Brazil v Germany (Semi Final) Tuesday 8th July 2014

[Johnny Canuck3]

I suppose none of these teams are true 'teams', in that they get together briefly before these multinational competitions and practice together a few times - so if Plan A doesn't work, they might not really have a Plan B.

 

[JTG]

Some more than others. International coaching is a different animal to club level for sure.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

It's not unique to the World Cup. The Canadian national hockey team at the Olympics is just a bunch of NHL stars who spend almost no time together as a team, given their contractual commitments. What makes them look like a team, is that each individual plays their game at such a high level, they can make it look as if they actually are a team.

 

[pocketscience]

For those joining the Germany love-in, spare a thought for the expats living here. My Mrs, offspring, mates, work colleagues, bus drivers, eveyrone... are having such an unbearable smugfest this morning that I'm fantasising about Holland beating them in the final with a 95th minute penalty from a Robben dive.

 

[girasol]

Not read the whole thread, but the German team is probably the only 'proper' team? 6 years playing together was what the Portuguese commentator said at the Portuguese restaurant we ended up at last night, watching the game in Portuguese from Portugal, which is hard to understand. It was odd.

Hey zora, I bet you are smiling today!

 

[JTG]

Not read the whole thread, but the German team is probably the only 'proper' team? 6 years playing together was what the Portuguese commentator said at the Portuguese restaurant we ended up at last night, watching the game in Portuguese from Portugal, which is hard to understand. It was odd.

Hey zora, I bet you are smiling today!

Certainly Jogi Loew being in charge for so long provides continuity.

 

[Badgers]

How many shots did Germany have in the game? 10 or so?

 

[JimW]

For those joining the Germany love-in, spare a thought for the expats living here. My Mrs, offspring, mates, work colleagues, bus drivers, eveyrone... are having such an unbearable smugfest this morning that I'm fantasising about Holland beating them in the final with a 95th minute penalty from a Robben dive.

But in fairness, surely smugness has never been more earned.

 

[JTG]

How many shots did Germany have in the game? 10 or so?

Sounds about right

 

[Lo Siento.]

I suppose none of these teams are true 'teams', in that they get together briefly before these multinational competitions and practice together a few times - so if Plan A doesn't work, they might not really have a Plan B.

A lot of the teams are. One of the reasons why Chile, Colombia, Mexico, Costa Rica etc. look like more than the sum of their parts is because their pool of footballers is relatively small, so it's more likely that they've played together for the national team on a fairly regular basis, from the youth teams upwards. Germany are probably closest to that out of the elite teams, and you could see that in the way they approached the France game as well as this one. Argentina and Holland are probably the next best I've seen in terms of being proper teams, even if both have quite limited plans.

 

[Badgers]

Sounds about right

Just looked....

Germany
49% possession
14 shots
12 shots
7 goals
0 offsides
0 bookings

Brazil had 18 shots and 13 on target

 

[Lo Siento.]

Not read the whole thread, but the German team is probably the only 'proper' team? 6 years playing together was what the Portuguese commentator said at the Portuguese restaurant we ended up at last night, watching the game in Portuguese from Portugal, which is hard to understand. It was odd.

I was thinking this too. Starting line-up for Germany last night had an average of 66 caps, average age of 27 and the last one to make his debut was Benedikt Höwedes in June 2011. Pretty much spot on for age/experience

 

[Lo Siento.]

Just looked....

Germany
49% possession
14 shots
12 shots
7 goals
0 offsides
0 bookings

Brazil had 18 shots and 13 on target

A lot of those 14 shots were absolute tap-ins though.

 

[Badgers]

A lot of those 14 shots were absolute tap-ins though.

You mean the 7 goals?

 

[Lo Siento.]

You mean the 7 goals?

Well, 5 of the goals were, 2 of them were half-chances (Schurrle's 2nd and one of Kroos'). I mean to say the high number of goals scored to shots is less about Germany being clinical and more about the quality of the opportunities they created (as opposed to Brazil's)

 

[JTG]

A lot of the teams are. One of the reasons why Chile, Colombia, Mexico, Costa Rica etc. look like more than the sum of their parts is because their pool of footballers is relatively small, so it's more likely that they've played together for the national team on a fairly regular basis, from the youth teams upwards. Germany are probably closest to that out of the elite teams, and you could see that in the way they approached the France game as well as this one. Argentina and Holland are probably the next best I've seen in terms of being proper teams, even if both have quite limited plans.

Not so sure about Mexico, but yeah.
Those countries with big money leagues importing loads of talent haven't done so well eh. England, Italy, Russia, Spain and on a lower level Turkey (didn't even qualify)... Not the whole answer obv and Germany imports footballers too but with far better youth systems and structures.
Someone post the relative numbers of qualified coaches again please.

