Fuck Gentrification - Join the Fuck Parade...Part 3!

[krtek a houby]

no surprise there then

Obviously not. You have to remember, I'm as thick as pigshit. The old braincells aren't what they used to be.

 

[Pickman's model]

Obviously not. You have to remember, I'm as thick as pigshit. The old braincells aren't what they used to be.

the evidence of your intelligence is there for all to see, in your posting history.

 

[krtek a houby]

the evidence of your intelligence is there for all to see, in your posting history.

Wouldn't you know it; you sound like a poet.

 

[Pickman's model]

Wouldn't you know it; you sound like a poet.

i post in rhyme whene'er i can, to avert the danger of a permaban

 

[krtek a houby]

i post in rhyme whene'er i can, to avert the danger of a permaban

Now why on earth would you ever be banned?

 

[Pickman's model]

Now why on earth would you ever be banned?

i don't know as it's not happened yet

 

[krtek a houby]

i don't know as it's not happened yet

Ah, linear time. Gotcha.

 

[mauvais]

or jews.

What?

And then to reverse these two pieces:

when you talk about the flow of money upwards you somewhat undermine the claim about trickle down. if your posts cannot be internally consistent perhaps you need to think about the reasons for that.

There is no inconsistency at all. The two are not mutually exclusive. TDE is the (grossly wrong) idea that structuring the economy to benefit and enable the rich (upwards) will ultimately benefit all (downwards). Whether it actually does or not isn't enormously relevant.

there is no trickle down from gentrifiers. they don't buy in the existing shops. they go to shops which cater for them - they are less likely to go to ridley road market than broadway market (or borough market) for their food. this is why businesses like the nefandous cereal cafe spring up. anyway, the money from the gentrifiers does not flow into the pockets of pre-existing local businesses but into the pockets of large supermarkets or the businesses which cater to the tastes of gentrifiers.

Largely agreed, but largely irrelevant. The point was that gentrification is led from the top, those with the most capital and control. It doesn't have to flow through every individual and orifice for that to be the case. The middle class Guardian reader who momentarily thinks they've derived benefit from gentrification via the up and comingness of their area is also close to the bottom of this structure, because if the systemic problems were dealt with (e.g. rent controls, de-commoditisation of property, BTL neckshots) they would be far better off and more secure long term, similarly so to those who find no pleasure in it in the first place.

And IMO the money from gentrifiers flows primarily to those who own property, who benefit from either property speculation or lease, or who benefit from redevelopment. If you're renting, whether MC or WC, you're in a similar boat. This is where the population's vested and probably majority interest of capital becomes interesting (owning, looking to make money from or expecting to inherit property for a start), but in a specific and tangible way, not just political theory.

 

[Dowie]

I'm really surprised at this lack of concern for the dispossessed and homeless together with the annoyance at those that fight back against it.

it isn't annoyance at people who fight back against it - it is annoyance at a bunch of muppets who think smashing a small business has any relevance at all to it... though I've expressed my view on that over a few pages and it seems there have been a whole bunch of pages since then, mostly by the same few characters who don't seem to do much else with their lives than post on here, get angry/frustrated and then start getting abusive with people who disagree with them... (especially when they've not really got any decent arguments to support smashing up a independent cafe in the first place)

gentrification is an issue that raises plenty of concerns for people, expressing dismay and contempt for the people attacking the cereal cafe doesn't mean you lack concern in that area or that you're pro gentrification

 

[Pickman's model]

The point was that gentrification is led from the top,

despite that being utter bollocks


while obviously humorous and from an american viewpoint, this does give a better notion of how gentrification proceeds than your posts do.

 

[mauvais]

Then finally we disagree on something tangible. I see it far more induced top-down direction, more of capital's invitation to come and live somewhere than led from some sort of bottom up hipster conquistadors, at least in this country. It's a parasite on movements and culture, rather than being either itself. Gentrification in most UK cities comes with a springtime of yuppie apartment tower blocks, supply leading demand, not just a response.

 

[Mr Moose]

how often do we need to go over the phrase 'relationship to the means of production' before you understsnd it? shopowners are, hsve been, and will remain petit-bourgeois. unless they're proper bourgeois...

Exactly and this is why Emily Thornberry was spot on when she stuck it to that car dealer in Rochester.

 

[Mr Moose]

G'wan Emily!

 

[DotCommunist]

its a good try but thornberry was acting on class snobbery not denouncing the kulak

 

[Mr Moose]

its a good try but thornberry was acting on class snobbery not denouncing the kulak

A good point but whatever the motivation it's not cool to trounce the little guy.

