As for the second bit of your post, what I said was:

There isn't even the argument that this is an inefficient business - for those sites to have survived this long, with so little state support and in the market they are in proves they are probably are the most efficient plants in the world.

... which I think is true.

 

[William of Walworth]

I was too lazy just now to go back and find that section (above) of your much earlier post, but that last paragraph above ....

 

[redsquirrel]

I would agree about EU policy being inadequate. To say the least and to understate wildly.

But right now, I'm more inclined to blame Tories (and the utterly unrestricted free market that Tories like Javid absolutely love) than "Brussels Bureaucrats".?

You making the (wrong) assumption that there is some real difference between the two - that they are in opposition rather than being the same scum.

 

[William of Walworth]

redsquirrel -- so recent talk of EU restrictions on Chinese steel imports was all wrong then? Unless I've been completely misinformed, I'd picked up that Javid had been opposed to any such measure. See that post from brogdale that I requoted earlier up.

 

[brogdale]

redsquirrel -- so recent talk of EU restrictions on Chinese steel imports was all wrong then? Unless I've been completely misinformed, I'd picked up that Javid had been opposed to any such measure. See that post from brogdale that I requoted earlier up.

Today's FT front-page..

 

[weltweit]

I suppose there may have been some EU concern that if the EU raised tariffs against Chinese steel there could be rebound measures taken against European firms operating in China.

 

[brogdale]

I suppose there may have been some EU concern that if the EU raised tariffs against Chinese steel there could be rebound measures taken against European firms operating in China.

Maybe, but certainly the case that UK government blocked any chance to raise tariff level against steel dumping; Javid made that explicit to commons BIS:-

 

[Smokeandsteam]

I suppose there may have been some EU concern that if the EU raised tariffs against Chinese steel there could be rebound measures taken against European firms operating in China.

How much stuff do we/Europe export to China????

The rules of the game are not about a carefully balanced set of tariffs they are about a race to the bottom in terms of wages and prices.