Coronavirus in the UK - news, lockdown and discussion

[Spandex]

Pissing on the memory of the dead.

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Is that same Thomas Heatherwick that designed Johnson's folly, the new Routemaster?

The same Thomas Heatherwick that was paid £2.76m for designing Johnson's other folly, the Garden Bridge that never was?

That Thomas Heatherwick?

 

[Artaxerxes]

Is that same Thomas Heatherwick that designed Johnson's folly, the new Routemaster?

The same Thomas Heatherwick that was paid £2.76m for designing Johnson's other folly, the Garden Bridge that never was?

That Thomas Heatherwick?

The guy who designed a monument in New York that had to be shut because to many people were busy jumping off it. The one who designed a spikey ball of death for 1.5 million quid that fell to bits.

Yes that one.

Certain people in this country only ever fail upwards and I kind of wish I was one of them because I could do with the cash.

 

[teuchter]

Seems a little unfair to Heatherwick to hold him responsible for all of these things.

 

[Spandex]

Seems a little unfair to Heatherwick to hold him responsible for all of these things.

Probably. I quite like his East Beach Cafe in Littlehampton. About the most interesting thing in LA.

He does seem to be Johnson's go to guy for designing publicly funded things.

 

[elbows]

This attempt at an article explaining peak stuff contains plenty of useful data about lag and timing of data vs reality. But it dodges the possibility of their being a simple peak by going on about multiple hills, rather ignoring whats happened in Scotland so far.

There certainly could be multiple hills, but thats not the only possibility.

Has England reached a peak in Covid infections? | Graham Medley

Expect a range of hills rather than a single mountain, says Graham Medley, chair of the Sage sub-group on pandemic modelling

www.theguardian.com

 

[cupid_stunt]

24,950 new cases reported today, bringing the 7-day average down by -21.6%, that figure was -15.4% yesterday.

 

[brogdale]

As shown in the Guardian live feed:

 

[BillRiver]

Pissing on the memory of the dead.

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There already is a Covid memorial in London. It's proper public art, made by the public for the public. It's the wall of hearts by the Thames, near St Thomas' Hospital.

 

[BillRiver]

Seems a little unfair to Heatherwick to hold him responsible for all of these things.

Except that he is responsible, he designed them.

 

[teuchter]

Except that he is responsible, he designed them.

Responsible for what exactly?

 

[elbows]

As shown in the Guardian live feed:

I think it took about a week after the peak in positive cases detected for Scotlands percentage positive to peak and then start to come down.

I dont mess around with such figures myself much but I'll see if I can extract anything useful in that regard from the data I do play with.

Meanwhile I note that Scotlands number of Covid patients in intensive care has continued to increase, no signs of a drop in that yet.

 

[existentialist]

There already is a Covid memorial in London. It's proper public art, made by the public for the public. It's the wall of hearts by the Thames, near St Thomas' Hospital.

View attachment 280636

"Public art"? How's anyone going to make any money out of that???

 

[BillRiver]

Responsible for what exactly?

For them. The things he designed.

 

[SpookyFrank]

.

 

[brogdale]

I think it took about a week after the peak in positive cases detected for Scotlands percentage positive to peak and then start to come down.

I dont mess around with such figures myself much but I'll see if I can extract anything useful in that regard from the data I do play with.

Meanwhile I note that Scotlands number of Covid patients in intensive care has continued to increase, no signs of a drop in that yet.

Yep...

A total of 5,055 patients were in hospital on 26 July, according to the latest figures from NHS England. This is up 33% from the previous week, and is the highest since 18 March.

All regions of England have seen week-on-week increases in patients, with London up 48% from 647 to 957, and the Midlands up 31% from 730 to 959.

The combined area of north-east England and Yorkshire continues to record the highest number of any region, with 1,152 Covid-19 patients on July 26, up 36% week-on-week.

 

[BillRiver]

"Public art"? How's anyone going to make any money out of that???

Tourists? They seem to like visiting places where there is public (outdoor) art.

And yes I do know you were being sarcastic, but honestly I think planners and those in power unvalue public art at their peril. Not just financially, of course.

 

[elbows]

Yep...

Not really sure what recent figures for England have to do with my point about intensive care cases in Scotland to be honest.

Hospital & ICU figures always keep rising for a short while after admissions start to decline. A clear and sustained decline in admissions for England has not been seen yet, so I wouldnt expect the other hospital figures to drop yet. My point about Scotland is slightly different - their ICU cases are still going up despite an apparent admissions peak already having happened, and their peak in positive cases was much earlier than Englands.

 

[elbows]

As shown in the Guardian live feed:

OK Ive had a look to see if I can calculate my own positivity figures using other data that is available from the dashboard download section. Sort of, I can get figures that are broadly in the right range that move in the right direction at about the right time, but they dont quite match up to the figures they calculate themselves, so I wont be publishing graphs of my version.

Anyway my figures for that are starting to drop, and the official ones on the dashboard are just starting to show signs of dropping too. And unlesss there is a sudden change to the number of positive cases coming through the system this week, the drop in percentage positivity should end up being quite noticeable quite soon.

 

[thismoment]

.

 

[elbows]

The dispicable fuckers at the Telegraph are now trying to get the figures regarding how many Covid patients were hospitalised for non-Covid reasons released. I wouldn't mind seeing those figures myself, but the Telegraph have their own disgusting pandemic stance motives for wanting them.

