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EDL watch

Yeah seems a bit dumb, although he has got his profile locked down and not public. Planning this sort of thing on Facebook is the height of stupidity regardless of privacy settings though. Then again he doesnt seem the smartest cookie judging by his posts on other Facebook groups.
 
Anyone heard of this shower before?

They call themselves CxF (Combined Ex Forces)and are posturing to be some sort of paramilitary offshoot of the EDL.
He's a member of 4Freedoms.ning forum and goes by the name of Tha Grenadier: http://twitpic.com/27e7z9 (calls to start paramilitary offshoot of EDL) and http://twitpic.com/5w96f1 (admits he's a convicted people smuggler)


He has used other surnames 'Allan Hetherington-Cleverley' and formerly of the British Army (then Allan Gallup), he did 4 years for smuggling Chinese immigrants into Britain via his connections to Albanian gangsters. He has given at least one speech at an EDL demo (notably Dudley 17 July 2010)

 
I'd love to hear a coherent argument from 'em.
The NF may have been deep-fried scheissefotzen, but at least they were vaguely coherent when it came to arguing their position. With the EDF, the politics seems to vary from member to member, even your line on Islam.

Erm, do you (and others from some of the responses I've had) think I'm EDL or sumet? I'll make it clear first of all that I'm not (although I have been accused of being EDL a few times because of the way I look actually...)

I agree it varies from member to member and some of them aren't worth even debating with and just need to be physically dealt with. Some of them are worth debating with, especially as the vast majority of EDL members have a very simplified view on Islam (along with a lot of western society).

Generally when I have debated with EDL members on the street (which are fairly easy to come across living in West Yorkshire), giving a general class analysis along with explaining the complexity of Islamic culture and beliefs as well as comparing it to other religious thought has worked well to a degree. I've not converted anyone in to a class struggle anarchist but I think its a better way to deal with some of them instead of shouting 'Nazi' at them or making it out that they're all illiterate. I'd say if this sort of approach of trying to talk to the members of the EDL instead of turning their demos into a circus straight away might of avoided a lot of shit thats gone on since.
 


9.30 onwards you can see Tommy with Alan Lake at a meeting about the EDL which was broadcast on TV in Aus. last night he said Alan Lake had nothing to do with the EDL.
 
In the pinstripe suit - 'Aeneas Lavinium (Aeneas Europa on youtube) - runs the ICLA (International Civil Liberties) website. Took EDL to Berlin in April 2010 for the Pax Europa/PI News rally in support of Geert Wilders. Made a speech there on their behalf. Made speech in 2010 at CounterJihad Europa Project Annual Conference on success of EDL (conference run since 2007). CounterJihad Europa Project is project of ICLA (ex. CVF) - itself a project of Center for Security Policy (these are US outreach from a tier of interelated Gaffney post PNAC projects)

In the specs and plain suit - Alan Lake. No idea wtf he is or where he came from, but seriously looks like an old NF suit.

The woman in glasses - Roberta Moore - ex-leader of the chopped liver division -- sorry, semi-ficitious Jewish Division (an extremist who assoc. with JTF). Kahanist through and through.

What with Kev Carroll and Tommy Robinson's tongues. Neither of them can keep them in, can they!

I don't know who the other men are.
 
In the pinstripe suit - 'Aeneas Lavinium (Aeneas Europa on youtube) - runs the ICLA (International Civil Liberties) website. Took EDL to Berlin in April 2010 for the Pax Europa/PI News rally in support of Geert Wilders. Made a speech there on their behalf. Made speech in 2010 at CounterJihad Europa Project Annual Conference on success of EDL (conference run since 2007). CounterJihad Europa Project is project of ICLA (ex. CVF) - itself a project of Center for Security Policy (these are US outreach from a tier of interelated Gaffney post PNAC projects)

In the specs and plain suit - Alan Lake. No idea wtf he is or where he came from, but seriously looks like an old NF suit.

The woman in glasses - Roberta Moore - ex-leader of the chopped liver division -- sorry, semi-ficitious Jewish Division (an extremist who assoc. with JTF). Kahanist through and through.

What with Kev Carroll and Tommy Robinson's tongues. Neither of them can keep them in, can they!

I don't know who the other men are.

People in politics lying, wow. I trust you're not surprised.
 
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...mailed-manifesto-to-250-British-contacts.html


Anders Behring Breivik emailed his 1,500-page “manifesto” to 250 British contacts less than 90 minutes before he detonated a bomb in Oslo.

