BNP national demo in Keighley

[where to]

Do Muslims have an obsession with 'cleanliness'?

oh and yes, the muslim i am talking about, and he is only one, does have an obsession with cleanliness. sexual or otherwise.

he will only take a shit in his own house.

 

[Chuck Wilson]

Does he travel well?

 

[Oxpecker]

Does he travel well?

Does he travel far is a far more apposite question.

 

[where to]

Does he travel well?

tell ya, it sounded like a fucking weird excuse the first time, 'scuse me i've got to go home to take a shit.' and that was him an hour from his house.

 

[where to]

by the way i am not suggesting for one second that this person is inclined in this way (sexually). couldn't be further from the truth.

i think i've kind of derailed this thread a bit. apologies.

 

[hibee]

So hibee and Taxamo Wolf - do you think that there is firstly an ethnic dynamic to paedophilia, and secondly that there is a religious dynamic to paedophilia?

Where in the name of fuck did I imply that? Is that the best you can do, lie and smear?

I don't know the first thing about Keighley, I've never been there. All I asked you to do was back up your claim (or your cut and paste's claim) that reports of these gangs being asian was a "myth". Because I've read plenty claiming otherwise. If you can prove your assertions I'll accept your premise.

Obviously being a paedophile has nothing to do with race or religion and everything to do with being a cunt. But this case looks startlingly similar to the debate on here about Oldham a few weeks ago, where out of towner lefties swore blind in the face of contrary evidence from people who were on the ground that there were no such things as asian gangs carrying out race attacks against white people. For good measure they smeared an elderly man who was beaten up.

This victim mentality, this idea that only one community can be the agressors is a mirror image of what the BNP like to do. The left will have no credility with ordinary people if it carries on with this inability to tell the truth.

 

[butchersapron]

So hibee and Taxamo Wolf - do you think that there is firstly an ethnic dynamic to paedophilia, and secondly that there is a religious dynamic to paedophilia?

This sort of thing is why you're widely hated here - you're an utter embarassment.

 

[Herbert Read]

RW-you are wrong there is an underage sex problem in this area with british asian men and young white UK girls, its well documented. For once i am in total agreement with hibee. Your delusionalism knows no boundaries.

 

[Donna Ferentes]

This sort of thing is why you're widely hated here - you're an utter embarassment.

It's hard to see how this posting adds much to the debate or to its tone.

Let's have a look. RW refers [post #172] to: the racist myth that Asian Muslim paedophile gangs are preying on young people. TW then responds [post #173]: Do you have any proof its a myth love?

Now, apart from the inherent impossibility of proving a negative, given that TW has challenged RW on this very point it sees entirely in order to ask [post #176]whether TW is, in fact, claiming that there are Asian Muslim paedophile gangs preying on young peope. Is that the suggestion? Because I confess I don't understand TW's posting if it is not.

 

[butchersapron]

It's hard to see how this posting adds much to the debate or to its tone.

Let's have a look. RW refers [post #172] to: the racist myth that Asian Muslim paedophile gangs are preying on young people. TW then responds [post #173]: Do you have any proof its a myth love?

Now, apart from the inherent impossibility of proving a negative, given that TW has challenged RW on this very point it sees entirely in order to ask [post #176]whether TW is, in fact, claiming that there are Asian Muslim paedophile gangs preying on young peope. Is that the suggestion? Because I confess I don't understand TW's posting if it is not.

I fail to see how either your post or RW's suggestion that hibee and Tax believe that asian men, esp Muslims are more prone to be active paedophiles does that either. But it's not the original slur that you pick up on is it? No, it's the angry responses that it provokes. Once again you demonstrate that you only demand certain standards of those who you dislike and more importantly disagree with. That's commonly called hypocrisy - people would be far more inclined to take your constant complaints about this forum more seriously if you displayed more consistency in who/what you choose to pick up on.