I noticed via tomorrows front pages the following article where they try to pile on pressure by talking about some different data that has apparently been leaked to them. This data gives some indication of when people tested positive, which is related to what they are really after but not at all the same thing. So the article has to do some twists and turns to serve their agenda.

Exclusive: Over half of Covid hospitalisations tested positive after admission

Leaked data suggest vast numbers classed as being hospitalised by the virus when they were admitted with other ailments

www.telegraph.co.uk

They've got a figure of 44% of covid patients having tested positive in the 14 days before they were admitted. 43% testing positive within 2 days of admission, and the remaining 13% testing positive outside that timeframe, which they acknowledge will include people who catch the virus in hospital.

Those figures dont surprise me, and via that data leak the Telegraph still has no idea how many of the 43% + 13% were actually in hospital for non-covid reasons, so they have to dig up people like Carl Heneghan to make noises that support their agenda.

Also to support their shit they make it sound like if a large number of people were hospitalised for other reasons and just happened to have Covid then this would magically make the burden on the NHS less than the routine data implies. As opposed to the reality of such patients simply being a different aspect of pandemic shit the NHS has to deal with at some cost to its capacity and ability to treat everyone safely.

I've read enough Telegraph pandemic articles to know that they often employ logic that other media wont touch with a bargepole, but if this sinister emphasis spreads wider then I can still fall back on number of patients who have tested positive and are in mechanical ventilation beds. That isnt necessarily a completely 'pure' statistic either, but I dont really need to know the medical case history of each person receiving that level of care to know that its very bad news for them to be in mechanical ventilation beds and have covid at the same time.

 

[Buddy Bradley]

The dispicable fuckers at the Telegraph are now trying to get the figures regarding how many Covid patients were hospitalised for non-Covid reasons released. I wouldn't mind seeing those figures myself, but the Telegraph have their own disgusting pandemic stance motives for wanting them.

The method of reporting Covid deaths as "within 28 days of a positive result" does seem almost designed to make you suspicious of exactly how many of those people were run over or otherwise died for non-Covid reasons. Would be nice if the data felt cleaner somehow.

 

[cupid_stunt]

The method of reporting Covid deaths as "within 28 days of a positive result" does seem almost designed to make you suspicious of exactly how many of those people were run over or otherwise died for non-Covid reasons. Would be nice if the data felt cleaner somehow.

The "within 28 days of a positive result" figures are a method of gathering data quickly, whilst it may capture a small number of people that died from totally unrelated reasons to covid, it will also miss some that weren't tested, the figure since mass testing has been available, are similar to the number of people with covid on their death certificate, suggesting it is a good proxy.

There's some lag in reporting the figures for 'covid on their death certificate', but they are on the dashboard* for all to see, but that lag means only fairly accurate 7-day averages are currently only going up to 18th June.

Death certificates are filled out by medical professionals who may take covid test results into account, but are not required to include covid as a cause of death if it isn’t relevant to the death of someone, so will exclude non-covid related deaths, such as being run over.

* scroll down here - https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/deaths

 

[Chilli.s]

What with the 28 days and the only counted the first time it seems that the figures on the dashboard are much less useful than they were

 

[Chz]

Except that he is responsible, he designed them.

He's responsible for the exterior and interior look of the New Bus for London. And, quite frankly, it's pretty good in that respect. It's the engineering of the design that blows goats. Someone took the drawings, said "That looks great! How can we fuck it up?" and went to it. That's not Heatherwick's fault.

 

[teuchter]

He's responsible for the exterior and interior look of the New Bus for London. And, quite frankly, it's pretty good in that respect. It's the engineering of the design that blows goats. Someone took the drawings, said "That looks great! How can we fuck it up?" and went to it. That's not Heatherwick's fault.

Likewise the bits falling off the spiky thing was down to a manufacturing defect.

And it's not Heatherwick who determines what projects Boris Johnson spends money on.

 

[belboid]

Likewise the bits falling off the spiky thing was down to a manufacturing defect.

And it's not Heatherwick who determines what projects Boris Johnson spends money on.

It was a design flaw, which is why his company had to pay Manchester council £1.7m.

 

[teuchter]

It was a design flaw, which is why his company had to pay Manchester council £1.7m.

Heatherwick's company did not do the structural engineering, nor did it carry out the welding. It looks like the structural engineer and contractor were subcontractors to Heatherwick, so his company will have paid out to Manchester council but it will almost certainly have reclaimed most of that from its subcontractors.

Like the routemaster, flaws were in the engineering, which is not what Heatherwick does.

 

[belboid]

Heatherwick's company did not do the structural engineering, nor did it carry out the welding. It looks like the structural engineer and contractor were subcontractors to Heatherwick, so his company will have paid out to Manchester council but it will almost certainly have reclaimed most of that from its subcontractors.

Like the routemaster, flaws were in the engineering, which is not what Heatherwick does.

His company paid the fine. He designed something that could not be built for anything like the price quoted. That is poor design. Quite possibly true for the routemaster too. Looking great is worthless if it can’t be built.

 

[Saul Goodman]

Seems a little unfair to Heatherwick to hold him responsible for all of these things.

No it doesn't, he's shit... Probably because he's from London.

 

[Saul Goodman]

His company paid the fine. He designed something that could not be built for anything like the price quoted. That is poor design. Quite possibly true for the routemaster too. Looking great is worthless if it can’t be built.

How shit a designer do you have to be to design multiple things that either can't be built or fall to pieces once built.