Jeremy Corbyn's time is up

[belboid]

It rarely is in truth. But publicly attempting it does help people put down their cudgels and start again.

You are woefully naive if you think the Labour right are or would ever be interested in putting down cudgels and uniting with the left. They never ever have, they constantly work to undermine and oppose it. Scum like Margaret 'rights for whites' Hodge should have been kicked out years ago, but it's never the right that gets kicked out, for some reason.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

How do you see it panning out?

No idea. Corbyn rowed back significantly on his initial statement and still had the whip withheld from him. That was a moment when the situation could have been defused. Starmer chose instead to light another fuse.

 

[Mr Moose]

You are woefully naive if you think the Labour right are or would ever be interested in putting down cudgels and uniting with the left. They never ever have, they constantly work to undermine and oppose it. Scum like Margaret 'rights for whites' Hodge should have been kicked out years ago, but it's never the right that gets kicked out, for some reason.

I’m only talking about the specific issue of antisemitism.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I’m only talking about the specific issue of antisemitism.

Why do you think Margaret Hodge, for example, has zeroed in on the specific issue of antisemitism?

Follow-up question:

Do you think Margaret Hodge's definition of antisemitism includes or excludes the right to criticise Israel for its treatment of the Palestinians?

 

[Mr Moose]

Seems to me the clpl are fighting with him

I think it’s possible they left him in the shit knowingly when the EHRC report was published. You’d have thought they would have reached out to him before then to try to agree a press strategy.

It would certainly be open to Starmer to take a different view to reinstating the whip, but then he’d have spent this week defending that action to all comers. Looks like he thought fuck that for a game of soldiers. Whether that’s simply the outcome he wanted or not, the balls in Jeremy’s court to think his way through it. I would suggest going to court on a wave of outrage will simply stir more shit.

 

[Mr Moose]

Why do you think Margaret Hodge, for example, has zeroed in on the specific issue of antisemitism?

Follow-up question:

Do you think Margaret Hodge's definition of antisemitism includes or excludes the right to criticise Israel for its treatment of the Palestinians?

Look it’s quite clear that many people pushing Corbyn about antisemitism don’t give a single shit about any other form of racism or oppression.

That doesn’t mean supporters get to abuse them with no consequence.

 

[killer b]

What’s the Red Wall view of left wing people who conduct themselves like that?

The red wall just voted for Boris Johnson, they clearly don't give a shit how people conduct themselves. No-one does really so fair enough

 

[two sheds]

I would suggest going to court on a wave of outrage will simply stir more shit.

He's not the one bringing the court case though if you're talking about the John Ware one.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

It would certainly be open to Starmer to take a different view to reinstating the whip, but then he’d have spent this week defending that action to all comers. Looks like he thought fuck that for a game of soldiers.

I don't read it like that at all. At first, on the day Corbyn was suspended, it looked to me that Starmer had panicked. But these later actions cannot be put down to panic or any sort of short-term consideration about the flak he'll get for a few days. A week defending the action, with Corbyn's second statement to work with, followed by the issue dying down, would have been a very good result if he'd wanted the issue to die down. So clearly, he doesn't want the issue to die down.

 

[brogdale]

I don't read it like that at all. At first, on the day Corbyn was suspended, it looked to me that Starmer had panicked. But these later actions cannot be put down to panic or any sort of short-term consideration about the flak he'll get for a few days. A week defending the action, with Corbyn's second statement to work with, followed by the issue dying down, would have been a very good result if he'd wanted the issue to die down. So clearly, he doesn't want the issue to die down.

Of course it's a purge; all of the opponents of democratic socialism have shown no compunction with weaponising the issue of (really existing) antisemitism within the LP to undermine or destabilise the left of the party.

 

[Mr Moose]

The red wall just voted for Boris Johnson, they clearly don't give a shit how people conduct themselves. No-one does really so fair enough

There’s a general buzz about the left being a bit hateful at times, like after the Brexit vote. It’s not unnoticed on here or elsewhere. But you are right it’s selective and I’m not accusing anyone here of more than hyperbole.

 

[Shechemite]

Also seems to be an overlap between Remainers in the LP and being vocal about AS (John Mann the only labour leaver I can think of who was vocal about AS)

 

[Shechemite]

I’m happy to accept that what’s his face, the former deputy leader, hacking bloke, wasn’t necessarily acting out of pure anti-racist concern

 

[cantsin]

I’m happy to accept that what’s his face, the former deputy leader, hacking bloke, wasn’t necessarily acting out of pure anti-racist concern

fair play ... and what about John Mann ?

Parliamentary Anti-Gypsyism meeting collapses after ‘offensive’ booklet emerges

www.travellerstimes.org.uk

 

[ska invita]

How do you see it panning out?

A ten-to-fifteen year generational fight within the party which the left will eventually win, with Starmer losing the next election

 

[Shechemite]

fair play ... and what about John Mann ?

