Brockwell Park news, festival updates and more...

[Tulster218]

Lambeth has less woodland than almost anywhere else in the country, and yet between 2019 and 2021 they cut down more trees than they planted.

In 2019 Lambeth had 2.58% of woodland cover (69.1 hectares). Southwark has about twice that. Wandsworth even more.

Lambeth ranks 370th out of 380 local authorities in the UK in terms of tree coverage.

It seems to me that the Parks Department is out of control. They find any excuse to cut down the trees, but it's not just about these trees, it's that this is another symptom of an ongoing problem.

 

[Rushy]

I've noticed small concentrations of new trees being planted in areas of existing cover. For instance Rush Common and the gardens around Herne Hill House - often under the canopies of existing trees. Much less so in treeless areas like Acre Lane ward (I think a councillor in that ward told me it was of the most barren areas of Lambeth?). Trees under trees presumably won't add much to tree coverage stats?

 

[Tulster218]

I've noticed small concentrations of new trees being planted in areas of existing cover. For instance Rush Common and the gardens around Herne Hill House - often under the canopies of existing trees. Much less so in treeless areas like Acre Lane ward (I think a councillor in that ward told me it was of the most barren areas of Lambeth?). Trees under trees presumably won't add much to tree coverage stats?

Maybe not, but I think it's a more useful statistic than the 'number of trees', which exagerates the importance of young saplings.

 

[alex_]

Maybe not, but I think it's a more useful statistic than the 'number of trees', which exagerates the importance of young saplings.

Your whole point here seems to be that trees never need cutting down, which is obviously false.

Either that or there is no amount of new tree planting lambeth could do which would make you happy.

If Lambeth are planting significantly more trees than they are cutting down, isn’t that enough ?

Alex

 

[freshapple]

Your whole point here seems to be that trees never need cutting down, which is obviously false.

Either that or there is no amount of new tree planting lambeth could do which would make you happy.

If Lambeth are planting significantly more trees than they are cutting down, isn’t that enough ?

Alex

Yes

 

[freshapple]

There is a tree policy

https://www.lambeth.gov.uk/sites/default/files/2021-05/lpl-trees-policy-accessible.pdf

 

[alex_]

There is a tree policy

https://www.lambeth.gov.uk/sites/default/files/2021-05/lpl-trees-policy-accessible.pdf

Which says they have no budget for tree planting, and they are still planting more trees than they are cutting down.

Alex

 

[Tulster218]

Your whole point here seems to be that trees never need cutting down, which is obviously false.

Either that or there is no amount of new tree planting lambeth could do which would make you happy.

If Lambeth are planting significantly more trees than they are cutting down, isn’t that enough ?

Alex

I'm sure there is a point at which we'd have too many trees, and I'd be asking for them to stop, but we're nowhere near that point yet.

Lambeth seem to see tree planting, only as a money making opportunity (£430 to plant a tree! - pull the other one). At the moment we need to strongly make the case for more trees. Now isn't the time for nuance, that can come later.

 

[alex_]

I'm sure there is a point at which we'd have too many trees, and I'd be asking for them to stop, but we're nowhere near that point yet.

Lambeth seem to see tree planting, only as a money making opportunity (£430 to plant a tree! - pull the other one). At the moment we need to strongly make the case for more trees. Now isn't the time for nuance, that can come later.

This charity says 600 quid for one in Lewisham - Plant Trees: I'm a Lewisham Resident | Street Trees for Living.

“The total planting cost (contractor and tree costs) for planting each tree is approximately £600”

I’m not sure how much you think this should cost, if you think Lambeth are making money - but perhaps you know more about this than the urban tree planting charity.

 

[Tulster218]

This charity says 600 quid for one in Lewisham - Plant Trees: I'm a Lewisham Resident | Street Trees for Living.

“The total planting cost (contractor and tree costs) for planting each tree is approximately £600”

I’m not sure how much you think this should cost, if you think Lambeth are making money - but perhaps you know more about this than the urban tree planting charity.

And another charity here says £5. https://www.worldlandtrust.org/appeals/plant-a-tree/

It doesn't cost hundreds of pounds to plant a tree. I can see why people might want to pretend that it does, but we don't have to believe them. You just have to use a little bit of common sense.