Not only British contacts. There were 1,003 recipients in total.

Vlaams Belang MP Tanguys Veys who had no contact with Brevik but was sent a copy, is in ther same party as MP Dr Alexandra Colen whose husband Paul Beliën runs The Brussels Journal, which was a main mouthpiece for Fjordman's influential (to Breivik) essays. Vlaams Belang emerged in 2004 from the banned (for repeated incitement to discrimination) Vlaams Blok.
 
He's a member of 4Freedoms.ning forum and goes by the name of Tha Grenadier: http://twitpic.com/27e7z9 (calls to start paramilitary offshoot of EDL) and http://twitpic.com/5w96f1 (admits he's a convicted people smuggler)


He has used other surnames 'Allan Hetherington-Cleverley' and formerly of the British Army (then Allan Gallup), he did 4 years for smuggling Chinese immigrants into Britain via his connections to Albanian gangsters. He has given at least one speech at an EDL demo (notably Dudley 17 July 2010)



For a former Gren (a Guards regt, so heavily into squarebashing etc) he's got appalling posture. One of the ways you can tell old career soldiers is the fact that they stand and walk like they've got a broomstick rammed up them from the arse to the top of the head. That bloke looks like the nearest he's got to standing at attention is standing at the bar.
 
Erm, do you (and others from some of the responses I've had) think I'm EDL or sumet? I'll make it clear first of all that I'm not (although I have been accused of being EDL a few times because of the way I look actually...)

Dunno what you look like, but you came across neutrally. The "your" was an attempt at fishing. :)

I agree it varies from member to member and some of them aren't worth even debating with and just need to be physically dealt with. Some of them are worth debating with, especially as the vast majority of EDL members have a very simplified view on Islam (along with a lot of western society).

This is one of the difficulties in attempting to address the EDL and their potential as a threat: Unlike the BNP and NF, or even UKIP to some extent, the membership aren't unified around a cohesive ideology, what binds them is this set of incoherent positions and, quite possibly, the same sort of fellow-feeling to be found on the terraces (or among coppers, say).

Generally when I have debated with EDL members on the street (which are fairly easy to come across living in West Yorkshire), giving a general class analysis along with explaining the complexity of Islamic culture and beliefs as well as comparing it to other religious thought has worked well to a degree. I've not converted anyone in to a class struggle anarchist but I think its a better way to deal with some of them instead of shouting 'Nazi' at them or making it out that they're all illiterate. I'd say if this sort of approach of trying to talk to the members of the EDL instead of turning their demos into a circus straight away might of avoided a lot of shit thats gone on since.

Never seen the point in shouting "Nazi" at someone, or talking about "the Nazi BNP" or "the Nazi EDL". Just makes people sound like petulant twats. Call 'em what they are, if you're going to shout at them at all - call them racists.

I reckon you're right insofar as talking might be a better method of convincing the EDL's "floaters", the ideologically-unconvinced folks who're just along for the ride, to have a think about what they're supporting, because sure as hell, getting shouted at by Weyman's Warriors is just going to unify them with their more hardcore brethren against the Trots.
 
yeah the link says that,

What the link doesn't say is that the to the best of my knowledge, the Vlaams Belang were the first European far-right party to renounce anti-semitism, replace with Islamophobia, and adopt a pro-Israel (Likud-Herut) stance, after deliberate outreach from the Counter Jihad Europa Project.
http://www.powerbase.info/index.php/CounterJihad_Europa

Expert on the Counter Jihad Project Toby Archer explains in this document:

