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Creating "Lexit": What is to be done?

How do they plan implementing this agenda? Who's going to do it?

They will change it from within. Oh wait, that went well Varoufakis.

I'm surprised DIEM are still going. Just looks like more nods to 'making the EU more democratic' and 'reforming banking" to me. And where is any talk of how the working class will be engaged in any of this? They have to be active in parties/politics already by the looks of things. Seems all rather top down to me.
 
You can follow the link for the full time frame, short term goals are those that can be implemented in individual states, mid term and long term goals require more multi-lateralism between different countries. Over the last year (their first anniversary was a few weeks ago I think) they have been quite successful at building up a network across every Europe with organised groups in every country - it seems they hope existing left wing parties will affiliate to their project, or else establish completely new parties. Caroline Lucas and John McDonnell are affiliated if I recall correctly.
Oh well if Caroline Lucas has signed up!
 
They will change it from within. Oh wait, that went well Varoufakis.

I'm surprised DIEM are still going. Just looks like more nods to 'making the EU more democratic' and 'reforming banking" to me. And where is any talk of how the working class will be engaged in any of this? They have to be active in parties/politics already by the looks of things. Seems all rather top down to me.

No, Syriza hoped to change it from within. Diem25 was formed little over a year ago in response to Syriza's failure to do exactly that.

The far right are doing pretty well at engaging in parties and politics, and meanwhile a large part of the left sees itself as above such things and is achieving precisely zero, or even less than zero seeing as things continue to get worse and worse from the perspective of labour. A lot of people on this forum seem to shoot down each and every organisation and public figure as fatally compromised, but don't seem to offer any feasible steps forward of their own, and whatever they have been doing the last few decades is clearly not working.
 
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I don't think this approach is helpful. Coalition building is important, and apart from being painfully middle class there is really nothing wrong with Caroline Lucas really.
Your post did nothing to address chilango's question. Because the answer is they have no real plan to implement their scheme. It is just a utopian fantasy that will never get anywhere.
 
How do they plan implementing this agenda? Who's going to do it?
When I first read about it about a year ago, it seemed that Zizek and Julian Assange were involved. Which I have to admit was enough put me right off straight away. Since then I've discovered Chomsky and Negri are on board.

However, what stands out to me is that it seems to be relying on organisations and institutions that people are already mistrustful of and estranged from. (And rightly so).
 
Your post did nothing to address chilango's question. Because the answer is they have no real plan to implement their scheme. It is just a utopian fantasy that will never get anywhere.

Having a scheme is, at least, the first step. Creating a pan-European network of activists and supporters is the second step. This is how far they have gotten so far, which is a reasonable starting point, and infinitely better than not having any plan at all.
 
Yup. There's a big gap between the idea and the actual people in communities.
These sorts of thing always remind me of
Charles Fourier and his phalanxes. A very intricate and detailed plan to save society (in their eyes) but no idea how to go about doing it.

I couldn't see it in the wikipedia article, with my quick look. But I believe Fourier took out a regular advert in a newspaper asking for a business man to invest in his project. And he sat in a particular cafe, on a certain day and time every week waiting for his invester to come along. But unsurprisingly none every did.

It's basically an appeal to the powerful to destroy their own power.
 
Maintaining the City's ability to function as a key lever of neoliberal/oligarchic power & wealth defence was pretty much the key motivation for the Atlanticist Brexiteers.
iirc the EU was bringing in stricter protections to the banking sector, which London didn't like, not least a Tobin Tax, which the City was desperate to wiggle out of. I haven't followed this closely enough though...
 
iirc the EU was bringing in stricter protections to the banking sector, which London didn't like, not least a Tobin Tax, which the City was desperate to wiggle out of. I haven't followed this closely enough though...
Attitudes in the city obviously vary according to the degree of dependence upon European market trading but, in general, there is a huge suspicion and antipathy towards the EU's post-crisis regulatory/transparency agenda.
 
These sorts of thing always remind me of
Charles Fourier and his phalanxes. A very intricate and detailed plan to save society (in their eyes) but no idea how to go about doing it.

I couldn't see it in the wikipedia article, with my quick look. But I believe Fourier took out a regular advert in a newspaper asking for a business man to invest in his project. And he sat in a particular cafe, on a certain day and time every week waiting for his invester to come along. But unsurprisingly none every did.

It's basically an appeal to the powerful to destroy their own power.

I think relying on relatively (but not exclusively) middle class activists in the initial stages is okay. Capital is globalised, so labour must also be globalised, but realistically it is only the middle classes who have the social capital needed to spearhead an international political project.
 
I think relying on relatively (but not exclusively) middle class activists in the initial stages is okay. Capital is globalised, so labour must also be globalised, but realistically it is only the middle classes who have the social capital needed to spearhead an international political project.
So as a working class person with limited social capital I should just fuck of and leave politics to my betters? They will sort it all out? But without bothering to ask me what I want or anything.
 
So as a working class person with limited social capital I should just fuck of and leave politics to my betters? They will sort it all out? But without botherimg to ask me what I want or anything.

There is nothing stopping you taking part in DiEM25, my point is that DiEM25 being started by some middle class activists is no reason to dismiss it. People who could be considered middle class have always had a role to play in the labour movement.
 
