WouldBe
Dislicksick
Just because I've not driven for 20+ years doesn't mean I've forgotten how to drive.
Indicators are there to let all other road users know what you intend to do. Failure to use them is ignorant.
Drivers who don't indicate at junctions
- Thread starter skyscraper101
- Start date
Indicators are there to let all other road users know what you intend to do. Failure to use them is ignorant.
InArduisFouette
Active Member
you are still ignorant of good practie in Driving standards, IPSGA hasn't changed significantly in that timeJust because I've not driven for 20+ years doesn't mean I've forgotten how to drive.
Indicators are there to let all other road users know what you intend to do. Failure to use them is ignorant.
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
And in answer to my own question, this table would suggest that pedestrian safety is in fact much better in Germany than in the UK. But I'm sure jaywalking laws in Germany and pedestrians religiously obeying the red man there have nothing to do with it.
Germany and the UK pretty much neck & neck there.
The USA though
scifisam
feck! arse! girls! drink!
Yeah, that's a minuscule difference. And then the country that actually jails people for jaywalking has almost exactly 20 times the pedestrian deaths! I don't think it really shows that jaywalking laws help...Germany and the UK pretty much neck & neck there.
The USA though
Everyone should take care when crossing the road though, obviously. Even if you were in the right (and you're not always, as a pedestrian) you'd still be dead.
WouldBe
Dislicksick
Quick look I've had of that doesn't say anything about not indicating.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Anyone who bangs on about IPSGA has more than likely just done a one or two day public driving course. Most drivers with even modest experience do all that anyway.
Again, there is no advantage in NOT indicating EVER. It's a theory wank game for bellends, and a great way to get a 40 page thread on Pistonheads.
Again, there is no advantage in NOT indicating EVER. It's a theory wank game for bellends, and a great way to get a 40 page thread on Pistonheads.
WouldBe
Dislicksick
My uncle was an advanced motorcycle instructor and examiner and whenever I've been pillion with him he's always indicated before making a manoeuvre.
InArduisFouette
Active Member
interestign given that he would be marked down in certain circumstances for an unwarranted use of signalsMy uncle was an advanced motorcycle instructor and examiner and whenever I've been pillion with him he's always indicated before making a manoeuvre.
what does your uncle say aobut road positioning to give information aobut your intentions ?
WouldBe
Dislicksick
Nothing, he died years ago.
Your road position tells other drivers nothing about your intentions that's what indicators are for.
A380
How do I change this 'custom title' thing then?
Indeed
In the system of car control (which is a bit dated, but that's for another thread) teaches that you should only use the indicators if there is someone in sight to whom that information would be of use (could be another driver, cyclist or pedestrian). The reason isn't to save indicator bulbs, its all part of the same system to try and get the driver to be aware of their total surroundings. So if approaching a junction or a lane change the driver should already know (by virtue of their constant scan) if there is anyone who could possibly be affected by their actions and if not, they shouldn't indicate. Use of the indicator where there is no one who needs to see it it shows the driver hadn't maintained the correct detailed picture of their surroundings.
InArduisFouette
Active Member
thanks for the confirmation that you are grasping, a read of A380 post may be informative as might watching some of Reg Local;s work on You tube
InArduisFouette
Active Member
we could argue BGOL and various issues with the System as rigidly employed by some Police instructors and the I Am Meldrews but that is tangential to the discussion at hand
you sum up the System;s attitude towards signally very succinctly
A380
How do I change this 'custom title' thing then?
If you can't see someone that can see you (dark clothing etc, no lights) then you aren't driving to the standards required. Missing noticing a pedestrian or a cyclist in those circumstances would be a massive downcheck.
SpookyFrank
Float like a caterpillar, sting like a tree
What's the worst that could happen if you just indicated on the off chance?
A380
How do I change this 'custom title' thing then?
Nothing. it's not about wether you indicate or not. It's about making sure the driver is fully engaged and aware of their surroundings at all times. The non use of indicators when there is no one around is an indicator ( if you will) of that.
WouldBe
Dislicksick
A380
How do I change this 'custom title' thing then?
You're missing the point. It's about making sure people are driving with the best possible observation and awareness. Don't worry if you aren't capable of driving like that, it. doesn't make you that bad a driver. Just not as good as you could be.What if they are 200+ yards away?
It costs fuck all to put your indicators on.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Ok, I'll play
No it doesn't. At least not necessarily. You can still have effectively completed all your scans and consciously decide to indicate to no one in particular. The argument against it is that it promotes "autopilot" driving, but the argument for it is that auto reflexes such as that are more useful than harmful, particularly for drivers who spend a lot of time in built-up areas where peds can occasionally be hard to see, or may appear unexpectedly.
In 30-odd years I've never seen this argument won by the "don't indicate" side when they're asked to provide a clear scenario of greater benefit than harm.
Your turn!
SpookyFrank
Float like a caterpillar, sting like a tree
The biggest impediment to seeing hazards when driving at night is other drivers' thermonuclear LED headlights.
InArduisFouette
Active Member
there's a junction i used fairly frequently it;a T junction but there is a little bit of a bend in the road that goes across the top of the T which impedes visibility and on one side of the road going off there;s greenery that impedes the view , and when doing my 'civvie' advanced driving my commentary on approaching that junction to turn off the main road would be
I can see that i don't have a clear view through the junction if i maintain a normal position, therefore i'm going to position out to if not slightly across the centre line , i also can see i have a limited view off the right due to the greenery soi'm braking sooner and morte firmly thatn i would otherwise , i'm considering signalling to make my intention very clear to any one i can't yet see but who might see me before i have a clear view of them.
further down the same road there's a TOTSO T junction with the road marked to indicate the main road goes round the corner, it;s also very clear sightlines wise , my approch there will be totally different and if it's clear would me no sighalling, no change of speed and kiss the centeline marking as i take the turn off
InArduisFouette
Active Member
oh look it's spymaster come to wave his Dunning -Kruger cardOk, I'll play
No it doesn't. At least not necessarily. You can still have effectively completed all your scans and consciously decide to indicate to no one in particular. The argument against it is that it promotes "autopilot" driving, but the argument for it is that auto reflexes such as that are more useful than harmful, particularly for drivers who spend a lot of time in built-up areas where peds can occasionally be hard to see, or may appear unexpectedly.
In 30-odd years I've never seen this argument won by the "don't indicate" side when they're asked to provide a clear scenario of greater benefit than harm.
Your turn!
WouldBe
Dislicksick
I've not had an accident in all the years I've been driving.
Agent Sparrow
the age of slippers and migraines
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Don't worry too much. Most people find it's a temporary affliction.
SpookyFrank
Float like a caterpillar, sting like a tree
I hope you bought the centreline marking breakfast afterwards. Or at least booked it a taxi home.
InArduisFouette
Active Member
you seem to be missing the point here
on one side we have people who quite clearly have not engaged in driver development since passing their DSA test ( if they have a full car or motorbike licence ) claiming that you must signal for every manouvere
on the otherside we have people who have been involved in driver development activities whether for pleasure or for work , talking aobut the nuance of applying the System of car Control in daily driving
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