Jeremy Corbyn's time is up

[Knotted]

I'll concede it might have been too small for him to make out if the fellow on the right looked like Alf Garnett.

 

[Pickman's model]

The mural thing.

Just exactly what happened?

Was he asked online to endorse some sort of campaign to stop the mural being remove and told it's about capitalism and poverty and some Tory councillor has objected to it. Has he seen a copy of the mural on his phone, thought about it for anything up to a minute and sent a supportive message?

Is that what happened? Or was he aware of the allegations of anti Semitism, did he have a chance to see the mural on anything larger than a phone screen, and decide and due consideration and reflection to support it anyway? ( I genuinely don't know).

Tbh you don't need to see the mural to know something there's something dodgy about it, not when you see captain yvonne ridley praising it

 

[brogdale]

I'll concede it might have been too small for him to make out if the fellow on the right looked like Alf Garnett.

Wot, that Alf Garnett that wasn't Jewish, but his old man was always up the Synagogue?

 

[rummo]

He's not a massive racist by any stretch, but having done antiracist work does not give you a free pass and to be fair Corbyn isn't claiming it does either. How would that work if he did though? "What and after all I have done for you people?"

The way I look at it is that he tends to solidarise with plainly dodgy people (Mear One, Raed Salih) because they're the little guy or the oppressed guy or they're on-my-team guys. I used think he just didn't see what was wrong with the dodgy stuff, it's an oversight etc. Now I think he just doesn't care or at least it doesn't factor significantly into his political calculations. This solidarity instinct is great in many cases (and exceptional for a Labourite) except it can't just be the blanket response. Thinking about this long after it matters, with respect to that mural I can't believe that someone of his experience, who has moved in the circles he has, has not seen conspiracy stuff and not seen it as a red flag. I think he just thought there were more important free speech/"anti-capitalist" concerns to pursue. Maybe this sort of failure counts as racism or maybe not, but it's really fucking disappointing.

It's still a shame we didn't have a Corbyn led Labour government, it would have been nice to give social democracy a chance after 40 years to at very least see it's limitations. And my thinking these days with the climate crisis, there is genuine environmental (if not necessarily class) value in something like the green new deal. That was probably the last gasp of such politics and we're unlikely to see it again.

Anyway he's not Labour leader any more and it's pretty pointless banging on about all this except he's not the only one with this sort of problem.

The mural thing.

Just exactly what happened?

Was he asked online to endorse some sort of campaign to stop the mural being remove and told it's about capitalism and poverty and some Tory councillor has objected to it. Has he seen a copy of the mural on his phone, thought about it for anything up to a minute and sent a supportive message?

Is that what happened? Or was he aware of the allegations of anti Semitism, did he have a chance to see the mural on anything larger than a phone screen, and decide and due consideration and reflection to support it anyway? ( I genuinely don't know).

Tbh you don't need to see the mural to know something there's something dodgy about it, not when you see captain yvonne ridley praising itView attachment 243258

So Corbyn is to study the provenance of every tweet preceding his own (looks like 190 or so) in case, well just in case? How much time do you think he has available to deal with these sorts of requests?

Do you subject all politicians to this level of scrutiny? Hold them all to the same standards? Or is he singled out for special treatment?

 

[two sheds]

I think Pickmans had tongue slightly in cheek there

 

[Pickman's model]

So Corbyn is to study the provenance of every tweet preceding his own (looks like 190 or so) in case, well just in case? How much time do you think he has available to deal with these sorts of requests?

Do you subject all politicians to this level of scrutiny? Hold them all to the same standards? Or is he singled out for special treatment?

could you explain how looking on twitter has any bearing on the matter as yr and jc were on facebook

 

[Raheem]

Corbyn is making a "very exciting announcement" tomorrow afternoon.

 

[Pickman's model]

Corbyn is making a "very exciting announcement" tomorrow afternoon.

He's given up collecting pictures of manholes

 

[Raheem]

He's given up collecting pictures of manholes

I was thinking it would be jam-related.

He's reforming The Jam. That will be it.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

The mural thing.

Just exactly what happened?

Was he asked online to endorse some sort of campaign to stop the mural being remove and told it's about capitalism and poverty and some Tory councillor has objected to it. Has he seen a copy of the mural on his phone, thought about it for anything up to a minute and sent a supportive message?

