Is Brexit actually going to happen?

[sleaterkinney]

In the 2016 referendum you mean? The one that Tory prime ministers past and present campaigned on the Remain side during?

Which ever way you voted, you voted with Tories.

True, I should have said the right wing of the Tory party.

 

[danny la rouge]

True, I should have said the right wing of the Tory party.

Don't think that works either, unless you redefine "right wing".

 

[butchersapron]

Fingers crossed for a left-wing tory remain!

 

[Raheem]

I look forward to arguments against Trump’s wall being subject to the same level of non-emotive scrutiny.

Is the EU responsible for that too?

 

[kabbes]

Yes, I had to look at it several times to confirm.

Who conducted the survey ?

That’s because you have a rose-tinted view of other member states of the EU

 

[mojo pixy]

Fingers crossed for a left-wing tory remain!

tbf at the minute it looks like this is exactly what we'll be getting.

 

[Santino]

A left-wing Tory Remain followed by a haemorrhaging of support to UKIP leading to a 150 majority for Corbyn?

 

[HoratioCuthbert]

Is the EU responsible for that too?

What a strange response.

 

[Raheem]

What a strange response.

Come on, there's no need to be rude. Your comment was pretty odd too.

 

[killer b]

FBPE the movie is out next month.

Home

A documentary film made by and featuring those who voted Remain, the 48%, to show the other 27 EU Member States that it was far from a landslide victory and just why we are fighting to stay part of the EU.

 

[Mr Moose]

Fucking amazing. You think that's what these camps are for.


Not a single one willing to read even the short Mailk piece DC and BA linked to, instead deliberate blindness to the actions of the EU. And it's the Brexit voters that are the racists. Sickening.

You are quite right that no one should ignore those shameful abuses.

But as usual you overplay it. This is not information that sheds a comparatively benign light on leave voters, because their obsession with ‘reclaiming our borders’ leaves no one in any doubt that many felt the EU has not been anything like savage enough.

 

[gosub]

You are quite right that no one should ignore those shameful abuses.

But as usual you overplay it. This is not information that sheds a comparatively benign light on leave voters, because their obsession with ‘reclaiming our borders’ leaves no one in any doubt that many felt the EU has not been anything like savage enough.

For some maybe... For me it's not an obsession about reclaiming borders, more an acknowledgement that as you move away from common systems there has to be one.


And we really do have to move away from common systems cos our political class, media and by knock on, the general public demonstrably can't get their heads round them... Else we wouldn't be where we are.

 

[HoratioCuthbert]

You are quite right that no one should ignore those shameful abuses.

But as usual you overplay it. This is not information that sheds a comparatively benign light on leave voters, because their obsession with ‘reclaiming our borders’ leaves no one in any doubt that many felt the EU has not been anything like savage enough.

Completely disingenuous of you, and pretty sick that you think all attempts to raise awareness of these deaths and the horrifying conditions in camp Moria are all just part of a childish bunfight over which team is better. Fuck you.

 

[HoratioCuthbert]

..... and this is why I scrambled my password the other day :-/

 

[gentlegreen]

That’s because you have a rose-tinted view of other member states of the EU

I'm fully aware of the dodgyness at the eastern edge ... and the fuckup with Greece was shameful.

The Bretons seem a nice crowd from that point of view

 

[The39thStep]

FBPE the movie is out next month.

Home

A documentary film made by and featuring those who voted Remain, the 48%, to show the other 27 EU Member States that it was far from a landslide victory and just why we are fighting to stay part of the EU.

Featuring Joan Bakewell,Vince Cable,Alastair Campbell, Nick Clegg, , Bob Geldof, AC Grayling, Bonnie Greer, Will Hutton, Helena Kennedy

 

[HoratioCuthbert]

Featuring Joan Bakewell,Vince Cable,Alastair Campbell, Nick Clegg, , Bob Geldof, AC Grayling, Bonnie Greer, Will Hutton, Helena Kennedy

They made a movie to grovel to the other 27 states Lol I think they heard you on twitter

 

[killer b]

The multiplexes of Berlin, Paris and Milan will have queues out the door.

 

[HoratioCuthbert]

Let’s roll out this embarrassing speech from yon bodach after Brexit again, mo naire! Please, I beg you, please please

 

[The39thStep]

The multiplexes of Berlin, Paris and Milan will have queues out the door.

