EDL watch

[Delroy Booth]

So, what do people make of this?

http://www.hopenothate.org.uk/beyond-the-bnp/

Does this mean a divorce between Searchlight and Hope Not Hate?

 

[butchersapron]

This should probably be on the thread about this rather than this shit one but the 4 page future orientation HnH document does not mention SL once - whilst finding time and space to claim credit for the rise in the BNP vote in B&D and the izzardisation of anti-fascism (vote UKIP/labour/tory/lib-dem - not BNP)

 

[MellySingsDoom]

This should probably be on the thread about this rather than this shit one but the 4 page future orientation HnH document does not mention SL once - whilst finding time and space to claim credit fo rthe rise in the BNP vote in B&D and the izzardisation of anti-fascism (vote UKIP/labour/tory/lib-dem - not BNP)

Can I ask for permission to use the highlighted word above? (The appropriate copyright royalties will be sent your way)

 

[butchersapron]

Money to appropriate fighting fund please.

 

[MellySingsDoom]

Money to appropriate fighting fund please.

It shall be done. Thanks for granting permission.

 

[Delroy Booth]

This should probably be on the thread about this rather than this shit one but the 4 page future orientation HnH document does not mention SL once - whilst finding time and space to claim credit for the rise in the BNP vote in B&D and the izzardisation of anti-fascism (vote UKIP/labour/tory/lib-dem - not BNP)

This is one of the things that annoyed me about the HnH triumpalism in Barking and Dagenham, yes they wiped them out, but if you actually look at the numbers the BNP's electoral performance in 2010, in terms of votes cast, was very impressive indeed. It's more to do with targeted Labour campaigning, often at the expense of other marginal seats, than effective anti-fasicsm, that they lost their councillors. If I'm not mistaken Nick Griffin's 6,000 or so voters and B&D is the best electoral performance of any far-right leader in UK history. Is that right?

 

[DotCommunist]

oi, to those who worry about class prejudice showing through when mocking the EDL, well yes it can be evident- even insofar as mocking bad spelling and suddenly pious attitudes to drink and drugs from avowed caners. End of the day though these lot are not an expression of white working class consciousness reacting against marginalisation and economic deprivation etc. They genuinely are just nasty, thick far righters with casual (lol) links to older far right parties and generalised paki bashers.

They are also a bloody lunatic fringe given far more significance than is deserved.

If I could afford the time and money to go laugh at them I would, but risk being kettled in with them due to my shaved head and inarticulate vocal register.

The real reactions to economic deprivation and alienation from mainstream political discourse can be seen elsewhere. This lot, for however long they limp on, are just thick racists.

 

[Delroy Booth]

tbh the most effective form of anti-fascism now isn't forming squads to go and twat the EDL, the most important thing we can do to counter fascism is to build a political movement that is capable of capitalising the popular discontent that we're going to see from the collapse of the EU and continued recession instead of the fascists.

 

[Deareg]

tbh the most effective form of anti-fascism now isn't forming squads to go and twat the EDL, the most important thing we can do to counter fascism is to build a political movement that is capable of capitalising the popular discontent that we're going to see from the collapse of the EU and continued recession instead of the fascists.

That was always the most effective way.

In the meantime.

 

[Delroy Booth]

Well clearly, but there was a need to counter the EDL physically in the short term, which still exists now although to a lesser degree, and the political situation wasn't as insane as it is now when this was happening. Now, things are different, and the urgency that we felt when the EDL first came around and that went into organising against them needs to be replaced with an urgency to create proper, functioning, and viable political alternatives now they've withdrawn from the streets.

We are on the verge of a very serious and prolonged economic crisis, which will present the best political opportunity for the left in a generation, but also for the fascists, the question now is who will win out in this battle for ideas? The centre has fallen out of european politics, and if we don't take the initiative, they will, so now the main anti-fascist priority is the same as the main anti-cuts priority, to create organizations that can win popular support for an alternative economic and political system. The two things have merged now.

 

[Corax]

That was always the most effective way.

The difference is that in times like this one of the major stumbling blocks, mainstream apathy, is reduced if not removed.

Now, how to tackle the other stumbling blocks...

No one's found a way of removing them in the last 50 years that I know of, which is what makes me pretty jaded about it all. Many thousands of better minds than mine have tried and failed, so I'm certainly not likely to offer any solutions. I'll welcome any that do, but I find it hard to be optimistic.

 

[Deareg]

The difference is that in times like this one of the major stumbling blocks, mainstream apathy, is reduced if not removed.

Now, how to tackle the other stumbling blocks...

No one's found a way of removing them in the last 50 years that I know of, which is what makes me pretty jaded about it all. Many thousands of better minds than mine have tried and failed, so I'm certainly not likely to offer any solutions. I'll welcome any that do, but I find it hard to be optimistic.

I agree, street stuff can only ever be a stopgap measure but like yourself I don't have the answer as to how to go about building a party that the working class can turn to and trust.

 

[SpineyNorman]

If I could afford the time and money to go laugh at them I would, but risk being kettled in with them due to my shaved head and inarticulate vocal register.

