Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
I've been very patient with you, you've made your answer to my question very clear - for which I thank you - and there's no need for any further discussion.
Feminism - where are the threads?
- Thread starter JudithB
- Start date
You said that feminism has nothing to do with men unless they are the perpetrators of violence.
He said Really? What about inequality in the workplace and in the home? Surely feminism and men have something to do with that? Inequality is a relationship between men and women.
You said, I don't understand the question.
Steel Icarus
we move
I would hope, as a husband, and father of a boy and a girl, feminism would be something I'd be interested and involved in.
JudithB
Well-Known Member
Word
Really? Whether feminism or women's liberation is a separate political movement or one that includes men is totally relevant. And pointing out that inequality is a relationship may well be an obvious point but if we act as though we're dealing with things rather than relations then that also gets in the way.
JudithB
Well-Known Member
Can you expand on this bit please
Thanks
The problem is the relationship between men and women, what goes on between them, rather than something that is a fixed quality of men or women. So any action against women's oppression needs to involve both aspects of that relationship.
JudithB
Well-Known Member
I think enough of the other threads show that I believe there is inequality in the work place and home. It was my understanding that he was taking particular interest in why feminism (mine?!) appears to have focussed on violence against women.
It is the oppression of women because of their reproductive capacity that underpins the patriarchal structure that allows men to be ruled by men but rule all women. If they'd stop raping us and then NAMALT'ing us we might be able to move on. But it has to be brought back to this point so it has to be argued again and again and again
JudithB
Well-Known Member
Yes
The Redstockings manifesto although quite dated deals with this very well and much of it is still very relevant
What are the practical consequences of this question?
I don't understand your question.
I think we might be being asked to solve the problems of the patriarchal power structure in easy to do steps
No, I don't think it's that. I don't doubt there's an understanding of the complexity of the situation and potential responses to it.
I should think it's a quite specific question to do with a perceived failure of rigorous joining the dots thinking on my part.
friendofdorothy
Solidarity against neoliberalism!
I had to actually look up NAMALT 
That how out of date I am with internet debates.
That how out of date I am with internet debates.
polly
Well-Known Member
'Freddy Krueger in the room': women confront Harvey Weinstein at New York event
This is depressing. Harvey Weinstein turns up at a stand up comedy thing in NYC. Two of the comics make comments and are booed, one is called a cunt by his entourage and thrown out by security.
Bad enough that he feels able to show his face at this kind of event, but that the two challenging him are treated so badly suggests his rehabilitation has already begun
Edit - this one too, the absolute state of Silas https://www.buzzfeednews.com/articl...weinstein-heckled-comedian-event-women-actors
This is depressing. Harvey Weinstein turns up at a stand up comedy thing in NYC. Two of the comics make comments and are booed, one is called a cunt by his entourage and thrown out by security.
Bad enough that he feels able to show his face at this kind of event, but that the two challenging him are treated so badly suggests his rehabilitation has already begun
Edit - this one too, the absolute state of Silas https://www.buzzfeednews.com/articl...weinstein-heckled-comedian-event-women-actors
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Poot
My wife thinks I work too hard
Why the fuck is he not in jail?'Freddy Krueger in the room': women confront Harvey Weinstein at New York event
This is depressing. Harvey Weinstein turns up at a stand up comedy thing in NYC. Two of the comics make comments and are booed, one is called a cunt by his entourage and thrown out by security.
Bad enough that he feels able to show his face at this kind of event, but that the two challenging him are treated so badly suggests his rehabilitation has already begun
Rhetorical question obviously.
polly
Well-Known Member
He's never really had to, I guess. Despicable cunt. The sheer lack of support these two comics had from the audience and club show how he's got away with it.
TopCat
Putin fanboy
People have a love for money that is despicable.
polly
Well-Known Member
Yeah. Toxic combo of this culture of treating women like shit, and no one calling it out because they're too busy kissing rapist boot for the sake of their careers.
Like that fucking coward Silas in the buzzfeed piece - not knowing which way to jump so he doesn't back the comics taking Weinstein down but is at the same time desperate to make sure the feminists think he's a nice guy
Jennastan
Fuck off, Avon.
I'm pretty sure I've seen it used for men in the music press - but not since the 80s. Sting is an example of a bloke I've seen described as sultry. I'm going to start using more for blokes I think.
Manter
Lunch Mob
I was listening to a podcast about this. Apparently he is on an a licence- and wears an ankle monitor bracelet- and isn’t allowed to leave Manhattan. Apparently one of his key legal advisors is Gloria Allred- aka famous ‘feminist’ lawyer. Yuk
edited to correct lawyer
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scifisam
feck! arse! girls! drink!
The licence should really include "don't go to places full of young people trying to start their careers in entertainment when that's who you've been accused of abusing."
Athos
Well-Known Member
You sure about Steinem?
Manter
Lunch Mob
Allred- apologies. I’ll change the comment.
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