Is that what happened? Or was he aware of the allegations of anti Semitism, did he have a chance to see the mural on anything larger than a phone screen, and decide and due consideration and reflection to support it anyway? ( I genuinely don't know).



So Corbyn is to study the provenance of every tweet preceding his own (looks like 190 or so) in case, well just in case? How much time do you think he has available to deal with these sorts of requests?

Do you subject all politicians to this level of scrutiny? Hold them all to the same standards? Or is he singled out for special treatment?

Is repetitive questioning rather than actual discussion, involving explaining what you're not sure about and why you're asking so that people can help you out and the overall level of knowledge in the world is improved, in any way useful behaviour? Or is it the sign of somebody who doesn't even know why they're asking what they are? Or is it worse than that and a facile attempt to bludgeon talking points into what is supposed to be a conversation?

DID YOU THREATEN TO OVERRULE HIM?

 

[rummo]

could you explain how looking on twitter has any bearing on the matter as yr and jc were on facebook
View attachment 243265

The same point applies, mutatis mutandis.

The way this has been amplified you'd think Corbyn had written a thesis on the bloody mural.

He's probably glanced at it for a few seconds on a small screen while dealing with a dozen other things.

I mean if he travelled all the way to the west country in the middle of a busy election campaign to be present at the unveiling of a statute erected to honour and celebrate an avowed anti Semite I could understand the fuss, but he didn't.

It was Boris Johnson who did that.

 

[Pickman's model]

The same point applies, mutatis mutandis.

The way this has been amplified you'd think Corbyn had written a thesis on the bloody mural.

He's probably glanced at it for a few seconds on a small screen while dealing with a dozen other things.

I mean if he travelled all the way to the west country in the middle of a busy election campaign to be present at the unveiling of a statute erected to honour and celebrate an avowed anti Semite I could understand the fuss, but he didn't.

It was Boris Johnson who did that.

And ridley's comment was one above corbyn's so no need to look through lots of other messages. A simple point: if yvonne ridley praises something it's best to re-examine the matter before commenting, Not sure why you're so invested in this. Don't tell me, I don't want to know. But you're being a bore and not bringing anything new to the table

 

[rummo]

Is repetitive questioning rather than actual discussion, involving explaining what you're not sure about and why you're asking so that people can help you out and the overall level of knowledge in the world is improved, in any way useful behaviour? Or is it the sign of somebody who doesn't even know why they're asking what they are? Or is it worse than that and a facile attempt to bludgeon talking points into what is supposed to be a conversation?

DID YOU THREATEN TO OVERRULE HIM?

Not sure what you're on about.

Not sure you do either.

There are people who set a lot of store by Corbyn's reaction to the mural so I assume they would know more about the ins and outs of the issue than I do, hence the questions.

Is that OK?

Good. As you were.

 

[killer b]

You can stalin this fucker off anytime you like tbh fridge.

 

[Pickman's model]

There are people who set a lot of store by Corbyn's reaction to the mural so I assume they would know more about the ins and outs of the issue than I do, hence the questions.

Non sequitur

 

[rummo]

And ridley's comment was one above corbyn's so no need to look through lots of other messages. A simple point: if yvonne ridley praised something it's best to re-examine the matter before commenting, Not sure why you're so invested in this. Don't tell me, I don't want to know. But you're being a bore and not bringing anything new to the table

I'd suggest I'm a lot less invested in it than you are.

The level of significance attached to Corbyn's involvement in this issue is utterly ridiculous. Absurd, if you like.

 

[Pickman's model]

I'd suggest I'm a lot less invested in it than you are.

The level of significance attached to Corbyn's involvement in this issue is utterly ridiculous. Absurd, if you like.

I've made maybe five comments about this over several years. You've attached yourself to this bone and seem reluctant to let it go. You can suggest what you want but tbh it's just not true

 

[rummo]

I've made maybe five comments about this over several years. You've attached yourself to this bone and seem reluctant to let it go. You can suggest what you want but tbh it's just not true

I think you'll find that any reference I've made to the issue has been in response to other posters mentioning it.

To me the mural thing is much ado about nothing.

It's the much ado about nothing that is the issue.

 

[Knotted]

The mural thing.

Just exactly what happened?