 

[JTG]

Well, 5 of the goals were, 2 of them were half-chances (Schurrle's 2nd and one of Kroos'). I mean to say the high number of goals scored to shots is less about Germany being clinical and more about the quality of the opportunities they created (as opposed to Brazil's)

A couple of those were created by squaring the ball to a better placed team mate too when more selfish players would have had a shot

 

[friedaweed]

I'm with Hanson. Brazil were just plain poowar

Suicidal defending and playing that far up the pitch against the Germans. I think they'll do the Argies if they get through but I think we'll see a very cagey boring final if it's against the Nedders

 

[Greebo]

Just watched this on PVR. Mother. Fucker. How is it possible for a team to fall apart like that? It's like they forgot how to play. <snip>

The comment on R4's Today programme was that Brazil's team had been told to play "western style" instead of their usual "samba style". If that's true, the manager clearly never watched "Cool Runnings" (the Jamaican team only started to do well after they ignored what the apparently technically brilliant teams were doing and played to their own strengths).

 

[friedaweed]

A couple of those were created by squaring the ball to a better placed team mate too when more selfish players would have had a shot

Fazackerly. None of them were easy goals really the Germans just made them look easy.

Poor defending punished by quite a clinical pack of players who were playing like a well oiled machine.

 

[friedaweed]

The comment on R4's Today programme was that Brazil's team had been told to play "western style" instead of their usual "samba style". If that's true, the manager clearly never watched "Cool Runnings" (the Jamaican team only started to do well after they ignored what the apparently technically brilliant teams were doing and played to their own strengths).

Are ye dead mon?

 

[pocketscience]

But in fairness, surely smugness has never been more earned.

Without wanting to sound bitter here (* he writes while whistling the Dambusters themetune)...
In normal circumstances maybe but the Ghana and Algeria games showed that an organised & passionate team can seriously unsettle their very average defence (exception Neuer and Lahm)
Last night Brazil made them look a lot better than they are. I'd have loved to have seen Mexico, Chile and particularly Colombia have a go at them.
Btw, the same smugness was evident in the WC2010 & Euros2012 before Spain and Italy respectivly snuffed it out of them.

 

[JTG]

I'm with Hanson. Brazil were just plain poowar

Suicidal defending and playing that far up the pitch against the Germans. I think they'll do the Argies if they get through but I think we'll see a very cagey boring final if it's against the Nedders

Stop me if I'm being too technical, but Brazil fannied about with it more than once and Germany pressured them into losing possession in their own half. Germany knew exactly how to exploit Brazil's weaknesses

 

[Lo Siento.]

Not so sure about Mexico, but yeah.
Those countries with big money leagues importing loads of talent haven't done so well eh. England, Italy, Russia, Spain and on a lower level Turkey (didn't even qualify)... Not the whole answer obv and Germany imports footballers too but with far better youth systems and structures.
Someone post the relative numbers of qualified coaches again please.

Don't really buy into that coaches stat tbh. They always produce the comparative numbers for Germany and Spain, but never for Argentina or Brazil, let alone Chile, Colombia, Mexico and Costa Rica. England produces plenty of good enough players at youth levels, where we're getting it wrong is after that.

 

[Greebo]

Are ye dead mon?

*whoosh* bad night, relatively early morning - clarify?

 

[JTG]

The comment on R4's Today programme was that Brazil's team had been told to play "western style" instead of their usual "samba style". If that's true, the manager clearly never watched "Cool Runnings" (the Jamaican team only started to do well after they ignored what the apparently technically brilliant teams were doing and played to their own strengths).

Nah, Brazil haven't played like that since 1982, maybe 1986. They won a World Cup in 1994 being as European as anything

 

[Lo Siento.]

A couple of those were created by squaring the ball to a better placed team mate too when more selfish players would have had a shot

Yeah, they made good decisions in front of goal (although in contrast they managed to score twice from 29 shots against Algeria, and once from 13 against the USA, so not that clinical)

 

[Badgers]

Yeah, they made good decisions in front of goal (although in contrast they managed to score twice from 29 shots against Algeria, and once from 13 against the USA, so not that clinical)

Bunch of chancers

 

[JTG]

Don't really buy into that coaches stat tbh. They always produce the comparative numbers for Germany and Spain, but never for Argentina or Brazil, let alone Chile, Colombia, Mexico and Costa Rica. England produces plenty of good enough players at youth levels, where we're getting it wrong is after that.

Hmmm. I see a lot of 'good' players unable to trap or pass a ball well. Basic ball skills aren't valued or taught imho

 

[Greebo]

Nah, Brazil haven't played like that since 1982, maybe 1986. They won a World Cup in 1994 being as European as anything

I wasn't giving my assessment of their playing, but that of a football pundit heard first thing this morning (didn't catch his name).