This from earlier in the year was sublime:
Cook pass babridge?
Oxford Circus station bombed on Christmas day (graffiti)
- Thread starter Bahnhof Strasse
- Start date
Cook pass babridge?
keybored
Well done. You remember cat good.
Just spray "I really hate cars a lot", they'll work it out.
NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
How does graffiti "devalue" property in any sense that actually matters? Personally I think it usually looks cool. You clearly disagree. Neither of us get a say either way. Both of us can still get to where we're going.
As a long-term user of public transportation, I've seen the back-the-forth between graffiti artists and whoever's paying people to remove it over and over. I don't know if there's an endgame to this state of affairs, the taggers and piecemakers clearly aren't giving up. I'm not aware if the industry has any big plans for dealing with this beyond just doing a big sweep every now and again, which then gets eroded before the next one.
It's also been going since long before I was born, so kindly fuck off with the snide personal attacks.
Who says I wouldn't live in my car? I'd be able to personalise it, I'd keep some of my tools in there, I'd eat in it and possibly sleep in it on occasion. It would be exclusively used by me, because otherwise the insurance would cost too much for any income I'd realistically have. I don't get to hang a pair of fuzzy off the mirrors of a train. That would be up to the driver, contingent on policies regarding workspace personalisation.
NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
The myriad of train companies mismanaging the railways in the name of "competition" are a spawn of Thatcher. Why should I weep tears because an actual human being dared to impinge on their corporate aesthetic?
NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
Surely the spunking cock is Urban-approved?
teuchter
je suis teuchter
The same actual humans use them, regardless of who owns them on paper.
teuchter
je suis teuchter
It's all about you, you, you.
Are you confident that most public transport users agree with you?
teuchter
je suis teuchter
Are any of these things incompatible with me sneaking in to redecorate now and again, when you're out? I wouldn't take any of the tools, just spray paint some messages on them in a way that didn't directly affect their function. Sure, I might get some paint over the numbers on your tape measure, but I'd also cover up that "Stanley" corporate branding, and you can always pay someone to clean it off.
BristolEcho
Well-Known Member
Living in Bristol I have grown to be irritated with the scene around street art, or rather the people that adopted it, but really love tagging and one liners which seem to cause outrage for those same people.
Plus there was a classic this year:
Not a fan of the covid stuff.
Plus there was a classic this year:
Not a fan of the covid stuff.
editor
hiraethified
Wouldn't you be a tad miffed if you found yourself on a long train journey but couldn't see a fucking thing because SLASHEZ87 or whoever had sprayed his tag all over your window?
FridgeMagnet
Administrator
I think it has to be on a ballot paper.
NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
Yes, and they still get to use them in spite of the graffiti. So what's your point?
Well excuse me for not being so cocking presumptuous as to assume the ability speak for others! Fuck me, how dare I be someone with personal opinions.
Seriously, who can I honestly speak for apart from myself?
I'm agnostic on that question. Why should I assume either way? Since you brought it up, does this mean you have any polling or some such that you'd like to share with us?
Well for a start it means there's some creep out there who wants to intrude on my personal space for some batshit reason. I'd say that's reason enough to stop it.
hitmouse
music obfuscation technology
Are you confident that most public transport users think that advertising on trains looks cool? Like, fair enough to object specifically to people spraying over windows or whatever, but when it comes to "shit on public transport that someone else has decided that I should see and that I don't get any say in", I can think of things on public transport, or any public space space really, that are a lot more egregious than just seeing someone's tag.
Artaxerxes
Look out, he's got a gnu!
I'd quite like a "right of reply" for adverts so you could happily scrawl cocks on the latest bollocks by HSBC or Invisalign.
maomao
普費斯
Just carry a sharpie. No one will stop you.
NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
Funnily enough, I once came across a train carriage with the windows painted over. It was an unusual enough sight for me to get out my phone and snap a couple of pics:
Internal and external view.
RoyReed
Must fly!
General Post Office, O'Connell Street, Dublin - 1976
Freedom fighters are not criminals by Roy Reed, on Flickr
editor
hiraethified
I've found myself in one too once. And yes it was both unusual and fucking shit, seeing as I couldn't see any of the countryside because of some twat tagger. But you didn't answer my question...Funnily enough, I once came across a train carriage with the windows painted over. It was an unusual enough sight for me to get out my phone and snap a couple of pics:
Internal and external view.
NoXion
Craicy the Squirrel
Can't honestly say it bothered me. I'm usually reading something on train journeys. I'm much more miffed at the fact that our rail network is being used as a cash cow.
editor
hiraethified
I don't like that either, but the cost of having to scrape off shit tags and repaint carriages isn't going to help either.
davesgcr
Reading books
With about 20% rail passenger usage (if that !) - all the operators and LUL are on a cost basis +1.5% fee for operating. What revenue comes in goes to the DfT , who are shelling out about £800M a month to keep the trains running. Freight is busy but does not contribute much revenue.
So , any cleaning costs for this - and other similar vandalism goes on the cost budget. Picked up by HMG. This of course diverts cleaning staff off other work.
So , any cleaning costs for this - and other similar vandalism goes on the cost budget. Picked up by HMG. This of course diverts cleaning staff off other work.
davesgcr
Reading books
Do not worry - as any heavily damaged train will probably go to depot as soon as it can be arranged , and cleaned. Usually on a night shift by people who could usefully be doing something more productive.
