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#occupy London....

Sunny Hundal: shill for capitalism

I want to make a broader argument, but first need to deal with a small point raised by Owen Jones in his front-page piece in the New Statesman this week.
“[Labour] are missing the boat,” John McDonnell MP tells Owen Jones on the issue of the occupations. Editor of Occupied Times Steve Maclean tells him: “I think a lot of people are very disappointed that there’s this grass-roots movement and sentiment, and Labour isn’t leading or driving it.”
I’m sorry but this is highly naive.

Ed Miliband is fully aware of the #occupy movement, here and in the United States. He keeps a track of online conversation better than many assume. The other day on PMQs he was channelling #OWS language:
http://liberalconspiracy.org/2011/1...dnt-have-to-endorse-occupylsx/#comment-327452
Click to expand...
 
eh, if Labour was leading or driving it then it wouldn't be a grassroots movement? :confused: Christ alone knows what Ed is "channeling" but it's more like the spirit of someone who hasn't a fucking clue.
 
articul8 said:
eh, if Labour was leading or driving it then it wouldn't be a grassroots movement? :confused: Christ alone knows what Ed is "channeling" but it's more like the spirit of someone who hasn't a fucking clue.
Click to expand...
Hundal hasn't got a clue. First he tells people to vote Lib Dem and then when the LDs are in power with the Tories, he becomes a Labour (EdM) supporter.

Labour don't take the lead and haven't done for as long as I can remember. They're too busy worrying about what the Tory press will think of them.

Keir Hardie must be spinning in his grave.
 
Of course they wouldn't lead it, what do you expect? you're being a bit unrealistic if you expect them to do so!
 
butchersapron said:
Isn't that exactly what you want your party to do though? You are to all intents this boards hundal.
Click to expand...

fuck off, how do you make that out? I "want" forces inside and outside the Labour party to take the idea of an alternative economic strategy much further than the soggy plan-B stuff spoken of by Balls. Where have I ever talked of the Labour leadership taking over the effective leadership of extra-parliamentary movements. it is neither feasible nor desirable.
 
You're the 'radical' PR face of the we must open up ideas and people outside of labour that MIliband has put forward, hundal is the middle of the road face. Same function. Same end in aim - join labour,vote labour, labour lead us. Stop lying to yourself.
 
treelover said:
'March to Parliament

Speakers:​
Caroline Lucas MP​
John Pilger​
Seumas Milne – Guardian​
Kate Hudson – Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament (CND)​
Josie Long – UK Uncut & award-winning comedian​

Aaron Kiely, NUS Black Students’ Campaign​
Stef Newton, NUS LGBT Campaign & National Campaign Against Fees & Cuts​
Weymam Bennett, Unite Against Fascism'​

oh dear, haven't they learn't anything in the last month? it could be a STW roster...
Click to expand...
No Gunpowder. No Treason. No plot.

Why not?
 
butchersapron said:
You're the 'radical' PR face of the we must open up ideas and people outside of labour that MIliband has put forward, hundal is the middle of the road face. Same function. Same end in aim - join labour,vote labour, labour lead us. Stop lying to yourself.
Click to expand...

I'm arguing specifically against "Labour lead us" - that Labour leadership of extra-parliamentary struggles is neither feasible nor desirable... But then you're not actually engaging with me, you're involved in some kind of psychotic conversation with another creature of your imagination.
 
articul8 said:
I'm arguing specifically against "Labour lead us" - that Labour leadership of extra-parliamentary struggles is neither feasible nor desirable... But then you're not actually engaging with me, you're involved in some kind of psychotic conversation with another creature of your imagination.
Click to expand...
Keep them in the background, their presence will not help the party. Let them come to us organically. Gotcha.
 
LM associate Ed West, chips in with another smear. This time he says,
Do the Occupy LSX protesters seriously think they're the British equivalent of Syria's rebels?

Nothing wrong with supporting the Syrian uprising, of course, and it’s interesting to see how technology can be used against authoritarian regimes (although the technology failed this time). But, once again, all sympathy for the Occupy movement disappears when they open their mouths: one activist is heard saying of the Syrians that “all our movements are components of the same thing”, while another claims that “Syria is part of the Occupation movement.” And a Syrian responds that they’re “similar causes”, claiming that “they’re fighting for their freedom against capitalism; we have our fight for freedom”.
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/e...ian-opposition-are-part-of-the-same-movement/
Click to expand...

Trust West to be dishonest. The neoliberal system that allowed the bankers to behave as they did has us all in chains. In that respect we are both fighting a similar fight. In Syria the fight is against a tyrannical regime and in the West, we're fighting against a capitalist system that may as well be a tyranny. I mean, no one asked to have services cut or privatised. In that sense alone, we live in a tyranny and if people like Ed West had their way the #Occupy camp would be broken up with extreme force.
 
butchersapron said:
This beast truly lives btw, he strides the land, he offers congrats to slimy blairists on promotion whilst talking left on here.
Click to expand...

Quite flattering having your own stalker. I've nothing to hide - which is why you know who I am or at least what my real name is (clearly you know much less than you think you do). I'm quite capable of having heated political arguments with people whilst at the same time remaining civil on a personal level. I see you aren't.
 
nino_savatte said:
LM associate Ed West, chips in with another smear. This time he says,

Trust West to be dishonest. The neoliberal system that allowed the bankers to behave as they did has us all in chains. In that respect we are both fighting a similar fight. In Syria the fight is against a tyrannical regime and in the West, we're fighting against a capitalist system that may as well be a tyranny. I mean, no one asked to have services cut or privatised. In that sense alone, we live in a tyranny and if people like Ed West had their way the #Occupy camp would be broken up with extreme force.
Click to expand...

I think this is something of an oversimplification. However, I do recall a quite prescient passage in Hannah Arendt’s book on violence where she argues that faceless bureaucracies (which I think better characterises our situation than the authoritarian sovereign rule of Syria) are the most tyrannical of all, not least as there doesn’t seem to be anyone to address your demands or direct your anger. In fact I think much of what’s going on in the Occupy movement is a symptom of this very problem.
 
God I weep for the hegemony of this thread's slight internet presence. Like peeps waving their hands in the air while sitting in chairs.
 
And where does one situate the armchair applauder within this system? Naughty; taking meals; the Faceless Bureaucracies etc.

Have I stumbled into a depression symposium too manic to acknowledge any discourse outside its own? Or is this one of them frilly frames for which Urban's (not) famous?
 
butchersapron said:
Tell you what teahead. Say something. If you're not going to, then don't.
Click to expand...
But yes fair enough. And goodness how far I'm having to reach back into this thread to find something to respond to. You old grouches. Gimme a second Mr Butchers. What is there to be said? A rhetorical sitaution hardly resides on some margin message board that believes it's well regarded by some poxy Grub Street.
 
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