LOL That actually happened to me once. I went to an anti-EDL demo in Dudley (yes, I do regret it) and we got there ridiculously early so me, a mate and his son, who must have been about 13, decided to go for a wander around the city centre just to see what was going on. The answer was not a lot - loads of boarded up shops and several small groupings of twats wrapped in the St. George's cross. Fortunately we were all wearing jeans and tracky tops so we blended in fairly well. However, this proved to be our undoing when we tried to get back into the anti-EDL cordon. The stewards wouldn't let us in because our dress sense and my shaven head led them to believe we were EDL. Luckily my mate was in the SWP and was able to get hold of someone inside who came over and confirmed that we were in fact "on their side". Good job too - my mate is partially sighted which would have ruled out running away and I'm too much of a gobby twat to have kept my mouth shut when they started shouting "we hate pakis more than you".

 

[Pickman's model]

LOL That actually happened to me once. I went to an anti-EDL demo in Dudley (yes, I do regret it) and we got there ridiculously early so me, a mate and his son, who must have been about 13, decided to go for a wander around the city centre just to see what was going on. The answer was not a lot - loads of boarded up shops and several small groupings of twats wrapped in the St. George's cross. Fortunately we were all wearing jeans and tracky tops so we blended in fairly well. However, this proved to be our undoing when we tried to get back into the anti-EDL cordon. The stewards wouldn't let us in because our dress sense and my shaven head led them to believe we were EDL. Luckily my mate was in the SWP and was able to get hold of someone inside who came over and confirmed that we were in fact "on their side". Good job too - my mate is partially sighted which would have ruled out running away and I'm too much of a gobby twat to have kept my mouth shut when they started shouting "we hate pakis more than you".

they are, though, correct: they do hate pakistanis more than you do.

 

[SpineyNorman]

 

[DrRingDing]

they are, though, correct: they do hate pakistanis more than you do.

That should have been a semi, not a full colon.

 

[Pickman's model]

That should have been a semi, not a full colon.

pedant points for drringding

 

[elfman]

LOL That actually happened to me once. I went to an anti-EDL demo in Dudley (yes, I do regret it) and we got there ridiculously early so me, a mate and his son, who must have been about 13, decided to go for a wander around the city centre just to see what was going on. The answer was not a lot - loads of boarded up shops and several small groupings of twats wrapped in the St. George's cross. Fortunately we were all wearing jeans and tracky tops so we blended in fairly well. However, this proved to be our undoing when we tried to get back into the anti-EDL cordon. The stewards wouldn't let us in because our dress sense and my shaven head led them to believe we were EDL. Luckily my mate was in the SWP and was able to get hold of someone inside who came over and confirmed that we were in fact "on their side". Good job too - my mate is partially sighted which would have ruled out running away and I'm too much of a gobby twat to have kept my mouth shut when they started shouting "we hate pakis more than you".

Happened to me as well in Dewsbury. I have a shaved head and was wearing a Segio Tacchini hoody and blue adidas trainers. I think they only eventually let us in with UAF because there was so few of them and needed to boost the numbers somehow. I only wanted in to go to the toilet and after I went they searched the toilet to make sure I hadn't defaced it

 

[Pickman's model]

Happened to me as well in Dewsbury. I have a shaved head and was wearing a Segio Tacchini hoody and blue adidas trainers. I think they only eventually let us in with UAF because there was so few of them and needed to boost the numbers somehow. I only wanted in to go to the toilet and after I went they searched the toilet to make sure I hadn't defaced it

haha

 

[Citizen66]

pedant points for drringding

Blimey, you could be out of a job at this rate!

 

[Pickman's model]

Blimey, you could be out of a job at this rate!

my p45 came in the post

 

[Citizen66]

my p45 came in the post

Your post response times have speeded up though as a result!

 

[Pickman's model]

Your post response times have speeded up though as a result!

 

[laptop]

pedant points for drringding

And points subtracted from DrRD for quibbling with a sentence that was perfectly acceptable...

Hmmm... "English Defence League"...

* cunning plan starts to take shape *

 

[Pickman's model]

That should have been a semi, not a full colon.

bet posting that gave you a semi

 

[Citizen66]

Why the frown? You'll have that crown snatched back from ringding in record speed! (Or have you actually been made redundant IRL which now makes me look like an insensitive dick? ).

 

[Pickman's model]

Why the frown? You'll have that crown snatched back from ringding in record speed! (Or have you actually been made redundant IRL which now makes me look like an insensitive dick? ).

there's a lot made of me being a pedant but if you read my posts you'll see there's little pedantry there, and that bit there is is often there to live up to the unfair reputation i've been awarded.

so drringding can keep the pedantry crown, and i expect him to retain it for quite some time

 

[Citizen66]

there's a lot made of me being a pedant but if you read my posts you'll see there's little pedantry there, and that bit there is is often there to live up to the unfair reputation i've been awarded.

Okay, pedant may be the wrong word (geddit?), so what's the word I'm looking for? Exacting? Pernickety?

You've always had that crown man. Not necessarily a bad thing. Infuriating at times though.

 

[bignose1]

Money to appropriate fighting fund please.

With full eddietorial control

 

[bignose1]

my p45 came in the post

Got sacked from a skin cream factory...didnt come up to scratch..on my way out the boss said wel'l send your E45in the post...