They'll be hanging off the rafters

 

[Mr Moose]

Completely disingenuous of you, and pretty sick that you think all attempts to raise awareness of these deaths and the horrifying conditions in camp Moria are all just part of a childish bunfight over which team is better. Fuck you.

I wrote nothing of other posts, I responded to one. Pick up your buns and feed them to your high horse.

 

[DotCommunist]

Completely disingenuous of you, and pretty sick that you think all attempts to raise awareness of these deaths and the horrifying conditions in camp Moria are all just part of a childish bunfight over which team is better. Fuck you.

'ok so the camps are bad but leave voters are still massive xenophobes' is the short of it, with an added implication that leave voters would have gone further still. Pogroms no doubt.

still its better than supines going branch geldofian and deciding his sense of belief is what makes the eu good

 

[Mr Moose]

'ok so the camps are bad but leave voters are still massive xenophobes' is the short of it, with an added implication that leave voters would have gone further still. Pogroms no doubt.

still its better than supines going branch geldofian and deciding his sense of belief is what makes the eu good

The point I’m trying to make is that the demands of nationalism constrain the response from the EU. It must be more brutal, it must not allow refugees and migrants to threaten the member states. That doesn’t excuse the response, but more nationalism is no solution as you well know. That’s my objection to Leave, more nationalist oxygen.

A big ‘threat’ of the Leave vote was that Turkey might join the EU with the obvious implication that we would be murdered in our beds due to the EU’s weakness.

 

[DotCommunist]

The point I’m trying to make is that the demands of nationalism constrain the response from the EU. It must be more brutal, it must not allow refugees and migrants to threaten the member states. That doesn’t excuse the response, but more nationalism is no solution as you well know. That’s my objection to Leave, more nationalist oxygen.

A big ‘threat’ of the Leave vote was that Turkey might join the EU with the obvious implication that we would be murdered in our beds due to the EU’s weakness.

so the best way to combat nationalisms would have been to stay in the eu, an eu which you claim is forced into bankrolling the activities of the anti immigrant member states? I see.

 

[HoratioCuthbert]

The point I’m trying to make is that the demands of nationalism constrain the response from the EU. It must be more brutal, it must not allow refugees and migrants to threaten the member states. That doesn’t excuse the response, but more nationalism is no solution as you well know. That’s my objection to Leave, more nationalist oxygen.

A big ‘threat’ of the Leave vote was that Turkey might join the EU with the obvious implication that we would be murdered in our beds due to the EU’s weakness.

I don’t think I’ve ever met a leave voter that stated Turkey joining the EU was their top reason for leaving.

Often the public have been more liberal than the govt, in 2015 the govt were kinda forced to respond when people were organising aid efforts and protests etc re refugee crisis and obvs in Kenan’s piece there’s reference to the same with the Windrush scandal and in Greece too, so it’s a poor excuse. Similarly, the nationalist sentiment within the leave vote is being overplayed and used as an excuse for what they are doing now. Yes a lot of people voted because they wanted to shut our borders, but I’ve seen little evidence that the majority of leave voters voted for that reason.

 

[HoratioCuthbert]

So it doesn’t help if you amplify that side of it and ignore what the rest of us are saying. I saw this when we started doing refugee stuff where I live, the UKIP guy and a couple of others expressed very racist sentiment and the usual lefties amplified it and made out the whole place had behaved like that when actually they couldn’t have been more supportive and involved. The left NEEDS to stop doing this.


I hope some of that made sense, head not screwed on today.

 

[DotCommunist]

I didn't hear the turkey one or the NHS bus pledge one that apparently gulled the leave masses

 

[HoratioCuthbert]

We always hear about the promises leave made but seldom “my friend voted leave because she saw something on a bus”

 

[HoratioCuthbert]

so the best way to combat nationalisms would have been to stay in the eu, an eu which you claim is forced into bankrolling the activities of the anti immigrant member states? I see.

Honestly we will hit that sea change eventually if we hang in there. Maybe austerity will be smashed once the U.K. is The Biggest Economy In The World.

 

[Mr Moose]

so the best way to combat nationalisms would have been to stay in the eu, an eu which you claim is forced into bankrolling the activities of the anti immigrant member states? I see.

Why would I say it’s the best way? Anything bourgeois is hardly going to be the best way. Sure, staying in the EU doesn’t combat nationalism, but leaving gave it an easy win. Nationalism and the protection of our borders = liberation.