Edit: in response to your edit: no, Tax asked if he had any prooft that specific crimes were not being committed in Keighly, not if RW had any proof dispelling the myth that asian men, esp Muslims are more prone to engage in active paedophilia. That's something entirely different. And it's a difference that i believe you and RW have chosen to ignore for your own dubious purposes.

 

[Donna Ferentes]

RW specifically referred to something as a myth,TW objected, RW asked whether TW thought it wasn't a myth. RW then gets slagged off and I don't see why. That was a specific point: I think it merits answring. This can't be done by refernce to other things in other places, which I'm afraid is how you tend to respond far too often: don't deal with the actual point, refer to something else and say "why aren't you asking about that instead?".

Well, I ain't going to do that: I'm going to ask my straightforward question about this particular point. The question stands and I don't see that you've answered it: TW specifically referred to the term that RW had specifically mentioned in the post above.

"Dubious purposes" is good though. Heh.

 

[butchersapron]

RW specifically referred to something as a myth,TW objected, RW asked whether TW thought it wasn't a myth. RW then gets slagged off and I don't see why. That was a specific point: I think it merits answring. This can't be done by refernce to other things in other places, which I'm afraid is how you tend to respond far too often: don't deal with the actual point, refer to something else and say "why aren't you asking about that instead?".

Well, I ain't going to do that: I'm going to ask my straightforward question about this particular point. The question stands and I don't see that you've answered it: TW specifically referred to the term that RW had specifically mentioned in the post above.

"Dubious purposes" is good though. Heh.

What's that 'something' though Donna? It's the claim that there are Paedophile gangs active in Keighly, not the idea that asian men, esp Muslims are more prone to active Paedophilia. And that's where you're going wrong by following RWs implication that the latter was what was being referred to rather than the former - you're both misreading, and i think deliberately so .

 

[Donna Ferentes]

Well, not really. I think RW could scarcely have avoided asking whether there was an "ethnic" or "religious" element involved since the suggestion is that the perpetrators were specifically Asian and Muslim. I think they're entitled to ask what exactly is being said here.

 

[butchersapron]

To answer the question (that was directed to RW btw and not the other way around), you might like to read some of Anne Cryer's recent comments, being the sitting MP and all. The fact is, and this does have some significant bearing on this, that Searchlight and UAF (who RW is a member of) recently split over this issue. In brief, UAF denied that there is any such activty going on and refused to work with Searchlight in aiming to target it. Searchlight believe that the issue is being ignored by the authorities and that it's driving many people into the arms of the far right as they're the only people who even make a pretence of caring about the issue.

Now, having nailed their colours to this mast for their own internal reasons, the UAF/SWP/RESPECT supporters and members have to flat out deny that any of the sort of stuff that Cryer, Searchlight and other residents are adamant is occouring exists. That's the crux of this. And no amount of suggesting that people who take up a dissenting view are racists, islamophobes or have a belief in asian muslims as genetivcally pre-disposed to paedophilia can change that.

 

[butchersapron]

Well, not really. I think RW could scarcely have avoided asking whether there was an "ethnic" or "religious" element involved since the suggestion is that the perpetrators were specifically Asian and Muslim. I think they're entitled to ask what exactly is being said here.

It's quite straightforward what he was being asked - you need only scroll a few posts upwards and you'll see it's as clear as day. Of course, what was really going on, and your faux-naivity about this does you no favours at all - was RW once again, going down the road of attempting to smear people who disagree with him as racists and muslim-haters, as being in sympathy with the ideas of the far-right etc

 

[Donna Ferentes]

Of course, a lot of people who put this stuff about (or believe it) are thoroughgoing racists and there are therefore very good reasons for asking for rather better evidence than is normally forthcoming.

I think we could do without crap like "faux-naivety". You have a very large and intellectually disabling inability to deal with differing points of view without accusing those who hold them of ulterior motives. It's what makes you such a charmless and aggressive debater.

 

[rednblack]

It's what makes you such a charmless and aggressive debater.

you accuse someone of being charmless! now that's funny? isnt there a line of old ladies waiting to check their latest agatha christie out or summat?

