Jeremy Corbyn's time is up

[bimble]

Looks like JC did a good PMQs, pushing her on the way she's been interpreting / handling brexit.
Jeremy Corbyn pushes Theresa May over 'shambolic Tory Brexit'

 

[treelover]

I didn't recognise his voice when i was in the other room, very assured, direct, etc, when i looked at the TV it was JC, i think he is having some good media training.

 

[kebabking]

I didn't recognise his voice when i was in the other room, very assured, direct, etc, when i looked at the TV it was JC, i think he is having some good media training.

he's definately doing much better against May than he did against Cameron - whoever has bullied him into sticking to one subject, and a subject that at least 10% of the PLP care about, should be given a lollypop.

May is not the performer that Cameron was, she gets flustered much more easily, she needs to slow down her delivery so she has less 'err..' and 'umm' and having to repeat her words in the right order.

 

[agricola]

he's definately doing much better against May than he did against Cameron - whoever has bullied him into sticking to one subject, and a subject that at least 10% of the PLP care about, should be given a lollypop.

May is not the performer that Cameron was, she gets flustered much more easily, she needs to slow down her delivery so she has less 'err..' and 'umm' and having to repeat her words in the right order.

Corbyn has certainly got better over time. I do however think the criticism of May is a bit overblown; at least half of the noise comes from the Tory modernizers (via their chums in the media) calling her out for things that Cameron was serially guilty of. Her ongoing failure to deal with them, or at least take out the person who they would look to replace her with, will probably doom her in the not too distant future.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Corbyn has certainly got better over time. I do however think the criticism of May is a bit overblown; at least half of the noise comes from the Tory modernizers (via their chums in the media) calling her out for things that Cameron was serially guilty of. Her ongoing failure to deal with them, or at least take out the person who they would look to replace her with, will probably doom her in the not too distant future.

You think so? I see her as secure right up to 2020 if she wants to be. Yes, she is making a mess of brexit. But so would anybody else - nobody knows how to do it. They must know that.

 

[agricola]

You think so? I see her as secure right up to 2020 if she wants to be. Yes, she is making a mess of brexit. But so would anybody else - nobody knows how to do it. They must know that.

The Tory position is secure; hers isn't. They are already talking down her PMQs performances, attacking almost every policy that is floated, and looking to organize Parliamentary defeats (like this pre-negotiation Article 50 vote nonsense) - which with a Government majority that is less than the number of modernizing Tory MPs is something they are more than capable of. Indeed the strength of the Tory position up to 2020 will probably be a weakness to her, because they will be able to claim that she is putting that nailed-on victory at risk if (more likely when) Labour starts to do better in the polls.

 

[Mr Moose]

Corbyn has certainly got better over time. I do however think the criticism of May is a bit overblown; at least half of the noise comes from the Tory modernizers (via their chums in the media) calling her out for things that Cameron was serially guilty of. Her ongoing failure to deal with them, or at least take out the person who they would look to replace her with, will probably doom her in the not too distant future.

I think May is awful and will be in danger as soon as the economy struggles. She's all over the show politically and has one gear (bossy authoritarian) that will soon grate. Trying to be in the middle is actually quite a lonely position and she'll be sniped upon from all sides.

 

[Mr Moose]

The idea of whether discipline and uniform wearing in schools are right-wing ideas seems like it could be an interesting debate, I don't really think so and I don't have any strong opinions on it either way. It's not really something that I know enough about to make an informed comment, but I am sure that there will be people on here who have actually thought about it and would be able to offer you an opinion. I am not sure whether either of those things are actually relevant since individual teachers don't decide a school's uniform or behaviour policy.

What I am talking about is the fact that there are a lot of teachers are literally Tories and there are plenty of others who are Labour voters (or left of Labour) but who have some pretty nasty views about welfare, people on welfare and working-class kids. I wonder how much of that is a function of the job, I suspect it has much more to do with the fact that teachers are disproportionately drawn from the upper-middle-class and that's a trend that seems to be getting worse not better.