 

[stethoscope]

Sorry, I thought I'd stumbled into a completely different thread for a moment.

 

[ViolentPanda]

You've not read the article, then

The Beardy Bros have put their "whole lives on the line" to make a go of their Snap, Crackle & Pop shop, according to the article. They must have sold their souls to Satan (or perhaps Pickman's model )!!!

 

[ViolentPanda]

Cereal Killers is an example of businesses opening that reflect the desires of the new social class moving into the area pushing the WC out. It may be a symptom rather than cause, but those doing it have nailed their colours to the mast of the process.

From a <poncey hat firmly on> sociological perspective, I find it interesting that the new social class you refer to (I'd say "stratum" of an existing class, myself), whose habits appear to worship "authenticity", are such massive fans of pastiche. If it were nostalgia - forty and fifty-somethings eating the cereals/reliving the fashions/riding the bicycles of their youths - I could understand that, but it's twenty and thirty-somethings attempting to create an "authentic" set of consumption decisions to validate the way they see themselves - membership (through purchasing choices) of a semi-elite social stratum that deliberately eschews the idea of itself as a movement.</poncy hat off>

 

[ViolentPanda]

Not at all. I am contacting Citizen Smith and will be seeing him soon in person.
Just because I look at things with a logical and not emotional brain does not make me a troll.
Anyway thanks for that I can add it to the long list of names I have been called on these forums.

After you various wibblings about "ninjas", that you can claim that you look at things with a logical brain, is a source of great amusement to me.
A tip: Cultivate a sense of self-awareness.

 

[ViolentPanda]

There was no dog ripped limb from limb. No we didn't feast on it's still warm flesh. The only dog I saw all night was our mates who was having a grand old time.

It's good to know that Blighty has its' very own riot dog.

 

[ViolentPanda]

This thread = bunch of fucking...

's

You see that there Scooter? That's you, that is. That's your mum.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Is this what they call pork barrel politics?

Porking pigs is bad enough. Porking barrels is just plain sick!

 

[mauvais]

From a <poncey hat firmly on> sociological perspective, I find it interesting that the new social class you refer to (I'd say "stratum" of an existing class, myself), whose habits appear to worship "authenticity", are such massive fans of pastiche. If it were nostalgia - forty and fifty-somethings eating the cereals/reliving the fashions/riding the bicycles of their youths - I could understand that, but it's twenty and thirty-somethings attempting to create an "authentic" set of consumption decisions to validate the way they see themselves - membership (through purchasing choices) of a semi-elite social stratum that deliberately eschews the idea of itself as a movement.</poncy hat off>

You've just described almost all pop culture ever. Who ever went around wilfully trying to achieve fakeness by assembling themselves into an open invite cliche? Borrowing heavily on the past and calling it your own niche is, pardon my sentence, nothing new. I'm just looking forward to feeling old during the 90s and 00s revival, if indeed we're not already in it.

 

[ViolentPanda]

So why isnt this Bone fella being locked up for incitement to violence or whatever the law is now called?

The answer is fairly obvious.

 

[ffsear]

You see that there Scooter? That's you, that is. That's your mum.

Mother died when i was 3 so wouln't know TBH

 

[ViolentPanda]

You've just described almost all pop culture ever. Who ever went around wilfully trying to achieve fakeness by assembling themselves into an open invite cliche? Borrowing heavily on the past and calling it your own niche is, pardon my sentence, nothing new. I'm just looking forward to feeling old during the 90s and 00s revival, if indeed we're not already in it.

My point is that this "movement"/consumer cult/class stratum doesn't acknowledge a debt to the past, whereas most other movements and subcultures - From Punks to Teds to "New Age Travellers" have done so. These people incorporate the past into their identities, but refute any debt by "spinning" their appropriations as something entirely new.

 

[stethoscope]

Mother died when i was 3 so wouln't know TBH

Your mother who was 60 last year?

 

[ViolentPanda]

Are you refining the caricature here or something?

So you can own a house outright and be working class, right? But rent a leveraged, debt-laden retail premises and you become... what? Automagically middle class? One of the untouchables? Or do you conveniently vanish?

Do they sell their labour to a boss?
Of course they don't.
Therefore, not working class.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Your mother who was 60 last year?

So he's enough of a low cunt to fabricate a family death to try to come out on top in an argument.

Awaits long spiel from ffsear about foster-mothers.

 

[ffsear]

Your mother who was 60 last year?

Step mother. I just grew up not useing the using phrase "step" . Its different when it happens when your young you know.

Not offend, not like anyone would know is it.