I particularly enjoyed Smith's meltdown over not getting the golden goodbye payment because she'd chosen to abandon her original seat and contest a completely different one
Keir Starmer's time is up
- Thread starter agricola
- Start date
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
SDP had low forties around their peak at Williams' 1981 Crosby by-election success (49% of popular vote). Seems like there's always a strong effort to divide the LP after the election of a left leader.At one point they had about 25% of the electorate supporting them I believe - Tinge probably don't even have 0.25%.
Parents were big SDP supporters back in the day
they got as high as 18% in one YouGov poll fwiw
Brainaddict
slight system overdrive
I see Starmer's lot have welcomed the massive splurge on the military, without even bothering to point out that if you've got 16bn to spend on toys for the military then maybe you could afford to not drive millions of children into poverty.
I have mostly refrained from saying 'I told you so' to all my friends who joined the LP, but this makes me want to say it.
I have mostly refrained from saying 'I told you so' to all my friends who joined the LP, but this makes me want to say it.
ska invita
back on the other side
It makes me wonder, how does there come to be such a gulf between Labour membership and Labour MPs...but then the membership just comfortably elected Sir Starmer, so the mystery is solved.
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
It does, until you meet Labour Party members. Latter day Beatrice Webb’s....
ska invita
back on the other side
Id be quite interested to see some deep stats on the membership makeup and attitudes
The "boomer" thing can be a bit crude, but I've seen it apply to even very active, seemingly committed older LP members - I expect there's a sizeable generational divide within the ranks (which is not to dismiss solid older members).
And as to senior Trade Unionists....again anecdotal, but from my small experience of them as a group, a sizeable amount seem to live in a very different financial world.
Blairs "middle class revolution" definitely had a strong base in the 90s - and an intake of MPs that reflected it - but I expect its dwindling and ageing.
Kevbad the Bad
Amiable Bowel Syndrome
Many of those who voted for Lord Starmer did so with misgivings. The choice was widely felt to be selecting the best of a pretty poor bunch. All of whom had to be MP's, so that already narrows it down enormously. I bet if there had been a 'none of the above' option it would have done very well.
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
Under Milord Keir, Calmer Police?
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
Here’s a useful starter (pamphlet is linked in the article;Northern Discomfort)
Like their MP’s the membership is increasingly of the professional middle class, southern, city dwelling and comfortable.
As I say, latter day Beatrice Webb’s prone to social exploration and charitable works among the racist, beer swilling, Brexit voting lower orders
Unity updates: some former Labour MPs who lost last year sticking the boot in
Drew was MP for Stroud between 1997 & 2010 and again from 2017-19. Very well thought of, generally considered a good bloke locally and I'm told he is absolutely fuming atm. Lost narrowly in Stroud thanks in no small part to a Green campaign that came nowhere near winning but arguably took enough votes off Labour to let the Tories through
Walker was MP for Colne Valley between 2017 & 2019
Click through to that Drew tweet and you'll see Walker agreeing with him and then Anna Turley (Redcar 2015-19) taking issue with them both
Drew was MP for Stroud between 1997 & 2010 and again from 2017-19. Very well thought of, generally considered a good bloke locally and I'm told he is absolutely fuming atm. Lost narrowly in Stroud thanks in no small part to a Green campaign that came nowhere near winning but arguably took enough votes off Labour to let the Tories through
Walker was MP for Colne Valley between 2017 & 2019
Click through to that Drew tweet and you'll see Walker agreeing with him and then Anna Turley (Redcar 2015-19) taking issue with them both
Last edited:
ska invita
back on the other side
cheers
though one place I do know a bit about is London - slightly different issue as this is about voters not members, but these maps stick in my mind - I dont think its fair to say Labour in London can be boiled down to "professional middle class, southern, city dwelling and comfortable"
darker red represent "White British" as a percentage of population
Its the (generally poorer) "inner city" and ethnically diverse areas that support Labour in 2019, but that pattern goes back some - I remember a similar map when Boris Johnson won the mayorship
I think its easy to make stereotypical generalisations, however much truth they have, but I think only a really thorough bit of surveying of the membership would show up the complexities of it all
-----------
Anyhow, really good recommendations from the pamphlet, who could argue:
To this end Labour should consider the following ideas.