 

[BusLanes]

Suspect if trees are being planted by the doze or hundreds it is a fair bit cheaper than hiring a contractor with men and truck to go put in a couple

 

[alex_]

And another charity here says £5. https://www.worldlandtrust.org/appeals/plant-a-tree/

It doesn't cost hundreds of pounds to plant a tree. I can see why people might want to pretend that it does, but we don't have to believe them. You just have to use a little bit of common sense.

I wonder why it might cost more to do this task in London using contractors than in Borneo using volunteers ?

Alex

 

[Tulster218]

I wonder why it might cost more to do this task in London using contractors than in Borneo using volunteers ?

Alex

For the cost of one tree you could fly them over here and ask them.

 

[edcraw]

Which says they have no budget for tree planting, and they are still planting more trees than they are cutting down.

Alex

Think that’s out of date. They’re currently planting go 5,000 trees over 5 years.

Tree Planting

The tree planting programme is a scheme to increase the number of trees within the borough

www.lambeth.gov.uk

 

[edcraw]

The parks looking great this morning - personally think it’s being managed the best it has for a long time.

 

[Torpid Scorpion]

I note that the ‘save the trees’ whatsapp has turned into the ‘ban the festivals’ whatsapp.

Where are the festivals supposed to go?

Why is nimbyism the defining feature of english politics?

 

[Tulster218]

Where are the festivals supposed to go?

Getting drunk and listening to loud music isn't something the council has to encourage.

 

[jimbarkanoodle]

I note that the ‘save the trees’ whatsapp has turned into the ‘ban the festivals’ whatsapp.

Where are the festivals supposed to go?

Why is nimbyism the defining feature of english politics?

The festivals were always the at the crux of the extreme NIMBYism, the cutting down of diseased trees (which Friends of Brockwell Park have inspected have broadly agreed with) presented an ideal opportunity for them to bombard social media with environmental vandalism messages to gain more support for their cause. Festivals upsetting nesting birds etc. Its a new angle they have used this year, 2024's version of 'revellers come to urinate and defecate all over my front door on a regular basis' which seems to have gone out of fashion, for now.

 

[Table Wolf]

Picked up in The Guardian:

Britain’s public parks are a green lifeline – stop fencing them off for the summer | Rebecca Tamás

These spaces are crucial for our wellbeing, but cash-strapped councils are being forced to treat them as revenue earners, says poet Rebecca Tamás

www.theguardian.com

Personally - as a near-to-the-park resident - I have been relaxed about the festivals previously, but am feeling quite grumpy about them this year. Perhaps because we had such a miserable early spring. We had that one lovely weekend on the 11th-12th, and then wham, the fences went up. They seem to be covering a bigger area than ever, too. It feels quite claustrophobic going through a lot of the park.

 

[felonius monk]

Picked up in The Guardian:

Britain’s public parks are a green lifeline – stop fencing them off for the summer | Rebecca Tamás

These spaces are crucial for our wellbeing, but cash-strapped councils are being forced to treat them as revenue earners, says poet Rebecca Tamás

www.theguardian.com

Personally - as a near-to-the-park resident - I have been relaxed about the festivals previously, but am feeling quite grumpy about them this year. Perhaps because we had such a miserable early spring. We had that one lovely weekend on the 11th-12th, and then wham, the fences went up. They seem to be covering a bigger area than ever, too. It feels quite claustrophobic going through a lot of the park.

I walk round the park pretty much every day and the fencing seems to be about the same area as last year. It's a big area on the HH side but there's a lot of the rest of the park untouched.

 

[Jimbeau]

I walk round the park pretty much every day and the fencing seems to be about the same area as last year. It's a big area on the HH side but there's a lot of the rest of the park untouched.

Yes - it’s slightly less than one third of the park that’s inside the fence. The Red Line for Brockwell Park events was set in 2021 and remains the same this year. Perhaps the building works at the Hall make
It feel larger when approached from some directions?

I find that Guardian article slightly misleading. All the facilities remain open as usual, but it implies otherwise. I live on the Tulse Hill side of the park, which continues just as usual.

