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Labour leadership

free spirit said:
ffs - you do not need to win over tory voters to win the election, can you really not see how many of your natural voters you lose / have lost by that strategy?

More people didn't vote this election than voted tory, most of them are natural labour voters.

This strategy the labour party has followed is the reason those voters have disengaged entirely from the electoral process, it's why the likes of the SNP, Greens, Plaid, and even UKIP have taken big chunks out of you this election, and why the lib dems could previously from a left of labour position.

If you want to support tory policies why not join the tory party, if you want even vaguely left of centre policies then campaign on them or they'll never ever happen.
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How many elections have been won on the strategy you promote?
comrade spurski said:
we got a minimum wage set lower than what McDonalds paid, we got the ema grant for 6th form students while university tuition fees were raised, they did repeal section 28 but left all the anti union laws intact, our pensions were slaughtered, we had an ongoing pay freeze, unions did nothing for fear of damaging a labour government, billions were slashed from benefits which were then dished out to the banks...I could go on and on.
what they gave with one hand they more than took with the other.

during those years labour continuously told public sector workers that we were over paid and that the private sector pay ethos needed to be brought in - yet millions of us in the public sector were paid so little that we were entitled to claim working families tax credit (wftc)...(both me and my partner were council workers yet we still qualified for the wftc) so in effect they used benefits to help encourage low pay and to save employers money -they then complained that too many people were claiming benefits!

You can believe what you want...if the labour government was good for you then you are either a boss, rich, lucky or delusional.
If you think miliband was left wing then you are either a right winger, a liar or an idiot...there was NOTHING left wing about him or his leadership.
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Personally, I'm angry at a Tory victory because of how much worse and unequal the country has become under the coalition. I would prefer a Labour government.

But if you see no difference, don't worry about it.
 
free spirit said:
ffs - you do not need to win over tory voters to win the election, can you really not see how many of your natural voters you lose / have lost by that strategy?

More people didn't vote this election than voted tory, most of them are natural labour voters.

This strategy the labour party has followed is the reason those voters have disengaged entirely from the electoral process, it's why the likes of the SNP, Greens, Plaid, and even UKIP have taken big chunks out of you this election, and why the lib dems could previously from a left of labour position.

If you want to support tory policies why not join the tory party, if you want even vaguely left of centre policies then campaign on them or they'll never ever happen.
Click to expand...

I oppose the Tories. That's why I actually want them out - not from some pure position but from an electable one that means we can actually do something to make working people's lives better rather than rant and rave about it.

If we'd have won every liberal, SNP, Green, UKIP etc seat, we'd have lost.
 
AC14 said:
I oppose the Tories. That's why I actually want them out - not from some pure position but from an electable one that means we can actually do something to make working people's lives better rather than rant and rave about it.

Tories and UKIP = 51% of votes cast.
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If you want Kendall to win then what actual policies do you envisage her implementing or not implementing that would distinguish a Labour government with her as PM from a Tory government?
 
J Ed said:
If you want Kendall to win then what actual policies do you envisage her implementing or not implementing that would distinguish a Labour government with her as PM from a Tory government?
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Does she like Badgers?
 
AC14 said:
I oppose the Tories. That's why I actually want them out - not from some pure position but from an electable one that means we can actually do something to make working people's lives better rather than rant and rave about it.
Click to expand...

Do you only care about working people? What about people on benefits? What's your opinion of them and the size of the social security bill? Also, who did you used to be on Urban?
 
AC14 said:
For what it's worth, I want Kendall to win. She'll win the next General Election, particularly if Creasy is her foil.

I know this will stick in some people's throats, but so did Blair - and as I said earlier he did a lot of good despite his horrific failings.
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Why accept an ersatz Tory when you can have the real thing?

What "good things" did Blair do? The minimum wage (that no one can live on)?
 
AC14 said:
I oppose the Tories. That's why I actually want them out - not from some pure position but from an electable one that means we can actually do something to make working people's lives better rather than rant and rave about it.
Click to expand...

