Coronavirus in the UK - news, lockdown and discussion

[elbows]

Meanwhile the UK government changed its lateral flow advice on the 17th November but the BBC (and probably others) only just noticed, presumably because the government didnt advertise the change much.

Guidance updated to reflect the move from recommending twice-weekly lateral flow testing to a risk-based approach.

You may wish to take a rapid lateral flow test if it is expected that there will be a period of high risk that day. This includes spending time in crowded and enclosed spaces, or before visiting people who are at higher risk of severe illness if they get COVID-19.

Living safely with respiratory infections, including COVID-19

Guidance for living safely with respiratory infections, including coronavirus (COVID-19).

www.gov.uk

8:55 entry on BBC live updates page:

The updated guidance on Covid testing suggests people may want to test themselves before going to crowded and enclosed spaces or visiting people at higher risk of severe illness from Covid-19.

Previous guidance urged people to take rapid tests twice a week or before visiting the medically vulnerable.

Although the latest advice does not mention specific examples, it comes in the run-up to Christmas when people may be picking up presents from busy shopping areas.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-59384577

 

[elbows]

Also from that BBC updates page, latest ONS death figures:

The figures show that almost 1,200 deaths involving Covid-19 were recorded across the UK in the week ending 12 November.

In this period there were 13,780 deaths registered in total in the UK, which was 17% above the five-year average. A total of 1,197 involved Covid-19, up by three on the previous week.

The ONS data also shows there have been a total of 169,767 deaths in the UK where Covid-19 was mentioned on the death certificate.

 

[Brainaddict]

My (vaccinated) housemate has some coldy symptoms so she rang 111 today and they told her she is unlikely to have covid because she doesn't have a cough. I fucking despair. How can people even have a chance of trying to control the spread of the virus if the government gives scientifically incorrect advice?

 

[Brainaddict]

At my prompting my housemate is getting a PCR test but an accumulation of bad information going to people, some of it spread by the government and the NHS, must be part of the picture of why covid has stayed at such elevated levels - along with dropping masks unnecessarily and all the other fuck-ups.

 

[gentlegreen]

I know there are people on here who I trust more than government agencies, but this is how I answered a recent survey.
The clumsy communication for me started with the "masks not recommended" bullshit in the first weeks and went downhill from there.
The more recent"get vaccinated and no need for masks" thing on both sides of the Atlantic was criminally negligent in my opinion.

 

[elbows]

At my prompting my housemate is getting a PCR test but an accumulation of bad information going to people, some of it spread by the government and the NHS, must be part of the picture of why covid has stayed at such elevated levels - along with dropping masks unnecessarily and all the other fuck-ups.

They are relying in great part on lateral flow tests to fill in a big chunk of the gap thats exposed by having a very limited set of symptoms that quality for PCR testing. Well that and the number of people who ignore the narrow nature of symptoms and get a PCR test anyway.

They actually wanted elevated levels of infection in some ways, at least pre winter, as part of their second attempt at building population immunity via infection. But we've now reached the stage where even those with that shit agenda are going to get nervous if the rates remain elevated or increase in the coming weeks and months.

 

[8ball]

I know there are people on here who I trust more than government agencies, but this is how I answered a recent survey.
The clumsy communication for me started with the "masks not recommended" bullshit in the first weeks and went downhill from there.
The more recent"get vaccinated and no need for masks" thing on both sides of the Atlantic was criminally negligent in my opinion.

View attachment 297890

That really needs Facebook, YouTube, TikTok and a few other options to give a fuller picture.

 

[Brainaddict]

They are relying in great part on lateral flow tests to fill in a big chunk of the gap thats exposed by having a very limited set of symptoms that quality for PCR testing. Well that and the number of people who ignore the narrow nature of symptoms and get a PCR test anyway.

But that is using lateral flow tests in a way that does not accord with what scientists said they could be used for, i.e. for people without covid symptoms. By refusing to change the symptoms that qualify you for PCR testing they are forcing people (unknowingly often - which is even more unethical) into using LFTs when they have covid symptoms as outlined in recent research. And of course people with covid symptoms are also not isolating because they are specifically told not to unless they have what is now a low-ranked symptom (a cough) if vaccinated. I know you know this but the unethical nature of it all sometimes just overwhelms me.

 

[_Russ_]

My (vaccinated) housemate has some coldy symptoms so she rang 111 today and they told her she is unlikely to have covid because she doesn't have a cough. I fucking despair. How can people even have a chance of trying to control the spread of the virus if the government gives scientifically incorrect advice?

Last week I had an NHS nurse tell me that it made no difference if I wore a valved or unvalved mask as long as it was an FFP2 type, when I mentioned that masks were actually supposed to be more effective at protecting others than the wearer and having an exhaust valve on the front would probably not be a good idea in that respect she just gave me an arsey look and fucked off.