Learning to love the Jews: the impact of the War on Terror and the counter-jihad blogosphere on European far right parties. said:
Despite its ultra-nationalist discourse, the European far right has long shown some internationalism, as connections between various fascist and skinhead groups in Europe demonstrate1. But post-9/11 we have seen a new phenomenon of populist far-right parties who seriously seek wider political support being impacted upon by the originally predominantly-American originating counter-jihad discourse that both reflects and contributes to the U.S. government’s self-proclaimed “War on Terror”. Recently this discourse has produced “the Counter-Jihad” movement: a loose network of activists that has formed as an online, imagined community within the “blogosphere”. The impact of the discourse in general and the movement in particular on European politics has been to enable far-right parties to move away from their previously anti-Semitic rhetoric and replace it with an increased emphasis on the danger that Islam (and, hence, Muslim immigrants and their descendants) present to “European culture”. This is most clearly visible with Vlaams Belang in Belgium adopting a strongly pro-Israeli stance and courting Belgian Jews, whilst bringing anti-immigration politics to the heart of the Belgian political system. Similar trends have been visible to some extent in other countries such as Sweden, Denmark and the UK. This has, in turn, led to divisions in the “Counter-Jihad” movement, with influential right wing American bloggers breaking with their European counterparts on the basis of the historical anti-Semitism of these European populists, whilst the European anti-Muslim voices are more willing to rehabilitate far-right groups, giving parties like the Sweden Democrats and Vlaams Belang the benefit of the doubt that they have put any racist (or at least antisemitic) tendencies behind them. http://uit.no/getfile.php?PageId=1410&FileId=1337 (PDF)

If you take time to read the PDF, you find it very enlightening
 
What the link doesn't say is that the to the best of my knowledge, the Vlaams Belang were the first European far-right party to renounce anti-semitism, replace with Islamophobia, and adopt a pro-Israel (Likud-Herut) stance, after deliberate outreach from the Counter Jihad Europa Project.
http://www.powerbase.info/index.php/CounterJihad_Europa

Expert on the Counter Jihad Project Toby Archer explains in this document:



If you take time to read the PDF, you find it very enlightening

Does this mean that zionist interference in european politics is helping to shift the political axis of the far right and thus giving them a new lease of life, a modern form?
 
Does this mean that zionist interference in european politics is helping to shift the political axis of the far right and thus giving them a new lease of life, a modern form?

Sigh....I wish you'd worded that just a smidgen better -d'you mean "interference" from specifically certain Israeli politicians etc, or others?

As for the "switch" from anti-Semitism to Islamophobia from the "New Right", I've noted that this was taking place in the 90's from certain quarters (didn't some of the Front National lot begin to do this in thhe late 90's?) - see also the former Yugoslavia wars etc, where certain types would barrack for eg. the Croatian "nationalists" against Bosniaks. Also, with the benefit of history, it's quite notable too that when Nick Griffin won leadership of the BNP from John Tyndall, he began to purge their focus on "world conspiracy" and began to ramp up idealogical attacks on British Muslims - he was very well versed in this by the time his interaction in Bradford (arguably) helped significantly inflame tensions there, not long before the riots happenend...
 
Sigh....I wish you'd worded that just a smidgen better -d'you mean "interference" from specifically certain Israeli politicians etc, or others?

As for the "switch" from anti-Semitism to Islamophobia from the "New Right", I've noted that this was taking place in the 90's from certain quarters (didn't some of the Front National lot begin to do this in thhe late 90's?) - see also the former Yugoslavia wars etc, where certain types would barrack for eg. the Croatian "nationalists" against Bosniaks. Also, with the benefit of history, it's quite notable too that when Nick Griffin won leadership of the BNP from John Tyndall, he began to purge their focus on "world conspiracy" and began to ramp up idealogical attacks on British Muslims - he was very well versed in this by the time his interaction in Bradford (arguably) helped significantly inflame tensions there, not long before the riots happenend...

Isn't this part of the shift from racial to cultural nationalism ?
 
The39thStep - I'd certainly agree w/you that the "New Right" (particularly in Europe) have been banging the cultural nationalism (or perhaps more accurately, a "Europe A Nation") drum for at least a couple of decades now (longer, if you consider the influence of certain Euro-based "thinkers"), and that overt racism as a political movement in the UK had its day with the removal of Tyndall as BNP leader. Is the EDL a "cultural nationalist" movement? To some degree, yes, as they wish to see a return to "English culture" and a removal of what they see as political and cultural "Marxism". How that squares though with Yaxley-Lennon and co's assertion that all Islam (and thus all UK-based Muslims) are "radical", and that they "don't belong here", I'm (genuinely) not sure on though....but the "cultural nationalism" idea has certainly gained ground here in the mainstream (look at the Mail and Express articles on immigration, "culture" etc etc, for example, not to mention less-than-temperate remarks from MPs, commentators etc), and ain't going away any time soon....
 
A (Far) Right Mess by ‘Malatesta’
Dear, oh dear, oh dear. What a week it’s been for the English Defence League’s Tommy Robinson AKA Stephen Yaxley-Lennon. Much of the UK media have been busy trying to finger the EDL for connections with nutjob Norwegian murderer Anders Breivik and with the EDL’s Facebook pages and web forums featuring tacit support for his ‘politics’ then it has proved to be not a difficult job.