Since the election all the candidates have seemingly been banned from even mentioning working people. All the talk is of businesses, entrepreneurs, the 'aspirational' and various other ways of saying, 'we don't give a fuck about the working poor'.
 
AC14 said:
What, the one where I point out you're wrong.
Tell me, how many leaders to the left of Blair have won a GE in 40 years?
And how is the longest unbroken period of Labour power 'short term'?
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People like you are why labour didn't win a majority in the general election. You so alienated them that fuck it we're staying home or at least the tory seems like a normal.
 
All those disingenuous, arsehole Lab MPs who tweeted their backing for Corbyn whilst simultaneously covering their career arses with the "but I won't be voting for him" caveat. Sickening.
In ditching what was part of their core ideology, it's like they've reduced the notion of any meaningful socialist input to the level of the "Golden Buzzer" enabling the "joke" contestant to get through to the next round...to keep the punters happy.
:facepalm:
 
AC14 said:
How many elections have been won on the strategy you promote?


Personally, I'm angry at a Tory victory because of how much worse and unequal the country has become under the coalition. I would prefer a Labour government.

But if you see no difference, don't worry about it.
Click to expand...

You manage to answer nothing i raised ... just like the labour party and their supporters.
Millions were worse off under labour because they failed us yet you single mindedly refuse to acknowledge this fact.
Instead you continue to preach that kind cuts are ok. What is the point of a labour government if the rich continue to get rich while everyone else has less?
 
butchersapron said:
Right, John major is deciding the internal labour party election. Or if not his views should the ones people who have a vote line up with. Thanks tim. Glad that's been cleared up.
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John Major was merely meant to be my answer to ACT14's question

Tell me, how many leaders to the left of Blair have won a GE in 40 years?
Click to expand...
 
AC14 said:
If we'd have won every liberal, SNP, Green, UKIP etc seat, we'd have lost.
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but if you'd won their votes, you'd have won!

You dont seem to have noticed, but the people who have abandoned Labour weren't the AB, C1's (the beloved 'aspirational' voters). Labours share actually went up amongst that lot. It was the poor and the 'ordinary' working class that couldn't be arsed to turn out for this pathetic shower, for their austerity with a smile. If the appalling, so right-wing she makes Blair look like Lenin, Kendall wins, there is no way any of those millions will vote for her or her party. If they follow you, Labour will be completely dead.

Blairisms over, and not coming back, get over it.
 
Last edited:
"Moreover the changes introduced by Ed Miliband to the Labour leadership elections have unlocked the possibility of a people’s campaign for Corbyn. Previously Labour party members only counted for one third of the vote in the leadership election with the trades unions and MPs and MEPs commanding the rest. Miliband introduced a new category of membership – you can become a registered supporter of the party for £3 and vote in the leadership election."
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i'm tempted to spend £3 to vote for him - would be interesting to see what would happen if he won

i wonder how many people it would take to sign up and vote for him to swing it?
 
killer b said:
Nominations for Jeremy Corbyn's shadow cabinet, please.
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Kelvin Hopkins for shadow chancellor. John McDonnell for chief whip.
AC14 said:
I oppose the Tories. That's why I actually want them out - not from some pure position but from an electable one that means we can actually do something to make working people's lives better rather than rant and rave about it.

If we'd have won every liberal, SNP, Green, UKIP etc seat, we'd have lost.
Click to expand...

What about winning over some of their voters instead? Ed Balls lost by 422 votes. The Greens got 1,264 from a standing start. UKIP were up 13.4%. The Tories? A whole 3.5%.
 
ska invita said:
i'm tempted to spend £3 to vote for him - would be interesting to see what would happen if he won

i wonder how many people it would take to sign up and vote for him to swing it?
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Could you really stand one of that bunch of fucks more likely to win having an extra £3 in the coffers?
 
CNT36 said:
Could you really stand one of that bunch of fucks more likely to win having an extra £3 in the coffers?
Click to expand...

You'd need at least 200,000 people lined up and committed with their £3 ready to go in the pot. How many bought that Rage Against the Machine record for Christmas Number 1? Half a million wasn't it?
 
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