a) Party structures
● Abandon the notion that we do not need to resource traditionally ‘safe’ Labour seats,
embed and massively expand our community organising model in these places to
empower and win for local people;
● Remove all barriers to ensuring carers, cleaners, factory workers and people from the
gig economy and other low-paid industries can have their voices heard in the party and
can more easily stand for elected office.
- Review membership pricing structures and lead a mass recruitment drive in
communities with ‘Northern’ characteristics. ○ Ensure reserved places on
Labour’s NEC
- Adopt protected shortlists for people from these backgrounds;
● Review an increased role for individual “opted in” trade unionists within our party
structures;
● Mirror calls for a new constitutional settlement in the UK with a complete overhaul of
party structures implementing a federalised structure built from regions and nations with
an NEC that reflects this;
● Form a Greater Northern Caucus that includes representatives elected from MP’s,
Councillors, the Membership and the Trade Unions with an annual conference. This
could be an independent Northern Labour Party, much like that in Scotland;
● Set up a Northern Socialist Network to bring together the labour movement in the North
and strengthen our collective voice.
b) Labour policies and values which could be considered
● Commit to ending austerity and to build universal, local public services, with resources
allocated to communities on the basis of need. Money alone, handed down on high, will
not be enough, so we envisage introducing mechanisms by which local people can
participate and have a greater say in their services, without reverting to the service
“choice” model of New Labour;
● The creation of a Working Peoples Audit Office that reviews the impact of every piece of
legislation on the lives of ordinary people;
● Set up an extensive ‘Marshall Plan’ which includes the North and other deprived areas
of the UK to target spending on post-industrial and coalfield communities to support
developing industries and encourage specialisation - for example ensuring a Green New
Deal has statutory objectives which guarantee social, economic and cultural outcomes;
● A policy of full employment based on full-time, permanent, purposeful green industries,
starting with held back areas, and implementing strong industrial relations laws including
collective sectoral bargaining;
● Turning the debate about regional pay on its head to address income inequality, much
like the system in Germany where the federal government ensures equality through
regional tax redistribution;
● Stem the brain drain from our heartlands and attract talented public servants to seek
employment in our working-class communities by breaking up and moving departments,
institutions and public bodies to the region. Incentivise or legislate for big businesses to
do the same;
● Establish a Citizens’ Wealth Fund to address wealth inequality, using wealth taxes and
asset sales (including assets in the Crown Estate);
● Create regional companies with the aim of taking publicly funded university research to
an end product and socialising its profits and in doing so create full employment, good
jobs and apprenticeships;
● Use procurement and state aid as an end to a market-driven economy.
c) Constitutional and political change
● Create a Council of the North to give a strong voice to the region;
● Set up a constitutional convention with citizens’ assemblies to discuss and debate the
future governance of the country, including debating the proposals in this pamphlet;
● Move beyond on the Tories’ city mayor deals to build genuinely rooted devolved
institutions which give expression to popular sovereignty;
● Argue for and in government implement a democratically elected Senate of the Regions
and Nations;
● Advocate a radical federal structure, including Regional Investment Banks and a
transformative devolution of power.
steveseagull
Well-Known Member
Oh dear oh dear. I suspect Keir Starmer's time might well and truly be up. In the short time as leader, he has been the biggest disaster the Labour Party has had for a long time.
