Jeremy Corbyn's time is up

[StigoftheDig]

I know my LITERALLY TWO PEOPLE is a tiny, completely anecdotal thing, but it just gets you down when you see what the British press is capable of.

 

[elbows]

I know my LITERALLY TWO PEOPLE is a tiny, completely anecdotal thing, but it just gets you down when you see what the British press is capable of.

Their influence on politics is depressing but it has its limits, especially when factoring in how much of it is just preaching to the converted, people who were always going to hate Corbyn and just need a few lazy hooks to hang their hate on.

For all the mud that sticks to Corbyn, the limited damage this has done to him electorally up to this point may actually be a good example of the exaggerated influence of the right-wing press.

 

[Monkeygrinder's Organ]

Their influence on politics is depressing but it has its limits, especially when factoring in how much of it is just preaching to the converted, people who were always going to hate Corbyn and just need a few lazy hooks to hang their hate on.

For all the mud that sticks to Corbyn, the limited damage this has done to him electorally up to this point may actually be a good example of the exaggerated influence of the right-wing press.

I remember reading, from a link on here I think, of 'The Cringe' - it was a phrase used by Democratic Party workers in the US to describe the reflexive backing down or trying to deflect when attacked by the right wing press. I think it's a great description of where Labour ended up with the likes of Miliband at the top of the party, and what Corbyn has broken from. Whenever I see the 'surely this time he'll have to change' type of cries it looks like a call to head back down that road to me.

 

[krink]

my own anecdotal observations at work are that almost nobody even noticed the anti-semitism thing. it just hasn't registered with the 40-odd working class people in my place. of the two proper corbynistas one hadn't heard of it and one mentioned it in passing as a distraction from the russian affair. incidentally, nobody reads the likes of the guardian at work, it's mostly the mirror and a few read the mail, maybe that is a factor.

 

[Teaboy]

The other slightly grim thing is that there is probably a fair few people out there who are not that bothered by a bit of antisemitism or racism. Its all just liberal elite nonsense etc.

 

[HoratioCuthbert]

 

[William of Walworth]

This, from Rachel Shabi in today's Guardian, is definitely worth a read

She really knows her stuff IMO -- she's written extensively and well -- not just in the Guardian -- about loads of relevant stuff. If you happen to be reading this forum RS, do feel free to chuck in a post

 

[ViolentPanda]

You assume there was a choice involved.

Nope. I used the question "...were you fed" to imply no choice. We old folk remember the days of "like it or lump it" that have returned under the Tories.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Did anyone else think of that RATM song?

'Beets in the air in the land of hypocrisy'

Or the Ramones song "Beet on the Brat".

 

[ViolentPanda]

...and Boris Johnson is "being Boris", which would be fine if it meant someone was personally eccentric while delivering fantastic performance, but in this case "being Boris" means being psychotically ambitious and completely unprincipled and dishonest in support of that ambition.

You forgot "...and a typical Classics scholar, who thinks that dropping in a few lines from a dead philosopher in the original Ancient Greek" is a good cover for busking it through a career in politics.

Can you imagine THAT as a Prime Minister? He was well-known at City Hall when Mayor, for over-riding advice from his experts, and following his own - often wrong - opinions instead. I wouldn't trust him with a Browning Hi-Power, let alone a fleet of nuclear-armed submarines!

 

[DotCommunist]

You forgot "...and a typical Classics scholar, who thinks that dropping in a few lines from a dead philosopher in the original Ancient Greek" is a good cover for busking it through a career in politics.

I remember seeing a quote attributed to Churchill, 'how would you like your haircut sir' asks the barber
'In silence!' replied winnie


Only its not churchill, its a 4th century greek joke. So he stole it or had it falsely attributed to him

 

[William of Walworth]

I remember seeing a quote attributed to Churchill, 'how would you like your haircut sir' asks the barber
'In silence!' replied winnie


Only its not churchill, its a 4th century greek joke. So he stole it or had it falsely attributed to him

4th century -- BC or AD?

I'd always attributed that one to Enoch Powell, who I've little doubt actually did say it. As well as Churchill or instead of? Who knows. I'd no idea he/they had lifted the line from dead Greeks though

 

[StigoftheDig]

You forgot "...and a typical Classics scholar, who thinks that dropping in a few lines from a dead philosopher in the original Ancient Greek" is a good cover for busking it through a career in politics.

Can you imagine THAT as a Prime Minister? He was well-known at City Hall when Mayor, for over-riding advice from his experts, and following his own - often wrong - opinions instead. I wouldn't trust him with a Browning Hi-Power, let alone a fleet of nuclear-armed submarines!

Boris' career always makes me think of the old football chant, "If the Nevilles can play for England so can I."

