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Many dead in coordinated Paris shootings and explosions

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Not seen the Stun, but just got this:

Do Muslims Support Terrorism? Sun Poll Headline At Odds With Grassroots Muslim Sentiment

23 November 2015

The Muslim Council of Britain today criticised the Sun newspaper for sensationalising poll findings claiming that 1 in 5 British Muslims supposedly had ‘sympathy for jihadis’. This is at variance with the belief held by the Muslim Council of Britain and the majority of British Muslims who have spoken out loudly and clearly against the terrorist murders in Paris.

The Sun headline states: 'Nearly one in five British Muslims has some sympathy with those who have fled the UK to fight for IS in Syria.' But the Survation poll commissioned by the newspaper asks respondents whether they had ‘sympathy with young Muslims who leave the UK to join fighters in Syria’. Tellingly, the question asked by Survation is about foreign fighters generally, not the murderous death cult of Daesh or ISIS specifically, or indeed ‘jihadis’ in general. As we know, foreign fighters belong to various backgrounds, fighting the brutal dictatorship of Bashar al-Assad and some are supported by the UK. Nevertheless, the Muslim Council of Britain has and will continue to warn against everyone going to Syria, a view backed by more than 71% of the respondents. We question why The Sun chose instead to lead with the minority view instead, which in itself is far from clear.

The incendiary newspaper headline comes a week after the horrific attacks in Paris by Daesh terrorists, an atrocity that has been unanimously condemned by Muslims everywhere; where the majority of mosques in the UK have stood up and said unanimously ‘not in our name’; and where the Muslim Council of Britain itself took out adverts in the national press to speak out against the murders.

Dr Shuja Shafi, Secretary General of the Muslim Council of Britain said: “Many Muslims will find this poll hard to believe. The vast majority of the almost 3 million British Muslims abhor terrorism. Poll after poll attest to this, as do the many surveys showing how almost all British Muslims would report someone from the Muslim community to the police, if they knew they were planning an act of violence.”

“Of course, even one person harbouring sympathy for the Daesh death cult is one too many. Terrorism is indeed a problem and many a British Muslim parent are worried whether their children may be lured to go off to in the chaos in Syria. But dubious headlines as that printed today in The Sun does not help matters. The grand strategy of Daesh is to divide our communities and stoke fear between communities. We should not play their game.”

The Muslim Council of Britain also questions the wisdom of such polls conducted soon after atrocities. Dr Maria Sobolewska of Manchester University has studied in depth the public opinion polls of British Muslims following the 2005 bombings in London, and has asked the same questions about support for terrorism among the non-Muslim British public. Dr Sobolewska says with certainty that public opinion polls have no value for estimating the number of prospective and likely extremists and terrorists.[1]

Caution was also expressed by Mr David Anderson QC, the government's Independent Reviewer of Terrorism Legislation. [2]

As it stands, the figures are inconclusive at best, and further research is required to understand whether we can draw any inferences from this poll.

Sources:
1. Can we ever estimate how many British Muslims will become Islamic extremists?, Mary Sobolewska, Can we ever estimate how many British Muslims will become Islamic extremists?

2. The Terrorism Acts in 2014: Report of the Independent Reviewer on the Operation of the Terrorism Act 2000 and Part 1 of the Terrorism Act 2006, By David Anderson QC, Section 9.20 https://terrorismlegislationreviewe.../Terrorism-Acts-Report-2015-Print-version.pdf
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The problem is that is all very reasonable and hardly responds to the Stun's irrationality.
 
Guardian admits its cowardice over Paris | Jonathan Cook's Blog

From the horse’s mouth: For fear of upsetting readers, the paper silenced any commentary in the first days after the Paris attacks that might have suggested there was a causal relationship between western foreign policy in the Middle East and those events.
Instead, writes the Guardian reader’s editor Chris Elliott, the paper waited several days before giving some limited space to that viewpoint:
On the Opinion pages, one factor taken into consideration was timing – judging when readers would be willing to engage with an idea that in the first 24 hours after the attacks may have jarred. The idea that these horrific attacks have causes and that one of those causes may be the west’s policies is something that in the immediate aftermath might inspire anger. Three days later, it’s a point of view that should be heard.
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J Ed said:
Guardian admits its cowardice over Paris | Jonathan Cook's Blog
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When I read that 'what we got wrong' piece in Guardian today what stuck out most was;
"One reader was disappointed that a feature on the Muslim victims of the attack opened with this sentence when it was first published on the web: “Their Muslim faith did not spare them from the terrorists’ bullets.” The reader wrote: “I wonder what the writer was trying to convey in the lead. Surely this was not a selective attack, and surely it was not the intention of the attackers to only kill people of one faith. Victims of terror always come from a wide cross-section of society, it hurts and hits everybody. So while you would be right to carry a story saying Muslims also were among those killed, in my view it’s a bit insensitive to say their faith did not or could not save them. They were surely not hoping it would, and I guess we know that it doesn’t.” I agree, and so did editors when the point was made to them. That line was removed within hours and was not in print editions." (said guardian editor)
 