Twitching Tommy!
Tommy has been in the media this week, the best of which was on Newsnight with a bored looking Jeremy Paxman that showed Tommy to be a twitching sweaty coke fiend ranting away and having difficulty keeping his toys aboard the pram. Despite the EDL’s ludicrous claims to be a ‘non-violent, non-profit making, human rights organisation’ Twitching Tom had been found guilty earlier that day of football related violence. Something that Paxman failed to mention. Tommy was sentenced to a 12-month community rehabilitation order, 150 hours of unpaid work and was banned from football grounds for three years. Tommy was very keen on stressing that the Norwegian massacre could happen in the UK in 5-10 years time if anti-Islamic sentiment keeps being suppressed. Although he was a bit vague on how killing 76 white kids and blowing up a nice old building is going to help his ‘non-violent’ cause. One of the unsurprising things about fanatics like Breivik is that they are so often attracted to far right groups as are many others. Check here for further details.
http://malatesta32.wordpress.com/2010/08/12/nazis-jailed/

A couple of things come out of the BBC and other appearances. Firstly, after his arrest for public order offences a couple of months back Twitching Tommy’s bail restrictions stated that he was not to have anything to do with the EDL until the case comes up in October. Forgive one’s naivety but isn’t appearing on Newsnight representing the EDL somehow contrary to these conditions? And secondly, why is the BBC interviewing a career criminal who has done a year inside for assaulting a girl and also has been arrested at least 7 times since the start of 2009? As he is currently awaiting trial for other offences as well as being under investigation for fraud – hence his bank account being frozen – should the BBC be featuring him on their flagship programme? Twitching Tom is currently asking for 50 quid a pop for any media interviews claiming variously that he needs the cash to rent a hotel conference room for meetings in Luton and that because of the limited access to his bank account he could do with half a ton pocket money (and isn’t 50 quid the going rate for a wrap of Charlie?) Tommy is rapidly becoming a general without an army as the North West Infidels appear to be heading off on their own and the North East Infidels are being steered into a more virulent direction by that other career criminal and arse clown Derek Fender. Read all about it here:
http://www.edlnews.co.uk/edl-news/the-inner-workings-of-edls-secret-groups

Meshuggenahs!
The EDL got into a right kosher pickle recently when paper Jewish Divsion leader Roberta ‘EDL No’ Moore tried to link up with the Jewish Task Force whose leader had been in jail for terrorist offences. Oops! Moore was eventually booted out for making mental statements and generally being a PR liability. And now there are ongoing problems with her replacement Robert Bartholomeus who appears to be endorsing Breivik’s actions much to the irritation of the various EDL forum posters.

After the Moore fiasco many on the EDL forums were angry that they should be seen to be supporting Israel when they were the ‘English’ Defence League. Tommy responded in no uncertain terms that EDL support for Israel would continue. Is this because of Alan Lake by any chance? Lake has been accused of being a Zionist and has been bankrolling Tommy for some time now and Lake, Moore and Tommy have all been photographed together. On the neo-Nazi websites accusations of being a ‘Zionist,’ ‘red’ or ‘nonce’ are frequently made and many have called the EDL a Zionist front and for once the accusation may prove true. If Lake is still funding Tommy then he’s hardly going to allow him to renounce one of his principle interests - which is Zionism. So although a lot of EDL members thought they were flapping the Star of David to annoy ‘muslamics’ the Star is now there for good and the EDL leadership, i.e., Tommy, is going to find it difficult to extricate himself from Israeli extremism. Paul Ray who was booted out of the EDL by Twitching Tom has been ranting away on his website about being a Knight’s Templar and attempting to link Breivik somehow to Alan Lake but this has yet to bear fruit. (And Knight’s Templar? That’s soooo 12th Century!).