 

[8ball]

Last week I had an NHS nurse tell me that it made no difference if I wore a valved or unvalved mask as long as it was an FFP2 type, when I mentioned that masks were actually supposed to be more effective at protecting others than the wearer and having an exhaust valve on the front would probably not be a good idea in that respect she just gave me an arsey look and fucked off.

A bit of old rag was fine a year ago, now it's FFP2.
They know about upselling, these guys.

 

[8ball]

I did not know this, but they have specially designed face masks for singers.

 

[_Russ_]

A bit of old rag was fine a year ago, now it's FFP2.
They know about upselling, these guys.

Umm, I think you missed the point there (seems to be a theme in here)

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

Currently working on an event in the medical school at work. Every single person in the building is wearing a mask. Think that says something.

 

[8ball]

Currently working on an event in the medical school at work. Every single person in the building is wearing a mask. Think that says something.

I'd have thought they'd be compulsory in a medical school. The students will be going on ward rounds etc. near vulnerable patients.
I gather there are some livestreaming experiments going on, but I doubt it's a substitute.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

I'd have thought they'd be compulsory in a medical school. The students will be going on ward rounds etc. near vulnerable patients.

This is a social event though.

 

[8ball]

This is a social event though.

Ah, fair enough. Still, I expect there has been some guidance issued rather than it all being spontaneous.
I mean, look at these cases of anti-vaxxers etc. among NHS staff...

 

[existentialist]

Currently working on an event in the medical school at work. Every single person in the building is wearing a mask. Think that says something.

Meanwhile, the barefaced (in both senses of the word) cunt (in most senses of the word) Johnson was seen in a theatre without a mask covering his face, despite clear requests from the theatre for all their patrons to wear one.

It's not just that he's an entitled cunt - it's that he seems utterly uncaring - or oblivious as to the mixed messages these behaviours send.

 

[editor]

Nick Triggle alert. I can spot his articles before even checking who wrote them.

Covid: Can UK avoid a Europe-style return to lockdown?

Good vaccine uptake and natural immunity, coupled with public caution, has put UK in a strong position.

www.bbc.co.uk

I found this interesting:

 

[teqniq]

Meanwhile, the barefaced (in both senses of the word) cunt (in most senses of the word) Johnson was seen in a theatre without a mask covering his face, despite clear requests from the theatre for all their patrons to wear one.

It's not just that he's an entitled cunt - it's that he seems utterly uncaring - or oblivious as to the mixed messages these behaviours send.

Yup, here he is:

 

[StoneRoad]

Yup, here he is:

Not to mention the rudeness of talking during a performance.

[unless he was "translating" for someone - but I doubt the person shown would be doing something so caring]

 

[elbows]

I found this interesting:

It is interesting but I find it very painful, because it was v2 of herd immunity and involved many many millions of infections here since June 1st. I do accept that in theory there are reasons to expect that has changed the future picture here, but even that article points out:

But Dr Chapman also points out this has come at a price - the high rates of infection have resulted in a greater amount of serious illness and death in recent months than many of our Western European neighbours.

And he adds the research should not be seen as a guarantee we will escape the winter without seeing a surge in cases. "We may be in the strongest position - but we could still see cases double and that would cause problems."

This bit is also of note:

But immunity alone does not explain why the UK, and in particular England, has seen such stable rates, says Prof Graham Medley, who chairs the government's infectious disease modelling group.

Prof Medley, speaking in a personal capacity, believes it is more complex than that. "I think we are seeing the public playing an important role."

He says a combination of limiting mixing and frequent use of rapid tests, which are more easy to access here than in many other countries, seems to be doing just enough to keep the virus in check.

"The government has passed the risk management to the public - and we've been able to do that better than other countries."

I dont like that 'keeping the virus in check' has meant living with absurdly high levels of infection, and that the 'in check' bit only means new daily cases didnt keep doubling in number.

And I'm still wary about what is in store. It wont surprise me if case numbers dont spiral to new highs, but it wont surprise me if they do either. And its not been many weeks since certain experts proclaimed that the previous peak in this wave would be the last one of 2021. Maybe, maybe not, I dont mind people suggesting these possibilities but I dont like the degree of confidence some approach such matters with.

 

[cupid_stunt]

New Covid variant: Javid says UK must act quickly over public health risk

The health secretary says southern African travel restrictions were imposed due to a "substantial risk" to health.

www.bbc.co.uk

The UK cannot take a risk over a new coronavirus variant identified in South Africa which may be able to evade the protection of vaccines, the transport secretary has said.

Grant Shapps told the BBC the UK "acted immediately" with a "safety first" approach by placing six countries on its red list to restrict travel.

Susan Hopkins, the UK Health Security Agency's chief medical adviser, said it was the "most worrying" variant yet.