Was he asked online to endorse some sort of campaign to stop the mural being remove and told it's about capitalism and poverty and some Tory councillor has objected to it. Has he seen a copy of the mural on his phone, thought about it for anything up to a minute and sent a supportive message?

Is that what happened? Or was he aware of the allegations of anti Semitism, did he have a chance to see the mural on anything larger than a phone screen, and decide and due consideration and reflection to support it anyway? ( I genuinely don't know).

In my heart of hearts I don't think it was entirely an innocent mistake and I've explained why I think that. I can only speculate what was going through his mind, so I may be wrong and you and others may disagree with me and that's fine. It's not that it matters much now or even then. If it was just a stupid, hasty mistake then the fallout was still deserved and the extent of the broader problem that was revealed in that fallout was still alarming. I get the strong feeling you were never involved with these arguments at the time which is fine but as you've declared your disinterest in this episode why would I explain it to you in detail?

The fact that you are pursuing this line of questioning shows you don't understood the broader problem, you do not know what antisemitism looks like in practice. The fact that you just shrug this one off indicates that you aren't interested in it in the first place, you haven't bothered to look into it for yourself, so what am I to do? Spoonfeed you and watch you spit it out again? I'm not interested in doing that and I'm not interested in your bait and switches and gotchas. So that doesn't leave us with much to say to each other.

 

[Treacle Toes]

Corbyn is making a "very exciting announcement" tomorrow afternoon.

https://twitter.com/corbyn_project

?

 

[belboid]

Looks really exciting (not)

Jeremy Corbyn's Project for Peace and Justice: LIVE LAUNCH

Due to overwhelming demand, our launch will now be streamed for all, live from the Peace and Justice Project’s pages.

www.eventbrite.co.uk

 

[rummo]

In my heart of hearts I don't think it was entirely an innocent mistake and I've explained why I think that. I can only speculate what was going through his mind, so I may be wrong and you and others may disagree with me and that's fine. It's not that it matters much now or even then. If it was just a stupid, hasty mistake then the fallout was still deserved and the extent of the broader problem that was revealed in that fallout was still alarming. I get the strong feeling you were never involved with these arguments at the time which is fine but as you've declared your disinterest in this episode why would I explain it to you in detail?

The fact that you are pursuing this line of questioning shows you don't understood the broader problem, you do not know what antisemitism looks like in practice. The fact that you just shrug this one off indicates that you aren't interested in it in the first place, you haven't bothered to look into it for yourself, so what am I to do? Spoonfeed you and watch you spit it out again? I'm not interested in doing that and I'm not interested in your bait and switches and gotchas. So that doesn't leave us with much to say to each other.

'If it was just a stupid, hasty mistake then the fallout was still deserved'

If someone is guilty they should suffer the consequences. If someone is not guilty they should suffer the same consequences.

Ducking stool politics. Very progressive.

PS You maybe want to check what disinterest means.

 

[ska invita]

'If it was just a stupid, hasty mistake then the fallout was still deserved'

If someone is guilty they should suffer the consequences. If someone is not guilty they should suffer the same consequences.
5
Ducking stool politics. Very progressive.

PS You maybe want to check what disinterest means.

Perma banned for being "disruptive"? That's a new one. Don't think it would stand up in court.

 

[Pickman's model]

Perma banned for being "disruptive"? That's a new one. Don't think it would stand up in court.

Fortunately it'll never end up there

 

[two sheds]

Fucking hell Marty1 would be proud.

 

[Pickman's model]

Fucking hell Marty1 would be proud.

Yeh how can m1 stay now?

 

[Raheem]

'If it was just a stupid, hasty mistake then the fallout was still deserved'

If someone is guilty they should suffer the consequences. If someone is not guilty they should suffer the same consequences.

I've said before I don't think he understood what he was commenting on. But he was in an accountable position, as an MP at the time and then as a party leader. Those are positions where you have to take the consequences of your mistakes as well as your misdeeds. Or, at least sometimes you do.

 

[two sheds]

That's it lads and laddesses if we can get marty1 to say he doesn't think corbyn's an antisemite he's out

tall order though

 

[Treacle Toes]

That's it lads and laddesses if we can get marty1 to say he doesn't think corbyn's an antisemite he's out

tall order though

He's back here in two days time...get planning your best 'gotcha' questions.

 

[krtek a houby]

A one note poster, but still, it's a rum do. Guess his or her time was up, too.