 

[Donna Ferentes]

Not in a medical library, dear boy.

 

[butchersapron]

Ok, genuine naivity as to RW's motivations and what he was intending to suggest. And suprising naivity for one whose been on here and around the left for some considerable time.

 

[Larry O'Hara]

To answer the question (that was directed to RW btw and not the other way around), you might like to read some of Anne Cryer's recent comments, being the sitting MP and all. The fact is, and this does have some significant bearing on this, that Searchlight and UAF (who RW is a member of) recently split over this issue. In brief, UAF denied that there is any such activty going on and refused to work with Searchlight in aiming to target it. Searchlight believe that the issue is being ignored by the authorities and that it's driving many people into the arms of the far right as they're the only people who even make a pretence of caring about the issue.

Now, having nailed their colours to this mast for their own internal reasons, the UAF/SWP/RESPECT supporters and members have to flat out deny that any of the sort of stuff that Cryer, Searchlight and other residents are adamant is occouring exists. That's the crux of this. And no amount of suggesting that people who take up a dissenting view are racists, islamophobes or have a belief in asian muslims as genetivcally pre-disposed to paedophilia can change that.

A few comments

1) I doubt that this issue was the only reason for the Searchlight split with UAF

2) Nonetheless, it was one factor

3) Moreover, it is not just Searchlight who have noticed this issue--there is not only Anna Hall's excellent 'Edge of the City' documentary (screened 26/8/04 C4), but also the article by (for example) the strongly anti-BNP Rob Waugh (Yorkshire Post 11/8/04). Indeed, given the way in which Searchlight/their academic quislings have hijacked my research elsewhere/previously, the fact that NFB 6 (out in February) commented on this issue (p.32-33) should not be discounted either.

In other words, that even the Searchlight 'team' who usually barely give a fuck about fighting fascism on the ground in w/class communities when it matters, on the issues that matter, have been forced to admit the reality of this issue as something the BNP are capitalising on, is itself significant.

Given that I myself (& others as noted) were cognisant of the reality of this issue before Searchlight, there is no way that truth should be denied just because Searchlight have jumped on the band-wagon for their own reasons. In other words, as Hibee & TW have pointed out, there is an undeniable issue here that the BNP are seeking to capitalise on. We (anti-fascists, white & ethnic minority communities) allow them to do so at our peril--and the SWP/UAF determination to ignore what is actually going on on the streets is yet further testament to just far how removed these perennial placard-wavers & political poseurs are from real life. End of.

 

[rednblack]

Not in a medical library, dear boy.

http://www.leisuretown.com/library/lotd/6.jpg

 

[where to]

RW-you are wrong there is an underage sex problem in this area with british asian men and young white UK girls, its well documented. For once i am in total agreement with hibee. Your delusionalism knows no boundaries.

it was even on radio5 a few weeks ago. actually, their website might be worth checking for the 'listen again' feature.

 

[where to]

"Searchlight believe that the issue is being ignored by the authorities and that it's driving many people into the arms of the far right as they're the only people who even make a pretence of caring about the issue."

aye, and thats propably why this unusual show was broadcast on FiveLive on a sunday morning....

shame that the issue is not enough to warrant proper investigation- only when it doubles up with the threat of fascist activity etc does it become a problem that needs to be tackled for these cunts..........

 

[audiotech]

Where in the name of fuck did I imply that? Is that the best you can do, lie and smear?

I don't know the first thing about Keighley, I've never been there. All I asked you to do was back up your claim (or your cut and paste's claim) that reports of these gangs being asian was a "myth". Because I've read plenty claiming otherwise. If you can prove your assertions I'll accept your premise.

Obviously being a paedophile has nothing to do with race or religion and everything to do with being a cunt. But this case looks startlingly similar to the debate on here about Oldham a few weeks ago, where out of towner lefties swore blind in the face of contrary evidence from people who were on the ground that there were no such things as asian gangs carrying out race attacks against white people. For good measure they smeared an elderly man who was beaten up.

