liquidindian
Hello
Yeah but it's not AI though. AI is better, I've seen it in the films.
Brixton Liveable Neighbourhood and LTN schemes - improvements for pedestrians and cyclists
- Thread starter teuchter
- Start date
Yes, the AI bit was my favourite bit.
liquidindian
Hello
I always like it being mentioned because if it's in a sans serif font I can pretend it's talking about me. You can do the same, actually.
teuchter
je suis teuchter
Presumably there is portion of people who start off being anti LTN but do sort of agree that traffic needs to be reduced (ideally by other people doing stuff). And in being actively anti something specific, instead of passively pro the status quo, they start thinking hard about ways to achieve the end aim without using things like LTNs. And they spend some time coming up with various ideas and reading about alternatives. And if they are serious they come to see the reasons those alternatives either wouldn't work or would be even more controversial to implement. And eventually they come round in a big circle to realise that things like LTNs are the best options we currently have. Which is essentially the process that most of us who are boring enough to have been thinking about these kinds of transport issues for years, went through some time ago.
teuchter
je suis teuchter
The above post is not particularly intended to be snarky by the way, I think that in some ways all the aggro kicked up recently has got a bunch of people talking about things that not that long ago were kind of seen as fringe interests. And surely it must have prompted some previously uninterested people to take an interest and become active on both sides.
It's interesting to me that quite a lot of the protest has centred around the idea that pollution is displaced to main roads. Because once you've set that up as your position (maybe disingenuously, maybe not) you are one step along the way to acknowledging that traffic is a problem. And not just a problem to drivers who are slowed down by it but something with external consequences for people that live near roads. I actually reckon that in many or most cases traffic on those main roads is not really worse than it has been already for years, but there are some people who have now been awoken into an awareness of it, and specifically an awareness of it as something that generates air pollution. Or slows down buses or ambulances - just like it always has!
In the long term there is maybe some positive to come out of all those people who have got really wound up by these recent implementations.
It's interesting to me that quite a lot of the protest has centred around the idea that pollution is displaced to main roads. Because once you've set that up as your position (maybe disingenuously, maybe not) you are one step along the way to acknowledging that traffic is a problem. And not just a problem to drivers who are slowed down by it but something with external consequences for people that live near roads. I actually reckon that in many or most cases traffic on those main roads is not really worse than it has been already for years, but there are some people who have now been awoken into an awareness of it, and specifically an awareness of it as something that generates air pollution. Or slows down buses or ambulances - just like it always has!
In the long term there is maybe some positive to come out of all those people who have got really wound up by these recent implementations.
Jeanette Moo
Active Member
I didn't find this snarky, I found it quite reasonable and well put.
This article has just come out - Britain’s new road rage: how traffic rules are tearing our neighbourhoods apart
I do think what it says is right. Its put back cycling a lot. The whole oompf the way LTNs have been done has now created an anti-anything army. FOr example Edcraws message above. I'm all for e-scooters. Get them out there, get people using them. I used them in a few countries and loved them.
The real negative, in my opinion, is ~some~ people in the anti groups and now anti-any-change. ULEZ. Escooters. Cycle lanes. You name it.
Always been a thing, constantly against any changes (cycle lanes, congestion charge, speed cameras, seat belts! etc.) it’s exhausting - and this is how OneLambeth come across with their Twitter account and chowce5382 ’s cheap cyclist bashing. I’m know reasonable people who against LTNs but OneLambeth isn’t representing them & they’ve refused to have any involvement.
If you wanted to teach how not to campaign for something they’d be the perfect example.
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And for one Lambeth - that is quite polite.
thebackrow
Considerably more Brixton.
Indeed, from that Telegraph piece -
"the schemes, he said, had been foisted on people with no discussion of alternatives. There are all sorts of solutions that could be considered; traffic crossings, calming measures, one-way street. But we’ve been told those solutions are very 20th century and have been proved not to work."
