Gaza under attack yet again.

[Barking_Mad]

Im just surprised she's even admitting she thinks its terrible. It's just id have her down as being one of the last ones to jump ship and say what she said.

 

[Pickman's model]

two us military studies of subterranean warfare:

www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD=ADA394095
www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD=ada339626

e2a: and a 2012 one http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a569345.pdf

 

[Pickman's model]

oh - and a 2013 one from the naval postgraduate school http://calhoun.nps.edu/bitstream/ha...owes_Newdigate_Rosario_Tindoll.pdf?sequence=1

say what you will about the united states military, but they don't half put out some interesting material.

 

[bubblesmcgrath]

How come she is only Jewish when she can use it to grandstand? Has she even mentioned the fact that she is Jewish before? Seems like another lie to make her part of the story.

Speedy google check shows up she's of Irish Jewish and Maltese descent.

 

[agricola]

That's a logical and trad far-right zionist view.

Surprised there isnt more of it, especially domestically, to be honest.

As vile as Bibi and his governments actions have been, one almost forgets that they so massively incompetent that they are doing this because they cannot come up with a better way of doing things. In fact they probably spent most of that five hour security cabinet session yesterday trying to sum up the official Israeli position in the form of a monochrome cartoon.

 

[Mr.Bishie]

two us military studies of subterranean warfare:

www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD=ADA394095
www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD=ada339626

e2a: and a 2012 one http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a569345.pdf

Wish I had the time to read them now - saved!

The first para of this is interesting;

Globally, potential adversaries are building ever more complex, stronger, and deeper
fortifications which are largely immune to the current United States weapons inventory.
Advanced construction and design techniques coupled with technological improvements
in mining have created a perfect storm of ultra-strong fortifications located at depths
unreachable to all but the most distinctive and matchless weapon systems

 

[Pickman's model]

oh - and a 2013 one from the naval postgraduate school http://calhoun.nps.edu/bitstream/ha...owes_Newdigate_Rosario_Tindoll.pdf?sequence=1

say what you will about the united states military, but they don't half put out some interesting material.

if you search this thesis for "papineau" you'll find this little gem in the bibliography:

Papineau, James C. [Title classified S]. Master’s thesis, Naval Postgraduate School,
1994. This document is classified Secret.

but a quick bit of searching finds

LT James Papineau: Special Operations Forces’ Role in Counter-Proliferation

http://www.nps.edu/Academics/Schools/GSOIS/Departments/DA/Research/DA_Theses.html

incidentally the bit i link to in my quoted post has an extensive bibliography for those of you interested in subterranean warfare including a reference to cities carved out beneath constantinople / instanbul.

 

[Gingerman]

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/nov/24/israel
'Anything moving in the zone, even a three-year-old, needs to be killed' ......mindset has'nt changed much in 10 years......wonder what ever happened to Officer R...probably got promoted.

 

[likesfish]

"We couldn't believe what he had done. Our hearts ached for her. Just a 13-year-old girl ... How do you spray a girl from close range? He was hot for a long time to take out terrorists and shot the girl to relieve pressure."[13]

Even his soldiers thought he was a cunt

 

[Pickman's model]

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/nov/24/israel
'Anything moving in the zone, even a three-year-old, needs to be killed' ......mindset has'nt changed much in 10 years......wonder what ever happened to Officer R...probably got promoted.

to major according to agricola

 

[Gingerman]

How the fuck Gaza can recover from this?

It wont,Isreal will make sure of that.....

 

[Kalfindin]

Check this cunt out;


@MRN1SA: IDF Sniper Boasts On Instagram of Murdering 13 Gaza Children
http://t.co/7t5uhJKimV http://t.co/eq9ddqhFav

The IDF have a special forces engineering unit called Sayeret Yahalom, they employ snipers, they are also involved in the tunnel operation. So it rings true.

 

[Gingerman]

to major according to agricola

A suitable case for fragging......

 

[frogwoman]

Wow...

In what amounted to the strongest and most explicit condemnation of Israel since the conflict began, US president Barack Obama’s press secretary said the attack on the school was “totally unacceptable” and “totally indefensible”.

He also said the administration was “urging” Israel to do more to avoid civilian deaths and said US officials were taking issue with “specific military decisions” by Jerusalem.

“The shelling of a UN facility, that is housing innocent civilian who are fleeing violence, is totally unacceptable and totally indefensible,” Josh Earnest said.

“It is clear that we need our allies in Israel to do more to live up to the high standards they have set themselves.”

In the aftermath of the shelling of the school, US officials initially declined to apportion blame for the shelling - even though the UN said all of the evidence pointed to Israel.

On Thursday, after Israel conceded it was operating the area and said it was possible that “stray Israeli fire” hit the school, the White House shifted stance.

“It does not appear there is a lot of doubt about whose artillery was involved in this incident,” Earnest said.