This victim mentality, this idea that only one community can be the agressors is a mirror image of what the BNP like to do. The left will have no credility with ordinary people if it carries on with this inability to tell the truth.

It was one idiot not "out of towner lefties".

 

[Taxamo Welf]

So hibee and Taxamo Wolf - do you think that i will get away with answering your question with a question? Perhaps if you say you are not trotskyists i can assume you are therefore neo-liberal capitalists too?

If you don't accept that coloureds are victims 365 days a year, you are a rascist

Its spelt welf. Like wealth you numpty.

Donna i think you are being deliberately obtuse, though i agree that butchersapron is often overly aggressive*. I do not suggest there is any link between any race and paedophilia, nor religion. I asked for evidence that the situation in Keighley really was a 'myth'. I have received no evidence other than that which proves the opposite: see mr O'Hara's post for that.

ok?

* you are. You tear into some characters with insane fury that most of us do not know the backstory too anyway. In 99.99% of cases you are right to do so, but from the outside it does look... aggy. However in this case RW is so widely reviled as a liar and a fool, you are in the right. And what you said wasn't aggressive anyway so donna can untwist her knickers

 

[CUMBRIANDRAGON]

Where in the name of fuck did I imply that? Is that the best you can do, lie and smear?

I don't know the first thing about Keighley, I've never been there. All I asked you to do was back up your claim (or your cut and paste's claim) that reports of these gangs being asian was a "myth". Because I've read plenty claiming otherwise. If you can prove your assertions I'll accept your premise.

Obviously being a paedophile has nothing to do with race or religion and everything to do with being a cunt. But this case looks startlingly similar to the debate on here about Oldham a few weeks ago, where out of towner lefties swore blind in the face of contrary evidence from people who were on the ground that there were no such things as asian gangs carrying out race attacks against white people. For good measure they smeared an elderly man who was beaten up.

This victim mentality, this idea that only one community can be the agressors is a mirror image of what the BNP like to do. The left will have no credility with ordinary people if it carries on with this inability to tell the truth.

This is what I wanted to say but did'nt want to be called a fascist troll.

 

[Donna Ferentes]

I asked for evidence that the situation in Keighley really was a 'myth'.

I appreciate that, but that's not what you said: RW mentioned a specific myth and then you responded to it. If that wasn't precisely what you meant than that's fine, words aren't exact and nor is our usage of them, and there's too much round here of the habit of trying to prove that somebody's said something they ain't by insisting on a rigid interpretation of their words.

But by the same token, you can see why RW made the response that he did and it was wrong for people to plough into him for it.

 

[hibee]

I appreciate that, but that's not what you said: RW mentioned a specific myth and then you responded to it. If that wasn't precisely what you meant than that's fine, words aren't exact and nor is our usage of them, and there's too much round here of the habit of trying to prove that somebody's said something they ain't by insisting on a rigid interpretation of their words.

But by the same token, you can see why RW made the response that he did and it was wrong for people to plough into him for it.

No it'a not. He tried to make out anyone who was disagreeing with him was implying paedophelia was linked to Islam, when all myself and taxamo were asking him to to do was back up his assertions.

 

[Donna Ferentes]

No it'a not. He tried to make out anyone who was disagreeing with him was implying paedophelia was linked to Islam, when all myself and taxamo were asking him to to do was back up his assertions.

No he didn't h, he asked you to clarify what you were saying.

 

[Taxamo Welf]

why the fuck should we? [she?] was asserting that it WAS a myth, we asked for evidence. [she?] responded by asking us a question, not answering.

As it turns put in our experience of reb w we knew she wasn't asking us if we thought there was a link between islam and paedophilia, but asking us that instead of giving evidence that we asked for, she was saying ''your with us or against us, question us and your a racist''

Donna i don't really know you but you are being incredibly tiresome this matter is settled please please leave it or add something constructive. Do YOU think the keighley situation is true or untrue?