Parliamentary Anti-Gypsyism meeting collapses after ‘offensive’ booklet emerges

www.travellerstimes.org.uk

What about him? His comment about the GRT community (I imagine he’s said/done much worse else as well) is repulsive. I got the sense he did actually care about AS and those it affected, however inconsistent his anti-racist stance is

 

[Jeff Robinson]

the mark of the man

 

[JudithB]

Pointlessly throwing his forensic weight around by not restoring the whip because that's a thing the Leader can do and membership isn't in his remit. This to appease the right wing racist element of the PLP who are annoyed that the Leader can't break the recommendations of the EHRC report by throwing people out of the Party for their response to the EHRC report

In the meantime, there's a massive great report on Islamophobia in the the Party published by its own members that he hasn't paid much more than lip service to yet, probably because he doesn't want to piss off the right wing racist element - which he has done anyway by failing to throw out Corbyn. In other news, more than one LGBT member of Rosie Duffield's staff has quit in recent months because she's a massive TERF & homophobe but she still somehow escapes censure and people who praise anti-semites continue to sit in his shadow cabinet.

It's going really well

Can you point me to what Rosie Duffield has said that is transphobic?

 

[belboid]

Can you point me to what Rosie Duffield has said that is transphobic?

blimey, back and immediately asking about trans issues? I am shocked, shocked I tell you.

Maybe you could ask either of the two women who resigned from her office because of her views. Or don't those women count?

 

[JudithB]

blimey, back and immediately asking about trans issues? I am shocked, shocked I tell you.

Maybe you could ask either of the two women who resigned from her office because of her views. Or don't those women count?

LOL - it really is the big issue of the time for women. Or does that not count?

Can you point me to what she said that was transphobic?

 

[belboid]

I could, but you have read all the articles and tweets already, so what would be the point? You're nothing but a shallow bigot who uses feminist terminology to hate on trans people.

 

[Pickman's model]

LOL - it really is the big issue of the time for women. Or does that not count?

Can you point me to what she said that was transphobic?

So you don't give a shit about forced sterilisations in the USA or China, they are as nothing in comparison to a trans woman possibly showing up in a ladies loo

 

[hash tag]

JC is going nice and quietly I see Labour Party: Corbyn backers walk out of meeting in suspension row

 

[19force8]

LOL - it really is the big issue of the time for women. Or does that not count?

Of course it is!

Far outweighing minor inconveniences such as the virtual disappearance of women's shelters in the UK and the attacks on reproductive rights current in Europe and coming down the pipeline in the USA.

 

[killer b]

James Butler has written a long piece in the latest LRB which is well worth a read - a fairly clear-sighted look at the failings (and successes) of the Corbyn project. Make some time for it.

James Butler · Failed Vocation: The Corbyn Project

It is an intellectual vice on the left to think that because the world is best understood in terms of the operation of...

www.lrb.co.uk

 

[Shechemite]

So I've been asking, what group of people are being described

People with Yiddish surnames?

 

[Treacle Toes]

maybe everyone was just nonplussed by the post, ok.
To repeat, it said


The context was feeling impassionedly defensive of jeremy corbyn and his reaction to the ehrc report.

But what it is is a description of a group of people as

• Expecting to be treated like they are special or deserve special treatment ('exceptionalism')
• dishonesty & manipulativeness.

So I've been asking, what group of people are being described in that little outburst.

It's not the right of the labour party (in what way would they be claiming 'exceptionalism' ?)
It's not the authors of the ehrc. Is it Bulgarians? Fishermen? Is it perhaps . . Zionists?

The point for me is not actually what she meant its that what was said went totally ignored, it was just passed over maybe a bit awkwardly idk.
Whereas on this website usually if someone ventures to describe a whole load of people from whatever demographic as sharing a bunch of shitty characteristics people do not just ignore it because they're on the same team.

If you want my attention best to tag me. I don't have a great deal of time to read Urban of late so don't see a lot of what's posted.

Read my post in the context of the ones before. I was referring to what is being expected of Corbyn and the Labour left. That he/they are being held to far greater expectations than I think are humanly possible. That no matter what he says or does, along with anyone who supports him it will never be enough. That those who don't support him and want rid of his 'socialism', know better, know him better. That given what we have seen in terms of the attack campaign against him and the left of the party, they/he's not allowed to 'feel' wronged and express that because if they do it's seen as more evidence of their guilt.

I honestly don't know how that man walks out of his front door each day. A quarter of what has gone on would have broken the best of us.

So no, I wasn't referring to 'Jewish people' or 'Zionists' specifically like your post is implying because as you well know many of those involved aren't Jewish and certainly don't seem interested in listening to the views of all Jewish people either.

The continued attack on the Labour left hasn't just been about experiences of antisemitism within the Labour party.

 

[Treacle Toes]

People with Yiddish surnames?

Oh you can imagine my utter shock that you would be here with your over sized wooden spoon can't you?

 

[bimble]

ok

'Exceptionalism' really is a fucking arse of an expectation and the worse kind of emotionally immature and intellectually dishonest manipulation.

All those words are what came to mind to describe 'those who want rid of corbyn'. got it.

 

[Treacle Toes]

ok

All those words are what came to mind to describe 'those who want rid of corbyn'. got it.

Yes, Corbyn, those that support him, socialism, what the Labour left stands for as I have said above. That's what I said.