BigMoaner
What A Load of Old Bollocks
Or someone comes around your house and sprays a load of edgy tagz over your recently painted front room!
andysays
Love and solidarity
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
Haters of graf on public property, where do you stand on those morons who spray up the roads at cycling events? Surely another reason to ban road cycling if it encourages this level of cuntishness?
existentialist
Tired and unemotional
Notwithstanding all the pissed-offness at it, I think it is useful to see this kind of thing as a fairly straightforward phenomenon that occurs in most societies, and is, essentially, a societal one rather than an individual one. It's all very well suggesting that we wreak some terrible punishment on individuals, but that's not going to make the problem go away. The difficulty here is that pointing the finger at individual culprits, or denying any value or purpose in what they do, feels - and is - a lot easier than getting tangled up in all the behavioural and societal complexities that these things really represent.
Just for example, can we really expect young people, who may well have already fallen foul of a punitive benefits (including housing benefits) scheme and limited job opportunities, will feel that society cares little about them and owes them less, and that this might not lead to their feeling the need to express their views on that situation in ways which INEVITABLY will look like, and be, an attack on that society? Of course, we all know that there are far better ways of achieving change, but in the same way that harrumphing at graffiti FEELS like the best reaction to it, so to them spray-painting stuff (or any of the myriad other petty crimes usually associated with young people) FEELS like a more effective expression of their sense of outsiderness than, say, running for Parliament or starting up a leafleting campaign.
We'll "solve" the graffiti problem when we "solve" the problem of a huge swathe of disaffected, disengaged, angry, poverty-stricken people in our society.
Incidentally, I would be tempted to file an awful lot of the Covid denial stuff in the same box - people who have felt ignored by the system, suddenly being told by The System what to do, and experiencing an instant gut reaction of "fuck you, telling me what to do when I matter nothing to you" which gets rationalised nicely into a neat conspiracy-theory-driven set of behaviours.
Just for example, can we really expect young people, who may well have already fallen foul of a punitive benefits (including housing benefits) scheme and limited job opportunities, will feel that society cares little about them and owes them less, and that this might not lead to their feeling the need to express their views on that situation in ways which INEVITABLY will look like, and be, an attack on that society? Of course, we all know that there are far better ways of achieving change, but in the same way that harrumphing at graffiti FEELS like the best reaction to it, so to them spray-painting stuff (or any of the myriad other petty crimes usually associated with young people) FEELS like a more effective expression of their sense of outsiderness than, say, running for Parliament or starting up a leafleting campaign.
We'll "solve" the graffiti problem when we "solve" the problem of a huge swathe of disaffected, disengaged, angry, poverty-stricken people in our society.
Incidentally, I would be tempted to file an awful lot of the Covid denial stuff in the same box - people who have felt ignored by the system, suddenly being told by The System what to do, and experiencing an instant gut reaction of "fuck you, telling me what to do when I matter nothing to you" which gets rationalised nicely into a neat conspiracy-theory-driven set of behaviours.
existentialist
Tired and unemotional
I've no idea, but I am always intrigued, when that kind of claim is made in the media, to note the way in which "deprived" or "ignored" gets conveniently narrowly defined...
teuchter
je suis teuchter
Why are the disaffected not spraypainting the luxury SUVs of Chelsea? Or indeed the expensive vehicles of gentrifiers more local to them? Why always public transport and communal infrastructure?
It's a serious question. I think it's important to consider, and regardless of the rights and wrongs of the acts of graffiti artists, I do think that the policy we have in london/uk, which is to put quite a lot of effort into cleaning it up asap and generally not tolerating having buses and trains running around with graffiti on them, is the right one. Just like many people take pride in their private car or bike and keep it clean, the same should be true for public transport. Otherwise the message is that it's the lower status form of transport and belongs to a world that the aspiration should be to escape. This I suspect is why the golden sports cars of Mayfair don't get attacked - because they are something to be aspired to and represent the better part of society. I refuse to go along with that.
Before anyone starts with the whataboutery of adverts in trains and stations - yes I would prefer if this also didn't exist. I'd like public transport infrastructure to be something that is a joy to use and a source of communal pride. There's a little bit of this in the london transport system with the high level of care taken over signage design and so on. Moscow has its chandeliers in its metro stations.
It's a serious question. I think it's important to consider, and regardless of the rights and wrongs of the acts of graffiti artists, I do think that the policy we have in london/uk, which is to put quite a lot of effort into cleaning it up asap and generally not tolerating having buses and trains running around with graffiti on them, is the right one. Just like many people take pride in their private car or bike and keep it clean, the same should be true for public transport. Otherwise the message is that it's the lower status form of transport and belongs to a world that the aspiration should be to escape. This I suspect is why the golden sports cars of Mayfair don't get attacked - because they are something to be aspired to and represent the better part of society. I refuse to go along with that.
Before anyone starts with the whataboutery of adverts in trains and stations - yes I would prefer if this also didn't exist. I'd like public transport infrastructure to be something that is a joy to use and a source of communal pride. There's a little bit of this in the london transport system with the high level of care taken over signage design and so on. Moscow has its chandeliers in its metro stations.
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