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Driving Standards

Aaaaaaaaaand right on cue.

How fucking predictable.

But, but, but ... motorists ...

:rolleyes:
Every time. Rather than condemn a cyclist, try a bit of deflection and whataboutery.
Makes me wonder what's going through their mind as they type... "I'm not slowing down for any cunt. Nor am I going to accept responsibility for my actions, because cars! Anyway, she was old, so she probably didn't have long left."
 
Just been driving through the town, it’s a 30mph limit, parked cars on the road etc. I have been doing 25-30mph I would say. Sensible given the traffic conditions and parked cars

Bloke behind me in a suv, looked like a gammon, anyway an angry old white man, you know the type.

We get to a roundabout where the single lane fans out to two, left lane for going left only, I move into the right lane as I am going to turn right.

He puts his foot down, overtaking on the roundabout, almost hitting another vehicle while doing so, then comes off the roundabout at the same exit I do. He then proceeds to get stuck behind a bus.

What is with the aggression? I just don’t get it. I spent my journey home wondering how many points he has on his licence.
 
I know it's not a driving incident as such, but 1 year 10 months for destroying a life over a row about a parking space...

Yeah saw that, one year seems ridiculously light.

There was a one-punch-death caused by some coked up arsehole in Guildford in 2019, got 7.5 years for it, the judge apologised that under guidance he could not give more, the court of Appeal found they could increase it to 9 years 9 months. Still really struggling to see why this offence is not murder, you are aiming to cause significant harm and you actions end in a death, but nearly 10 years is better than less than two, must really compound the grief of the family to see the law judge their loved one's life to be worth so little.
 
Yeah saw that, one year seems ridiculously light.

There was a one-punch-death caused by some coked up arsehole in Guildford in 2019, got 7.5 years for it, the judge apologised that under guidance he could not give more, the court of Appeal found they could increase it to 9 years 9 months. Still really struggling to see why this offence is not murder, you are aiming to cause significant harm and you actions end in a death, but nearly 10 years is better than less than two, must really compound the grief of the family to see the law judge their loved one's life to be worth so little.
Sadly, a murder conviction requires an intent to kill.
 
That's manslaughter. If the intention is not to kill but it can be foreseen reasonably as an outcome it's still just manslaughter. Murder requires that you literally intend to kill someone.
 
That's manslaughter. If the intention is not to kill but it can be foreseen reasonably as an outcome it's still just manslaughter. Murder requires that you literally intend to kill someone.



Maybe let these folk know of your superior knowledge on the subject: Homicide: Murder, manslaughter, infanticide and causing or allowing the death or serious injury of a child or vulnerable adult | The Crown Prosecution Service

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Cos it seems the judges have been getting it wrong all this time.
 
That's manslaughter. If the intention is not to kill but it can be foreseen reasonably as an outcome it's still just manslaughter. Murder requires that you literally intend to kill someone.

No, BH is correct.

Murder just requires the intent to cause serious injury.

If you beat the crap out of someone with the intent to hurt them badly and they subsequently die, that would be murder.

If you push someone out of the way, with no intent to harm them, and they fall under a bus, that's likely to be manslaughter.
 
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Yeah saw that, one year seems ridiculously light.

There was a one-punch-death caused by some coked up arsehole in Guildford in 2019, got 7.5 years for it, the judge apologised that under guidance he could not give more, the court of Appeal found they could increase it to 9 years 9 months. Still really struggling to see why this offence is not murder, you are aiming to cause significant harm and you actions end in a death, but nearly 10 years is better than less than two, must really compound the grief of the family to see the law judge their loved one's life to be worth so little.
Presumably one punch doesn’t qualify as intent to cause grievous bodily harm?
 
In other news, a cyclist doing up to 29 mph when he hit and killed a pedestrian doesn't even get charged with anything at all, as 'speed limits don't apply to bicycles'.

What does this mean for electric scooters? I was walking through a pedestrianised earlier and I swear a person on an electric scooter was riding through at 40+ MPH with complete disregard for everyone else.
 
Bicylcles and scooters don’t have speedometers, so it would be impossible to enforce a speed limit for them. Doesn’t mean cyclists and scootists should be able to rush around with impugnity though. There are other laws they are breaking.
 
Bicylcles and scooters don’t have speedometers, so it would be impossible to enforce a speed limit for them. Doesn’t mean cyclists and scootists should be able to rush around with impugnity though. There are other laws they are breaking.

Electric scooters are motorised vehicles, same as cars, so they should have the things that other motorised vehicles have. A motorised vehicle is one can move solely under its own power, which rules out e-bikes, properly known as e-assist bikes, rather than the numerous electric motorbikes you see hurtling about which the press and often the police refer as e-bikes.
 
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Bicylcles and scooters don’t have speedometers, so it would be impossible to enforce a speed limit for them. Doesn’t mean cyclists and scootists should be able to rush around with impugnity though. There are other laws they are breaking.
Electric scooters are supposed to be limited to 30 MPH, I think. Some do have speedometers. All should have speedometers.
 
What does this mean for electric scooters? I was walking through a pedestrianised earlier and I swear a person on an electric scooter was riding through at 40+ MPH with complete disregard for everyone else.
Legally it means fuck all even though there is actual legislation in place already governing electric scooters and e-bikes, because the coppers can’t be arsed to do anything about it.

Pretty much every single privately owned electric scooter on UK streets is being operated illegally by its rider. The streets of London are similarly flooded with illegal electric bikes. And almost every single day I see numerous instances of both types of riders not just travelling with impunity, but jumping red lights, riding on pavements, not even having any lights on at night, often while wearing all black like the thick twats they are for good measure. And on the numerous occasions over the past few years when I’ve witnessed this next or behind a cop car, not once they have bothered to do anything about it.

So in answer to your question, what it really means is that pedestrian serious injuries and occasionally deaths by e-scooterists and e-bikers are only going to increase. But I guess because motor vehicles kill more people, it will be brushed under the carpet because the ‘but motorists’ effect. As illustrated very recently in this thread.

As a motorcyclist, the thing I find the most indescribably idiotic/ vindictive about the issue of pedestrian safety in places like London nowadays is that in the much vaunted, endlessly wanked-over LTN zones that have popped up all over the place, trained, insured, number plate-identifiable, fully legally accountable motorcyclists (and as it should be, before anyone dares to suggest I object to that), are excluded from them. But highly illegal e-scooters and e-bikes, capable of speeds over 25 mph and in most cases operated by people who are completely careless at best if not reckless cunts, are most welcome to go through such supposed oasis of pedestrian and cyclist safety. If I lived in an LTN, I know which type of road user I would have less trouble using my street. But as everyone here knows, the ‘motor’ part of the word motorcycle makes them and their riders Teh Evil, so that’s that.
 
At least there is legislation in place for electric scooters so if something does go wrong they stand a better chance of being held accountable for their actions.
 
Finally an appropriate lengthy sentence. It is still shit that it needs to take a combination of drink driving, filming whilst driving, extremely high speed, and multiple fatalities for the book to be properly thrown at the culprit.
 
This is not good and really don't think this will make a difference
 
Shocking someone facing such serious charges was allowed to leave the country. fwiw we do have a pretty efficient extradition agreement with Pakistan should he fail to come back by the sentencing date and any time he spends held in Pakistan will not count towards his sentence in the UK.
 
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