The letter:
What an absolute shambles. He appears to be more into going after Corbyn under pressure from right wingers than taking on the Tories
If only he had a good lawyer
skwawkbox.org
The letter:
- condemns the ‘double jeopardy’ and ‘deliberate political interference’ of withdrawing the whip from Corbyn after he was reinstated by an NEC panel
- makes clear that the decision of the panel was based on independent legal advice and the recommendation of Labour’s disciplinary investigative unit
- implies that their advice was that there were no valid grounds for Corbyn’s suspension
- confirms that the whip had been restored to Corbyn on the lifting of his suspension, making an utter mockery of Starmer’s excuse that he was ‘not restoring’ the whip rather than withdrawing it
- makes clear that the meddling in the disciplinary outcome is exactly that kind of ‘political interference’ the EHRC has ruled unlawful
- accuses Starmer and other right-wing MPs of smearing the NEC panel members who acted in accordance with the party’s rules and the legal advice they gave
- says that Starmer has put NEC members in a legal bind – and that as a highly-qualified barrister he has no excuse for his ‘unconscionable’ choice
- demands that Evans rebuke Starmer for his political interference in party processes and undermining public confidence in Labour’s disciplinary process
- ‘requires’ Evans to immediately ‘demand’ that Starmer upholds the NEC panel’s decision and restores the whip to Corbyn
What an absolute shambles. He appears to be more into going after Corbyn under pressure from right wingers than taking on the Tories
If only he had a good lawyer
Exclusive: explosive letter to party from 14 NEC members orders general secretary to rebuke Starmer and instruct him to immediately restore whip to Corbyn
Unique window on disciplinary process gives damning view on actions of Labour hierarchy – condemning ‘deliberate political interference’ and making clear Corbyn was reinstated on …
skwawkbox.org
steveseagull
Well-Known Member
At this point he needs to tell the Board of Deputies and right wing trolls that hang on to fuck off and start listening to socialist Jewish party members of which I am one. Until he does this, the party is finished.
Puddy_Tat
happy mew year
that's been the case since about 2015...
steveseagull
Well-Known Member
The list of CLPs that are passing motions of support for Corbyn and condemning Starmer is growing by the minute. A hell of a lot of socialists lent Starmer their vote in order to calm things down. I have seen committed centrists going ape shit over his suspension tonight.
steveseagull
Well-Known Member
Camberwell and Peckham CLP passed an 80-1 motion this evening in support of Corbyn and that CLP has a fair share of centrist dads in it.
Raheem
Well-Known Member
TBF, nuff respect to the 1.
danny la rouge
I have a cheese grater in the dishwasher.
So they opted for the cop who even has “sir” in his name as a warning?
FFS, how long does it take Labour members to work out that the party isn’t a vehicle for worthwhile change?
Kevbad the Bad
Amiable Bowel Syndrome
I think many have worked that out, but are deciding where to go next. Others have invested such a lot in Labour that they are reluctant to go just yet.
I quite agree the 'sir' should have been a warning, but the other choices were also off-putting to many. One was a prominent Brexiteer (oh no, don't start that again), the other a professed devout Catholic. And smarmy Starmie lied about party unity and stuff.
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
I wonder how many people that genuinely applies to. Sure, some will have. Those of us who have been in the same boat in respect of political activity will totally get how they are feeling and thinking.
But, for others - the vast majority?? - has the experience really been much more than online activity, ‘defend Jeremy’ stuff, maybe some canvassing and mindless and endless psychodrama.
I don’t sense an army of battle hardened activists unwilling and unable to see all of the good work squandered. I do sense a cycling of people out of political activity and/or single issue stuff. I also get the sense that it’s been a movement that’s barely left a footprint in the snow in respect of political education and real activity
Last edited:
Did anyone give this any consideration all when deciding to vote? I find that pretty hard to believe.
Well if they didn't, it wasn't for the want of trying by some.
Paul Mason
@paulmasonnews
·
Jan 17
I've just signed this open letter to the Labour leadership candidates. I don't want Labour's policy on reproductive rights dictated by the Vatican, thanks.
Similar threads