I think relying on relatively (but not exclusively) middle class activists in the initial stages is okay. Capital is globalised, so labour must also be globalised, but realistically it is only the middle classes who have the social capital needed to spearhead an international political project.
Exactly what I don't want to have anything to do with. Indeed I think such an approach is actively harmful.


And this is precisely why the soppy 'well we're all on the same side really' stuff is absolute rubbish. You asked what the matter with Caroline Lucas is, how about being a pimp for the LibDem scum, calling a party that introduced the bedroom tax and tripled tuition fees progressive.
 
Exactly what I don't want to have anything to do with. Indeed I think such an approach is actively harmful.


And this is precisely why the soppy 'well we're all on the same side really' stuff is absolute rubbish. You asked what the matter with Caroline Lucas is, how about being a pimp for the LibDem scum, calling a party that introduced the bedroom tax and tripled tuition fees progressive.

Give me something then. What should be done? It is fucking depressing reading this forum sometimes, because apparently everything is shit and hopeless and doomed from the start, apart from obscure workplace and community organising which not only seems to be achieving precisely fuck all but has scant evidence for even existing.
 
I think there are rumblings of discontent around the nhs - lots of people having difficulty getting gp appointments, spending hours on trollies in a&e, difficulties getting mental health treatment, social care cuts leading to increased hospitalisations and bed blocking, proposed closures of rural hospitals, people getting letters from private contractors saying their medical records have been reviewed and their medication is being reduced without being seen, etc.

Regarding appts, in this last week I've had a haematology appointment and a sleep disorder clinic appt rescheduled, both by two months, for the second time, and friends with non-priority appts have experienced the same. As for GP appts, all local practices are running at about 3 weeks, and the local walk-in is running at over-capacity.
 
Regarding appts, in this last week I've had a haematology appointment and a sleep disorder clinic appt rescheduled, both by two months, for the second time, and friends with non-priority appts have experienced the same. As for GP appts, all local practices are running at about 3 weeks, and the local walk-in is running at over-capacity.
Thats terrible, VP. And so many people in so many areas experiencing the same.
 
Give me something then. What should be done? It is fucking depressing reading this forum sometimes, because apparently everything is shit and hopeless and doomed from the start, apart from obscure workplace and community organising which not only seems to be achieving precisely fuck all but has scant evidence for even existing.
Seems a little harsh to cast folks trying to fathom stuff for themselves as "depressing". I think people posting here would be deeply suspicious of anyone standing up and declaring that they had the answer; surely there's a good deal of arguing, analysing and interpreting needed before 'we' know what is to be done.
FWIW I'm beginning to wonder about the wisdom of using the term 'Lexit' in the thread title; that might be encouraging some to think that 'we' have to address this question within the absurd time-frame of the post A50 negotiations. The dilemma of what the left should do is ages old; undeniably we have the prospect of a changed specific context within which the question is framed, but it does really raise the same old debates about gradualism vrs revolutionary change and vanguardist vrs autonomous etc.
 
Give me something then. What should be done? It is fucking depressing reading this forum sometimes, because apparently everything is shit and hopeless and doomed from the start, apart from obscure workplace and community organising which not only seems to be achieving precisely fuck all but has scant evidence for even existing.
Are you reading the same thread as me? I'm not seeing despair.

If you're expecting sudden global change, then you really need to recalibrate your expectations. Not least because the superstructure in which you're putting your faith will not change independent of the base. Those structures - state, banks, political parties - service the property relations of our current mode of production. As emanymton said, they won't turn up for a cafe reservation in the name of Yanis, and vote to change themselves.

Look at previous overnight successes: the Spanish revolution, which seems to many to suddenly spring into being as a reaction against the military putsch, is described in Murray Bookchin's book The Spanish Anarchists: the heroic years 1868-1936. The title itself is a clue.

"Their movement's 'heroic years,' 1868 - 1938, were marked by a fascinating process of experimentation on organisational forms, decision-making techniques, educational goals, and methods of struggle". (p228)

In other words, there has to be groundwork. There has to be substance behind the ideals.

There were working class networks in the UK, but Thatcherism deliberately destroyed them. She didn't believe in society. She wanted individuals out for themselves.

So we need to rebuild community as a concept, an ideal; the worth of community needs to be reestablished, as well as communities needing to be reestablished as functioning social organs.

But more than that: Thatcher destroyed community because she knew it was a bulwark against the changes she wanted to make. She needed to break down the post war consensus and establish a new 'common sense', and strong community was an alternative power base. Communities can foster their own values, allowing people to question the establishment values propagated in the media. That's their danger.

But this requires rethinking what you think of as politics. Politics as defined by the BBC is the coming and going of groups of managers in government. But what if instead it's the battle of ideas in the culture and life of society, fought by establishing alternative relationships and alternative loci of management and decision making?

So community as the concept of people who live together needs to be reestablished (rather than 'community' as an identity e.g. The gay community). And therefore within that, diversity as a lived reality needs to be shown to be an aspect of community. This can only come by living together, cooperating in common cause. It can't be dispensed from above, like a jug filling a vessel.
 
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