I hope she sues the fuck out of the newspapers (hello, Daily Mail) who claimed she was the bomber as her life is in ruins now.

Woman seen in bubble-bath photo is alive and not Paris suicide bomber

CUQQd0CUkAA1ydX.png


Nabila.jpg


More: Woman mistaken for Paris jihadi lives in fear - CNN.com
 
editor said:
I hope she sues the fuck out of the newspapers (hello, Daily Mail) who claimed she was the bomber as her life is in ruins now.

Woman seen in bubble-bath photo is alive and not Paris suicide bomber

CUQQd0CUkAA1ydX.png


Nabila.jpg
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That's bloody outrageous, especially given the Mail's, ah...uncompromising stance on Muslims and terrorism.

I wonder if mac will do a cartoon about the mistake.

I, too, hope that she sues them to hell and back. Actually, it's probably a one-way trip - they must already qualify for hell.
 
Yeah, pretty messed up. :(
editor said:
I hope she sues the fuck out of the newspapers (hello, Daily Mail) who claimed she was the bomber as her life is in ruins now....
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E2a I dunno if there's a link to a vid there but there's one in this tweet

 
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J Ed said:
Guardian admits its cowardice over Paris | Jonathan Cook's Blog
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'The idea that these horrific attacks have causes...may inspire anger'.

I've had to read that several times today to absorb the full crass stupidity of it. The idea that things might have causes may inspire anger.

At the risk of sounding like a twat, I'm reading Badou's Polemics - there's a strong section about the response, especially in France, to 9/11 -

'the absolute condemnation of ‘terrorist’ actions and the symmetrical approval of reprisals...could and should precede any critical examination of the situation, and be abstracted from general political consideration,' & that 'to explain is already to justify. One ought to punish without delay and without further examination'.
 
Patteran said:
'The idea that these horrific attacks have causes...may inspire anger'.

I've had to read that several times today to absorb the full crass stupidity of it. The idea that things might have causes may inspire anger.
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Yes. And yet .. It's true (eg when i gently tried to suggest to someone last week that there were 'Why' questions to be asked,that it is not all about the uniquely bloodthirsty nature of muslims in general, they were furious, called me an apologist etc)

This is quite good:
“Well, Isis say they’re motivated by God.” Yes, and people who have sex with their pets say they’re motivated by love, but most of us don’t really believe them. "
Frankie Boyle on the fallout from Paris: ‘This is the worst time for society to go on psychopathic autopilot’
 
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laptop said:
Not seen the Stun, but just got this:



The problem is that is all very reasonable and hardly responds to the Stun's irrationality.
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The Scum's pollsters "Survation" have issued a statement today that distances themselves from the Scum's inflammatory use of the data...
Our view remains that the most meaningful way to interpret the results of this polling is in the proper context alongside a comparable sample of non-muslims, as we did in March of this year using identical methodology and the same question wording.

This comparison shows that “sympathy with” (distinct from “support for”) those travelling to fight in Syria (among any group) exists as a limited, minority view among both muslims and non-muslims, particularly among young people of both groups.

Such comparative polling was reported in March in a balanced way by Sky News “Poll: Majority Have No Sympathy With Extremists” and was largely uncontroversial at the time, despite the fact that that poll found higher levels of sympathy.

This latest poll in fact shows a fall in sympathy with fighters travelling to Syria among Muslims since March, something which we would consider the most pertinent new finding of that particular question.
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Why is it 'racial hatred' which accompanies criminal charges when a stoned 15 year old tweets something seen by a handful of people on twitter but when the Murdoch press incite racial hatred with an audience of millions it is considered 'journalism'?
 
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