 

[J Ed]

On Channel 4 tonight Paul Mason seemed to suggest that Israel might be trying to make large portions of Gaza uninhabitable in order to force a 'voluntary' expulsion, anyone think there is any truth to that?

 

[butchersapron]

On Channel 4 tonight Paul Mason seemed to suggest that Israel might be trying to make large portions of Gaza uninhabitable in order to force a 'voluntary' expulsion, anyone think there is any truth to that?

No. I didn't get that from his report either.

 

[rekil]

Jackie Long had an Israeli woman and a palestinian woman there on precious C4 News. She tried to bully the palestinian woman by repeatedly asking whether Israel has the right to defend itself. Does she ask the Israeli woman whether palestinians have the right to self defence? Does she bollocks. The wider political strategy of fomenting palestinian division doesn't get a look in. Nope, it's official, Israel is doing this to penalise planning permission violations.

 

[existentialist]

The BBC again refers to an Israeli "buffer zone" but doesn't go into any detail why it is needed....

Well, that's the "from the sea" angle pretty nearly covered...

Bastards.

 

[Mr.Bishie]

On Channel 4 tonight Paul Mason seemed to suggest that Israel might be trying to make large portions of Gaza uninhabitable in order to force a 'voluntary' expulsion, anyone think there is any truth to that?

The fact is, that large parts (neighborhoods) of Gaza are uninhabitable. 90% with no water or leccy - & that was a % from two days ago! The conditions in UNRWA buildings are bordering on uninhabitable.

It's fucking tragic.

 

[butchersapron]

Well, that's the "from the sea" angle pretty nearly covered...

Bastards.

There's a 3 mile (originally 6 mile) buffer zone there too.

 

[ViolentPanda]

I tell you what I'd like, I'd like you to stop accusing me of being hasbara every five minutes you conspiraloon addled muppet. Adults have different opinions sometimes; it doesnt mean one of them is an Israeli state spy.

Hasbara doesn't mean "Israeli state spy", you goat-cock, it means "propagandist for the Zionists".

 

[Pickman's model]

The fact is, that large parts (neighborhoods) of Gaza are uninhabitable. 90% with no water or leccy - & that was a % from two days ago! The conditions in UNRWA buildings are bordering on uninhabitable.

It's fucking tragic.

it's killing the palestinians "softly", without all that nasty blood and out of sight

 

[ViolentPanda]

That's quite deliberately disingenuous. It'd be far better if no-one talks about Palestine and we just sit in impotent rage, eh?

Which is why some people have accused him of being a pro-Zionist propagandist.
I don't think Spacklefrog is, I think they're actually one of those people who believe in the rightness of their own opinions because it's their own opinion, IYSWIM.

 

[Spymaster]

“It is clear that we need our allies in Israel to do more to live up to the high standards they have set themselves.”

 

[butchersapron]

Hang on everyone, spacklefrog has been one of the best posters on this thread - asking serious questions, not minimizsing or over-emphasing stuff or just saying that this is bad. Hipiloon and the other loons have posted page after page of dodgy tripe unchallenged (mostly because i think people value the thread) - yet he (SF) is the one the decent posters turn on? SF has posted from the same angle as me - critical of hamas and the Israeli state. And if you're not starting from that position then, what use are you?

 

[frogwoman]

I don't agree with all his opinions but SpackleFrog definitely isn't a zionist.

 

[hipipol]

Gee, thanks. Y'kno if you're gonna pull the patronising "I'm a mature adult" you could try responding to my analysis instead of attempting to claim some kind of aged wisdom and dismissing what I say on the basis of 'yoof' and 'inexperience'. You know full well that if you did that in a political meeting you'd be kicked out and if you did it in a bar you'd by sparked out.

Fuck the UN etc doesn't really constitute an analysis

 

[Plumdaff]

I was frustrated that he repeatedly asked people for reasons why they supported BDS then only responded to one or two reasons given way down the list as a second or third thought, ignoring the stronger arguments - which seemed disingenuous, but no, I don't think he's a zionist.

 

[butchersapron]

I was frustrated that he repeatedly asked people for reasons why they supported BDS then only responded to one or two reasons given way down the list as a second or third thought, ignoring the stronger arguments - which seemed disingenuous, but no, I don't think he's a zionist.

I think his reply to your defence of BDS was lacking - the whole conversation is really - but we can't have white rasta city traders, irish republican islamic socialists and various other bullshitters ganging up to attack socialists and socialist inquiry. Not on this thread.

 

[frogwoman]

I was frustrated that he repeatedly asked people for reasons why they supported BDS then only responded to one or two reasons given way down the list as a second or third thought, ignoring the stronger arguments - which seemed disingenuous, but no, I don't think he's a zionist.

To be fair I can't decide whether to support it either - you will see posts from me until very recently arguing that it's a bad idea for some of the reasons Spacklefrog has been arguing - I don't know what the solution is though? I really don't. I'm starting to think that it may be the only (very limited) way to put pressure on the Israeli government