If you're going to have a coherent anti position you're either claiming there is/was no problem in the first place and or that you do care about traffic and pollution but just a want a different solution. Then it's either "we're not experts, it's not our job to provide alternative solutions" (leaving aside the current schemes have been designed by professionals based on experience from around the world) or come up with something yourself which is either going to be half arsed measures that have been tried and failed for decades (see above) or a boil the ocean 'build a tram network' or 'change the world of work'
I think we’ve all had enough of experts…
thebackrow
Considerably more Brixton.
I don't know - I've heard rumours theres a guy on the WhatsApp who knows everything
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Any news on Brixton hill ?
Not that I’ve heard. I guess they’ll wait until after the current ones are made permanent, if they.
It’s much needed imo. Dumbarton Rd & New Park Road are horrible rat runs.
Also thornbury
Is that where the Dumbarton traffic goes then?
No one seems to be calling to rip out the Crescent Lane filter. That really is an expensive area but people would be quite happy for Upper Tulse Hill to have constant rat running traffic all day again.
Yes, it’s east west On Dumbarton to thornbury, and north to south east on lyham Dumbarton.
The knobheads have said all traffic calming measures are up for grabs, I’m looking forward to driving through Liverpool Street station personally.
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Here’s a plumber talking about the massive savings he’s made from using a cargo bike.
The plumber challenging 'white van man' stereotypes
Plumber Martin Broer explains why he swapped his van for an electric cargo bike.
www.bbc.co.uk
cuppa tee
Well-Known Member
ulez ? Congestion charge ? Cycle lanes ? ParkinG controls ?
Fair point but they do much to reduce car journeys. Maybe congestion charge but that’s not expanding and been in pace for 20 years nearly.
The cost of driving has falling in real terms for years whilst rail and bus are have increased.
BigTom
Well-Known Member
Here’s a plumber talking about the massive savings he’s made from using a cargo bike.
The plumber challenging 'white van man' stereotypes
Plumber Martin Broer explains why he swapped his van for an electric cargo bike.www.bbc.co.uk
Coincidentally I'm spending today training people to use these:
It's part of a council scheme to let local businesses trial cargo bike without needing to fork out to buy one initially.
The reason the organisations in training today are really interested is because of how the local LTN has changed things, both making it harder for local deliveries by car/van and making it nicer for cycling.
Hopefully going to replace a bunch of local car/van journeys.
teuchter
je suis teuchter
Someone was telling me about this scheme in S London a few weeks ago.
www.lowline.london
Bikes for Business comes to the Low Line ← News ← The Low Line
www.lowline.london
Presumably you save a load of time and money finding/paying for parking.
You’ll never carry a new boiler - but most tradesmen carry all of their tools into the house in one go anyway.
editor
hiraethified
Typical comment here
www.brixtonbuzz.com
Crowdfunder launched to save Brixton Wholefoods
Located in Atlantic Road, Brixton Wholefoods has been serving the community since 1982, but is now asking for help to survive. A combination of rent increases and the impact of Covid have left the…
www.brixtonbuzz.com
BigTom
Well-Known Member
I've randomly chosen a boiler: Vaillant Boiler Specs
Valliant boiler which is a brand I know so I'm assuming this is reasonably representative.
Ecotec Plus 800 Series
weighs 36-43kg depending on the model.Those bikes have a weight load of 100kg and are a little less than a cubic metre in storage space. I'm not sure about the practicalities of actually loading it but you are easy on weight and I reckon clear on space to carry a boiler in there, probably along with the tools you'd need to fit it, although I don't know exactly what would be needed tbf.
edit: not really parking that is the issue as we're talking businesses delivering to local residential properties, it's more that you can access the roads whichever way you want on a bike and you can't do that anymore in a car or van. Monetary savings would come if you could completely replace a company car/van with one of these bikes as the cost of purchase, fuel and maintenance is so much lower than a vehicle.
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