I don't think that teachers are to the right of most of society, they are almost certainly to the left of it though I think not as left as portrayed or many think, and I am not slagging them off.

'A very right wing moralistic streak in a lot of teachers' was what I was replying to. I don't think that quite sits as a neutral comment. But ok I'm pleased we can avoid slagging them off.

 

[killer b]

What are Tory 'modernisers'?

 

[free spirit]

What are Tory 'modernisers'?

tories with slick new, modern sounding ways of fucking the rest of us over.

 

[kebabking]

What are Tory 'modernisers'?

very roughly its the Cameron/Osbourne circle (socially and economically liberal) - theres some overlap with hardcore Thatcherites who don't like Mays post-war concensus leanings.

 

[agricola]

What are Tory 'modernisers'?

The group that used to be around Cameron and Osborne - Gove, Letwin, Boles, Vaizey, Soubry etc.

 

[killer b]

Why call them modernisers? That's what they want you to call them, same as with the Labour right wingers.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

The group that used to be around Cameron and Osborne - Gove, Letwin, Boles, Vaizey, Soubry etc.

They were always a minority within the party, though. May, Hammond, etc, surely represent the tory mainstream. And that's why I would think she's secure. She would have won the leadership election if there had been one.

 

[kebabking]

Why call them modernisers? That's what they want you to call them, same as with the Labour right wingers.

broadly because they, err... modernised the Tory party - in a particular way. they ditched the hang'um/flog'um/lock'um up image, they went - in presentational terms - green, and they bought into (to whatever degree) the equality agenda. youth also had a great deal to do with it - Cameron etc.. were all in their early 40's they took over the party, they physically looked modern, rather than like Sir Horace Tufton-Bufton sat on the backbences with his Regimental tie, grey hair and dandruff.

you could just call them the Cambournes, but that doesn't reaflect that while the personality/image thing is part of what they believe, they would genuinely differenciate themselves interms of policy and attitudes (particularly social attitudes) from both previous tory governments and the then membership and elected elements of the party.

May in the other hand, as well as taking revenge for doing the hardest job in government while being excluded from the special gang at No 10/11, is a much more MacMillian/Butler/Heath Tory.

 

[treelover]

The Middle Class English Southern Majority will for completly selfish reasons continue to vote Tory. Our only hope is the cities and the Ethinic Minorities getting behind Corbyn. Normal White people inthis country are just stupid and selfish and cannot see beyond their own front garden. Once Jeremy and Diane are in charge, I hope they crucify these people.

This was posted on Momentum FB site two hours earlier, it is still there, there are a number like this, it may only be social media, but these are real people, maybe activists saying this.

 

[killer b]

broadly because they, err... modernised the Tory party - in a particular way. they ditched the hang'um/flog'um/lock'um up image, they went - in presentational terms - green, and they bought into (to whatever degree) the equality agenda. youth also had a great deal to do with it - Cameron etc.. were all in their early 40's they took over the party, they physically looked modern, rather than like Sir Horace Tufton-Bufton sat on the backbences with his Regimental tie, grey hair and dandruff.

you could just call them the Cambournes, but that doesn't reaflect that while the personality/image thing is part of what they believe, they would genuinely differenciate themselves interms of policy and attitudes (particularly social attitudes) from both previous tory governments and the then membership and elected elements of the party.

May in the other hand, as well as taking revenge for doing the hardest job in government while being excluded from the special gang at No 10/11, is a much more MacMillian/Butler/Heath Tory.

Call them after the ideology they follow and advocate, not some neutral term like 'moderniser'.

 

[butchersapron]

This was posted on Momentum FB site two hours earlier, it is still there, there are a number like this, it may only be social media, but these are real people, maybe activists saying this.

If you believe that's 'real people I think you may need a new pair of glasses.