Plodding Along
After all the hoo-hah over Norway British plod have decided to ‘crack down on far right terrorism’ but first they will have to finally admit that they were completely wrong in not classifying the EDL as a far right organisation. They are. The EDL is full of known supporters of the BNP, Combat 18 and other nutty fascist grupuscules and the documentation is extensive on antifascist websites. So maybe Plod should log on and do a bit more research. With the recent exposure of ‘Mark Stone’ – and the much welcomed collapse of the trial of the eco-activists in Nottingham – it is clear that plod spend far too much time infiltrating left wing groups whilst apparently ignoring the far right.
http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2011/01/472363.html

Without getting involved in the general weirdness of the man, one of David Shayler’s concerns whilst at MI5 was their over focussing on the far left (Class War, Communist Party) whilst ignoring the far right. Plod have found themselves in a similar situation but this does not come as a surprise to antifascists: as many EDL members say on the forums the coppers at their demos are mostly sympathetic which is something that many counter-protestors can verify. The EDL’s web forums and Facebook pages are full of violent threats, racist outpourings and generally deranged ranting so rather than nosing into left wing business shouldn’t plod be looking into the EDL on the web and perhaps even arresting Tommy who has breached his bail conditions by being all over the national media! Surely that would mean remand as he cannot be trusted to observe the conditions laid down by the court. So why are plod content to leave him alone? Is it because he works for them? Surely not. ‘Sir’Tommy is a hero. It says so on the EDL forums!

Perhaps plod could also take a wee peak at the Redwatch site and the support it gets from some members of the EDL whilst they are logged on. This site is a potential hit list of political opponents used by far right groups to intimidate left wingers. Redwatch was started by Kevin Watmough, former member of BNP, Combat 18 and the useless British People’s Party, and onetime wet nurse to ex-NF coup leader Eddy ‘Adult Diapers’ Morrison. Watmough is a nasty little scrote and his address is not hard to find. Officers! Redwatch is a hitlist and the kind of thing that could be called a ‘far right terror threat.’ Ask any trade unionist or antifascist who have had their windows put through or received threatening phone calls because of it.

As stated earlier the EDL still claim to be a ‘non-violent human rights group’ which Robinson’s recent conviction for, er violence, must repudiate. They have also been verbal against trade unionists and student protesting against the recent cuts. So for all their rhetoric about the white working class being ignored the EDL turn round and attack members of the white working class. As someone on Urban75 rightly says, the EDL are technically a scab organisation.

And Finally ...
Best article this week at Expose here:
http://exposingon.tumblr.com/post/8046023850/home-grown-breivik-to-be
Excellent.
Malatesta: No Copyright
http://malatesta32.wordpress.com/
 
Originally Posted by Luther Blissett
What the link doesn't say is that the to the best of my knowledge, the Vlaams Belang were the first European far-right party to renounce anti-semitism, replace with Islamophobia, and adopt a pro-Israel (Likud-Herut) stance, after deliberate outreach from the Counter Jihad Europa Project.
http://www.powerbase.info/index.php/CounterJihad_Europa

Expert on the Counter Jihad Project Toby Archer explains in this document:



Tommy responded in no uncertain terms that EDL support for Israel would continue. Is this because of Alan Lake by any chance? Lake has been accused of being a Zionist and has been bankrolling Tommy for some time now and Lake, Moore and Tommy have all been photographed together. On the neo-Nazi websites accusations of being a ‘Zionist,’ ‘red’ or ‘nonce’ are frequently made and many have called the EDL a Zionist front and for once the accusation may prove true.

With the indications in the 2 above quotes in mind, can anybody elaborate further on how far the influence of zionist groups (ie, thru sponsorship) is influencing the direction of extreme right wing political groups in europe?
 
With the indications in the 2 above quotes in mind, can anybody elaborate further on how far the influence of zionist groups (ie, thru sponsorship) is influencing the direction of extreme right wing political groups in europe?

the 'malatesta's' have pointed this out before that for a lot of right wingers like the EDL, antisemitism is irrelevant as they have so little contact with jewish communities and for many people the orthodox jewish community - who attract the most virulent antisemitism - are simply not that visible in their towns. likewise, 'blacks' are alright cos of the afro-carribean community's contribution to popular culture and the assimilation of a lot of black guys into football firmslike birmingham zulus or man city's kool kats. what is left is what we call 'anti-paki' politics. see here:
http://malatesta32.wordpress.com/2010/08/22/bradford-‘anti-asianism’/
as for exact details Oik, it is hard to establish without a wee bit of forensic journalism etc.
 
Interesting that Searchlight are now demanding that the EDL be dealt with under counter terrorism strategy.

Steps, searchlight like the cops play up certain 'threats' for job creation and/or funding continuation. it maintains their existence. searchlight are professional 'antifascists' and it is a job for them. take away the 'threat' and no more job. some us antifascists do it for free!
 
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