Coronavirus in the UK - news, lockdown and discussion
- Thread starter Sasaferrato
- Start date
weltweit
Well-Known Member
It struck me immediately when he said " a few hours" that he was stupidly over promising. I don't know why he does it, it is a simple enough concept to grasp, always better to under promise and over deliver .. than the other way around. In business it is called "managing expectations" .. applies to politics the same.
beesonthewhatnow
going deaf for a living
Because the 1st is when the new school year starts. We’d had a gradual unlock and got the rate down. People had been given a bit of a breather over summer, a chance to get outside/away etc. So, once we’d had that breather we should have locked down again to keep it that way. As for 2 months, that would have got us to November and a chance to then look to December and an opportunity to see if a Xmas relaxation was doable, with enough notice for everyone if it wasn’t.
Cid
Proper break this time
Yep... even South Korea, which probably used it best in the early pandemic, is currently seeing an essentially uncontrolled rise in cases. Hopefully they sort their shit out and bring in some more comprehensive population level measures, I’m not up to date at the moment... but yeah, it does illustrate the limits in such a heavily urbanised society.
planetgeli
There's no future in England's dreaming
Things are out of control, action wasn't taken quickly enough in a desperate attempt to keep the schools open. In my area a headmistress was threatened with disciplinary action for closing her school - 24 hours before the person who threatened them closed all the schools.
Carmarthenshire
Find out more about the restrictions in your area
742
cases per 100,000 people in the latest week 11 Dec-17 Dec. The average area in Wales had 644.
1,400
cases in the latest week 11 Dec-17 Dec
+457
compared with the previous week
6,269
total cases to 21 Dec
135
coronavirus-related deaths registered to 4 Dec
How the case rate has changed in your area
- Daily cases per 100,000 people
- Seven-day average
Data for the most recent days may be revised upwards as new test results are received
That's my area. We are as rural as rural can be. During lockdown 1 we were affected very little. Now we're up to almost 800/100,000.
I suppose my point was, but not clearly expressed, why did TTI not pick up the changes sooner (because like many other things this shambles of a govt has attempted it is woeful), and surely at the end of this peak we still need a system that is far better than anything to date - I get we do not need it now when the virus horse has bolted...
What do you think the impact of that would've been on children and young people and their parents working from home?
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
Which would, roughly, be the date schools and FE colleges went back and about 3 weeks short of the date when students were told to
chilango
Hypothetical Wanker
Primary Schools should have, and should continue to, open to all who want to use them.
Ditto Years 7 and 8.
Years 9 to 13 should primarily be online,vwirh a very limited and strictly controlled program of face to face intervention.
University should be remote or postponed a year.
All non-essential (or not providing a social benefit) work should be stopped with a UBI brought in.
All debt should be frozen (or cancelled). No rent due. No mortgage payments due. Eviction to be prohibited.
Johnson et al. offered a choice between The New Hague (in Grytviken) or a glass of whiskey - cheap blended piss only) and a bullet
Ditto Years 7 and 8.
Years 9 to 13 should primarily be online,vwirh a very limited and strictly controlled program of face to face intervention.
University should be remote or postponed a year.
All non-essential (or not providing a social benefit) work should be stopped with a UBI brought in.
All debt should be frozen (or cancelled). No rent due. No mortgage payments due. Eviction to be prohibited.
Johnson et al. offered a choice between The New Hague (in Grytviken) or a glass of whiskey - cheap blended piss only) and a bullet
beesonthewhatnow
going deaf for a living
I think it would have been better than more people needlessly dying, and better than this endless cycle of confusing tiers and last minute changes.
This. And all bloody exams cancelled.
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
But, rather crucially, have added that the ultimate decisions on this (sovereignty ?) rest with member states.
Even the top brains of the country, Indie Sage, don't want schools closed. The impact for many children is too dire. You would be piling even more misery on the poor and vulnerable who have already lost the most in this time of covid.
beesonthewhatnow
going deaf for a living
So, see you all here this time again next year.
redsquirrel
This Machine Kills Progressives
It's all coulda, woulda, shoulda, but I think the real mistake was not getting the level low enough at the end of the first lockdown.
If the rate had been dropped to the point where test and trace could work then coupled with strict migration controls having schools, and even unis, would pose a limited risk
If the rate had been dropped to the point where test and trace could work then coupled with strict migration controls having schools, and even unis, would pose a limited risk
Thora
Differently Ethical
I do think we’ve got to the point now where everything, including schools & nurseries, need to close for a hard lockdown for a couple of weeks or a month.
And then probably a blended learning system at least for secondary schools to allow for social distancing measures.
And then probably a blended learning system at least for secondary schools to allow for social distancing measures.
redsquirrel
This Machine Kills Progressives
I really hope that is what does happen but I'm not sure I trust either the government or heads/VCs/bosses to do the sensible thing
bimble
floofy
This is Johnson's defining feature though, always overpromise, every time at every opportunity. Some of it will be baseless optimism to do with the congenital over-confidence of that sort of man but I think mostly its just down to the overwhelming desire to say whatever it is that people want to hear at any given moment.
weltweit
Well-Known Member
I don't think a couple of weeks is going to dent it. I think with the current level of cases we have, around the country, and the new variant, a national lockdown for two months is needed. That way the numbers of cases when we emerge should be a lot lower than at present and it might buy us some time before the next time.
I don't know if Johnson has the guts to implement such a measure.
weltweit
Well-Known Member
I agree, someone should have a word with him!
Not really. We might need a month of hard lockdown now but if everything else was tightened, schools could stay open with lots of the measures Indie Sage have suggested including using test and trace to stay on top of outbreaks.
It's simply not good enough to say that millions of children should suffer more social deprivation. There are ways to.mitigate risk and have far fewer cases plus open schools.
souljacker
innit
To be fair, what we've got is what we need though. Brits have no need to go to France at the moment unless they are truckers.
lazythursday
Well-Known Member
Quite clearly Tier 3 measures keep the virus fairly stable with schools open. Or they did do, with the 'classic' version of Covid. But if NERVTAG etc are right about the levels of transmissability of this new virus it will surely be impossible to keep schools fully open. Maybe some kind of part time, blended learning. It all depends on this new variant.
Thora
Differently Ethical
Yes, we do need to get cases down to a level where you can effectively test & trace and we definitely need a better plan for reducing transmission in schools that just "remove the sand pit and crack open a window", but schools should be a priority.
It's just clear you can't have pubs, restaurants, holidays, swimming pools, gyms, cinemas, offices AND schools open.
elbows
Well-Known Member
The official SAGE advice was for other restrictions to be brought in well before schools reopened, in order to create room in the infection picture, minimising community infection levels so that schools stood a better chance of operating during the pandemic.
If school openings are a priority then other stuff has to be done to compensate. The government tried to do it without that and its blown up in their face.
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