 

[Pickman's model]

This was posted on Momentum FB site two hours earlier, it is still there, there are a number like this, it may only be social media, but these are real people, maybe activists saying this.

this was posted on urban 15 minutes ago. it is still there. there are a number like this. although it may only be social media, these are real people, maybe even activists, saying this.

 

[J Ed]

This was posted on Momentum FB site two hours earlier, it is still there, there are a number like this, it may only be social media, but these are real people, maybe activists saying this.

Well I for one think that ordinary people are crying out for a bit of Maoist Third Worldism in this di$united KKKingdom of $$$nake$

 

[andysays]

this was posted on urban 15 minutes ago. it is still there. there are a number like this. although it may only be social media, these are real people, maybe even activists, saying this.

Only one person, and I'm still not 100% convinced it's a real person

 

[Pickman's model]

Only one person, and I'm still not 100% convinced it's a real person

yeh, treelover fails the turing test.

 

[Louis MacNeice]

Well I for one think that ordinary people are crying out for a bit of Maoist Third Worldism in this di$united KKKingdom of $$$nake$

And if that doesn't work then there's always Gonzalo Thought:

Revolutionary Greetings - Comrade MaNeice

 

[kebabking]

Well I for one think that ordinary people are crying out for a bit of Maoist Third Worldism in this di$united KKKingdom of $$$nake$

Is there any chance we could get clarification as to whether Worcestershire is in the south? Obviously I enjoy digging ditches as much as any other white middle class man, but I wonder if perhaps by dint if not being in Surrey or Hertfordshire I could go for a kind of part time agricultural servitude - perhaps something in the autumn when it's not too hot and not too cold, and the trees look lovely?

 

[Louis MacNeice]

Is there any chance we could get clarification as to whether Worcestershire is in the south? Obviously I enjoy digging ditches as much as any other white middle class man, but I wonder if perhaps by dint if not being in Surrey or Hertfordshire I could go for a kind of part time agricultural servitude - perhaps something in the autumn when it's not too hot and not too cold, and the trees look lovely?

No it's ditches for you and me both.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice

 

[kebabking]

No it's ditches for you and me both.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice

Is there not some union we could go to? It's just that I have quite soft hands and having to dig in the cold rain of winter would give me terribly chapped skin...

 

[Louis MacNeice]

Is there not some union we could go to? It's just that I have quite soft hands and having to dig in the cold rain of winter would give me terribly chapped skin...

I think chapped skin may be the least of our worries; just make sure you have some of this...only £67 for 500ml:

...I've heard there won't be any artisan sourdough bread!

Cheers - Louis MacNeice

 

[seventh bullet]

Well I for one think that ordinary people are crying out for a bit of Maoist Third Worldism in this di$united KKKingdom of $$$nake$

Nah, it's the United Kingdumb and the United $nakes of Amerikkka. Oh, and don't forget Klanada.

 

[kebabking]

Only one person, and I'm still not 100% convinced it's a real person

It could be, there were a couple of people in SWSS 20-odd years ago who claimed they wanted to go down the Khmer Rouge line with lots of ditches for intellectuals and the like. Facebook tells me that at least one of them is still involved in SWP and posts Corbyn supporting stuff...

 

[Sasaferrato]

You're embarrassing yourself. The fact that both Militant and Momentum accepted electoralism - accepted that the people will either vote for them or not - shows that they're not "ultra-left", and that you don't understand what ultra-leftism.
Broadly speaking, ultra-leftists are revolutionaries, not electoralists. Electoralists tend to be advocates of social democracy and - if we're fortunate - socialism.

I've never been able to understand the infinitesimal differences between the various 'ist' groups in left wing politics, nor am I particularly interested.

Whether one is an adherent of Trotsky, Marx or Mao, the outcome is pretty much the same. Revolution isn't going to happen, nor is the far left ever going to attain more than a smidgen of political power via the ballot box.

To all, barring themselves, they are an irrelevance.

Please accept my humble apology in not being au fait with the bagful of splinters, and I fear I never will be.