 

[newbie]

For all the mud that sticks to Corbyn, the limited damage this has done to him electorally up to this point may actually be a good example of the exaggerated influence of the right-wing press.

That can be argued both ways. He's a few points behind a PM that no-one has a good word for and his party trails hers. Blair spent the mid-90s 10% - 15% ahead of a similarly useless PM/party.

In a parallel universe would Corbyn have got a landslide in 1997 without the rw press? Would Blair, with their support, trail in the polls now?

 

[HoratioCuthbert]

That can be argued both ways. He's a few points behind a PM that no-one has a good word for and his party trails hers. Blair spent the mid-90s 10% - 15% ahead of a similarly useless PM/party.

In a parallel universe would Corbyn have got a landslide in 1997 without the rw press? Would Blair, with their support, trail in the polls now?

Who cares

 

[newbie]

Who cares

about the influence of the press?

 

[cantsin]

any Bristol West members on here at all, who can shed some light on the debacle last night ? Smells like a lot of bullsh*t wafting about, but the motion vs Debbonaire sounded ill advised tbh.

 

[bimble]

Motion defeated 108 to 84 yesterday, but really not great is it. Reports saying the mp in question fled from the room saying she'll resign. Look at the state of (d) in the motion as well.

 

[Pickman's model]

Motion defeated 108 to 84 yesterday, but really not great is it. Reports saying the mp in question fled from the room saying she'll resign. Look at the state of (d) in the motion as well.

 

[krtek a houby]

my own anecdotal observations at work are that almost nobody even noticed the anti-semitism thing. it just hasn't registered with the 40-odd working class people in my place. of the two proper corbynistas one hadn't heard of it and one mentioned it in passing as a distraction from the russian affair. incidentally, nobody reads the likes of the guardian at work, it's mostly the mirror and a few read the mail, maybe that is a factor.

My anec/obs from my local was that JC was described as variously, a lunatic/traitor/commie and horrible man. This from a wide demographic of punters, er, in a small local.

Oddly, not one had anything to say about anti-Semitism within the labour party. It just wasn't noticed. This would be harking back to just over a year ago when I still lived in the UK.

 

[Pickman's model]

Motion defeated 108 to 84 yesterday, but really not great is it. Reports saying the mp in question fled from the room saying she'll resign. Look at the state of (d) in the motion as well.

if only the other 649 would follow suit instanter

 

[JimW]

I remember seeing a quote attributed to Churchill, 'how would you like your haircut sir' asks the barber
'In silence!' replied winnie


Only its not churchill, its a 4th century greek joke. So he stole it or had it falsely attributed to him

Not really related but came across this old Greek joke involving a different trade (translated into Latin) when I was looking something else up the other day: Sutor, ne ultra crepidam - Wikipedia

 

[butchersapron]

any Bristol West members on here at all, who can shed some light on the debacle last night ? Smells like a lot of bullsh*t wafting about, but the motion vs Debbonaire sounded ill advised tbh.

The motion was proposed by ex-swp types - very shouty ones as well - from a hippy-liberal-cycle-repair-workshop slave-labour built ghetto and supported by a group of people who've traipsed from swp-->RESPECT-->lib-dems-->red trousers-->greens-->labour -->momentum with stops in palestine along the way. Debbonaire is of course odious and they had every right to bring this motion.

edit: and to clear this up for those reading about this from clowns on twitter, this was simply censure and no deselection or any such crap.

 

[cantsin]

The motion was proposed by ex-swp types - very shouty ones as well - from a hippy-liberal-cycle-repair-workshop slave-labour built ghetto and supported by a group of people who've traipsed from swp-->RESPECT-->lib-dems-->red trousers-->greens-->labour -->momentum with stops in palestine along the way. Debbonaire is of course odious and they had every right to bring this motion.

edit: and to clear this up for those reading about this from clowns on twitter, this was simply censure and no deselection or any such crap.

thanks, useful

( + that lot sound frickin' orrible tbf... as is Debbonaire )

 

[Geri]

Well, I like her.

 

[cantsin]

Well, I like her.

posh, anti Corbynite Remoaner - ideal / whats not to like ?

 

[StigoftheDig]

Not being that familiar with her I just looked her up. She's got a 37,000+ majority - that's amazing!

 

[cantsin]

Not being that familiar with her I just looked her up. She's got a 37,000+ majority - that's amazing!

unfortunately, think she interprets that as a personal mandate

 

[butchersapron]

Not being that familiar with her I just looked her up. She's got a 37,000+ majority - that's amazing!

In a seat that was lib-dem until 2015 as well. Their electoral collapse started that ball rolling.

edit: and that the greens had high hopes of taking in 2015.

 

[Sue]

Malcolm Rifkind on the Today programme this morning said the government shouldn't share intelligence with Corbyn about the Skripal attack because he couldn't be trusted. Interesting he was so blatant about it.