I quite like the energy the festivals bring and don’t even mind the noise (which is LOUD at our place). Still never been able to secure a residents’ ticket though…

 

[jimbarkanoodle]

Yes - it’s slightly less than one third of the park that’s inside the fence. The Red Line for Brockwell Park events was set in 2021 and remains the same this year. Perhaps the building works at the Hall make
It feel larger when approached from some directions?

I find that Guardian article slightly misleading. All the facilities remain open as usual, but it implies otherwise. I live on the Tulse Hill side of the park, which continues just as usual.

I quite like the energy the festivals bring and don’t even mind the noise (which is LOUD at our place). Still never been able to secure a residents’ ticket though…

I have noticed in the article and on social media the anti festival brigade are not shy to state misleading claims about the events, whereas those in favour or ambivalent generally stick to the facts or are at least more reasonable in their assessments/debates.

 

[wemakeyousoundb]

I found while walking my dogs that the area was less accessible this year while the build is going on then in previous years, but that could just be me misremembering.
the facilties/toilets have issues with the hall toilets being closed and the ones up from brixton water lane having been closed for a while due to "low water pressure" leaving only the ones near the quiet garden and inside the lido cafe/400 rabbits pizzeria available for now.

 

[edcraw]

Seems a lot quieter on the Tulse Hill side so far this year.

 

[BusLanes]

Seems a lot quieter on the Tulse Hill side so far this year.

Yup

 

[Beeme]

The weekend and Bank Holiday were noisy hell here up the Herne Hill. And the park is fucked.

 

[lazythursday]

Your whole point here seems to be that trees never need cutting down, which is obviously false.

Either that or there is no amount of new tree planting lambeth could do which would make you happy.

If Lambeth are planting significantly more trees than they are cutting down, isn’t that enough ?

Alex

This isn't enough, because mature trees are hugely more valuable in terms of their ecological function than saplings (many of which won't make it through to adulthood). Of course sometimes trees need cutting down, but it should be a last resort not something done as a matter of course.

 

[jimbarkanoodle]

The weekend and Bank Holiday were noisy hell here up the Herne Hill. And the park is fucked.

Noisy hell? Was was hellish about some noise in a major urban conurbation on a weekend and bank holiday?

 

[ViolentPanda]

Most of the trees I’ve seen look obviously in a bad way and the council is planting tons of new trees all around the park.

My reading of the law is if trees are posing a danger to people, which most of these seem to, then they can still be removed with nesting birds in them. Not great but neither is a tree falling on people.

Can’t see the need for a petition tbh.

While many new trees get planted, often they don't get cared for properly, so die-off is a problem.

 

[ViolentPanda]

I very rarely use Twitter, but when I responded with a few truths to the Brockwell Park person a few years back, they promptly blocked me. He/she likes to spout off on Twitter but doesn't like it back at them. This Rob chap sounds like he'd be agreeable in the pub though.

Incidentally, about 20 years ago at school, a kid in the lower years was out playing in Richmond park with his family one weekend. A diseased tree branch fell on him and he was crushed to death . So these idiots trying to spin a legitimate tree cull for public safety to suit a different agenda I have complete contempt for.

Here's the thing though - Lambeth Council don't monitor their trees (either in parks or elsewhere) very well, so there's a public safety issue throughout the borough regarding unsafe trees. The big cedar on Tulse Hill only getting inspected - and felled - after it had shed branches onto the road being the most local example to me. Lambeth are big on "too little, too late". Just on my estate alone we have four trees undermining homes, but will Lambeth authorise root-pruning? Will they fuck!

It's also not the best time of year to work on trees, as I'm sure "Lambeth Landscapes" are aware. Doing so taking commercial matters into consideration, is pretty pathetic.

BTW, branch-fall casualties are more common than people think. Kew Gardens put out an advisory about 10 yrs ago, after a death there (female tourist). They attributed the increased frequency to changing weather patterns, & increasing cycles of heavy sunshine combined with very heavy rainfall. Apparently this "shocks" some trees into shedding their larger branches, so it's not only disease that's a problem.