Bastard fucking virus.

 

[gentlegreen]

I wish they would stop playing the "variant" game - it plays right into the hands of the antivaxers.

 

[gentlegreen]

Meanwhile, perhaps following the antics of our dear leader, mask-wearing was down to maybe 10 percent in Aldi yesterday

 

[William of Walworth]

I wish they would stop playing the "variant" game - it plays right into the hands of the antivaxers.

I don't think I'm understanding this -- can you explain further?

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

I don't think I'm understanding this -- can you explain further?

“There’s no point getting the vax as they’ll just be another variant along next week”

 

[gentlegreen]

“There’s no point getting the vax as they’ll just be another variant along next week”

Indeed - it's already all over the sewer that is Paltalk ...

My suggestion is to continue doing what we already know to do, and maybe choose a good information source.
Personally I settled on Victor Racaniello at Columbia - and his colleagues - who deserve the clicks for their efforts.

 

[elbows]

I wish they would stop playing the "variant" game - it plays right into the hands of the antivaxers.

Just because there can be awkward implications on that front in terms of people using it to form crap propaganda or to foster defeatist thoughts, doesnt mean we should try and look the other way when it comes to variants. Some variants that got some attention did not become dominant, but some did, and shaped the nature and timing of subsequent giant waves here that affected our lives. Thats not 'the variant game' its a really important part of the picture. Yes there are some aspects of variant news that fits into traditional tabloid hype, but that isnt a reason to downplay stuff as then it would be easy to make the opposite mistake.

On paper there are some aspects of this latest variant that are incredibly newsworthy. It will take time to find out what the ultimate reality of that is, the consequences wont necessarily be the worst case ones, but in the meantime there is no prospect of suffocating these news angles, and I take this new variant very seriously.

I could just as easily moan about the 'antivaxer' game where people seem to want to make the unvaccinated and antivaxxers a bigger part of the pandemic story in the UK these days than they actually are. Disgusting global vaccine inequality issues are a huge deal that only a few people bother to rant about here, and that shit has led to huge numbers of unprotected people in some countries. Well worth talking about. The other stuff involving antivax shitheads etc is still newsworthy and I'm not surprised people want to talk about it, but it gets more than its fair share of attention and an unfairly prominent role in the current framing. In reality people who havent had the vaccine dont seem to be making up the majority of UK covid deaths these days, so thats why I say those angles are receiving more than their fair share of attention, at the expense of other stuff.

 

[elbows]

Plus when people go on about the anti-vax and the unvaccinated its often all so white focussed. White people, who as an overall group have impressive levels of vaccination in the UK, and less historical reasons for vaccine hesitancy and mistrust of medical authorities, going on about white anti-vax propagandists and idiots, white business idiots taking a stand against covid rules, reported on by the white press in a manner designed to take advantage of white unease and white value judgements.

Please forgive me for describing that in such a crude manner. I could easily replace all the references to ethnicity in the above with ones about age or class, to make much the same point about how narrow and stale our angles tend to become. And of course I am white and of a certain age and relatively privileged in a bunch of ways, which does rather limit my own potential to avoid the narrowness of gaze I have been describing, or to dare to speak with authority about stuff which is not often part of my daily reality.

 

[elbows]

I'm probably ranting about this because as I've said plenty of times, I've not been impressed in 2021 with how much pandemic weight vaccines alone have been asked to carry. And that goes not just for things like not bothering with other non-vaccine measures, it also has a huge impact on which narratives come to dominate. And its clearly one of the big angles with variants too, the giant concern about variants with potential to escape vaccine-induced immunity. Well if that happens then the authorities invited it by asking vaccines to do all the hard work, and we've sponsored that too if we've allow our discussions and priorities to congeal around that topic at the expense of the other stuff. The desire to get back to normality is understandable and I dont really want to have a go at people about it. But if I take a step back I'm not really convinced that I could honestly claim that anti-vax idiots have done more harm than, for example, people who wanted to be given a free pass to think they could go back to the pub without consequences.

But thats not entirely balanced or fair either, I should take more steps back, and then end up in territory where we can ponder inequality and being left unprotected via phrases like 'work from home if you can'.

Anyway, back to this new variant. I suppose its noteworthy for the sheer number of mutations it has - its like a greatest (s)hits medley. So I dont think I can ignore it or treat it like all the others we've heard about that didnt amount to much. But only time will rally tell. I suppose if it does come to dominate then if I were looking for reasons to be cheerful I'd have to stretch a lot. I suppose I could say that it might get us much closer to the final pandemic end game, if its used up so many of the 'tricks its got left up its sleeve' in one go.

Not that I would pay too much attention to what I say about variants, they arent really one of the areas I've been able to offer much insight into in this pandemic so far.