Atos Medicals - Questions, Answers and Support

[Celt]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-south-east-wales-23353623

I went to see my doctor today, he tells me that they are not supporting any appeals, and there is a bit of me that thinks that maybe their time is better spent trying to get us well?

My letter will be in the post tomorrow, I have to give it a go, its taken longer than expected, its been hot, and I have been mentally not very well. I need to have a weekend when this isn't formost in my mind.

I'm going to see Kenneth Brannah in MacBeth on saturday

 

[Greebo]

<snip>I'm going to see Kenneth Brannah in MacBeth on saturday

Always good to have something to look forward to.

 

[tufty79]

ugh. relapseageddeon. I rang up to make a new Esa claim today, with a sense of 'this'll go well' flavour foreboding. sure enough, I've got to make a hard copy application instead of doing it over the phone because they have managed to keep my claim (which ended last year) open somehow on their system and the lady I spoke to said she couldn't close it.
I have been down this road before, and aren't looking forward to the journey tbh.

 

[audiotech]

I went to see my doctor today, he tells me that they are not supporting any appeals, and there is a bit of me that thinks that maybe their time is better spent trying to get us well?

I won't speak on behalf of anyone else, nonetheless, I know all too well that a GP being supportive, when having to endure an appeals process, made me feel less ill.

 

[panpete]

you assume intentional malice. the simpler answer is their sheer incompetence.

Not assuming, just wondering?

 

[Celt]

I won't speak on behalf of anyone else, nonetheless, I know all too well that a GP being supportive, when having to endure an appeals process, made me feel less ill.

yes thats true, My doctor left about 6 years ago, had just managed to establish some understanding with replacement GP, who left recently, hence I saw a doc that doesn't know me.

 

[buscador]

Bastards at ATOS have just called to try to cancel my appointment on Monday afternoon because they have failed to deliver my paperwork to the correct office. My partner has already taken the day off as unpaid leave to accompany me and cannot change it. She will have to phone them on Monday morning to see if the file has arrived and the appointment can proceed. So my weekend, which was already ruined by the impending assessment, is now completely fucked by the uncertainty. Cunts.

 

[equationgirl]

buscador what a bunch of morons these guys are. How hard is it to deliver the files marked e.g. 'Glasgow' to the Glasgow office?

Unfortunately I think she'll have to phone two or three times on Monday morning because she's certain to get someone who has no idea where your file is. I wish you both all the best.

 

[buscador]

Cheers. I'm just massively fucked off about the whole thing anyway, but while it suits buscadora to hope it may still take place on Monday so that she doesn't have to mess about swapping shifts or taking more unpaid leave I would rather it had been postponed so at least I wouldn't have to get wound up (perhaps unnecessarily) all weekend.

It's just appalling incompetence to call at 5-25 on the Friday afternoon when presumably no one has the ability to change the arrangements they have already made for the day. If they'd just phoned on Monday morning with this lame excuse I'd have been ok. Well, still angry, but ok.

 

[equationgirl]

Cheers. I'm just massively fucked off about the whole thing anyway, but while it suits buscadora to hope it may still take place on Monday so that she doesn't have to mess about swapping shifts or taking more unpaid leave I would rather it had been postponed so at least I wouldn't have to get wound up (perhaps unnecessarily) all weekend.

It's just appalling incompetence to call at 5-25 on the Friday afternoon when presumably no one has the ability to change the arrangements they have already made for the day. If they'd just phoned on Monday morning with this lame excuse I'd have been ok. Well, still angry, but ok.

It's the whole 'get it off my desk before I go home' thing. There may be policies which require them to give a certain amount of notice to claimants but I wouldn't bank on it.

The whole organisation is barely competent.

 

[Celt]

I got my letter to the DWP asking to accept a late request for them to look at my decision. Posted recorded delivery, so lets see how this goes.

The gp not supporting is difficult, but we will see.

 

[equationgirl]

I got my letter to the DWP asking to accept a late request for them to look at my decision. Posted recorded delivery, so lets see how this goes.

The gp not supporting is difficult, but we will see.

Fingers crossed for you Celt.

 

[yardbird]

Ah ha
http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2013/jul/22/disabled-benefits-claimants-test-atos

 

[kittyP]

Ah ha
http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2013/jul/22/disabled-benefits-claimants-test-atos

I was just coming to post this.
So rather than atos loosing the contract for failing to provide what they said they would, the government employ more people to watch their backs.
And we are the ones costing the country too much money

 

[buscador]

buscador what a bunch of morons these guys are. How hard is it to deliver the files marked e.g. 'Glasgow' to the Glasgow office?

Unfortunately I think she'll have to phone two or three times on Monday morning because she's certain to get someone who has no idea where your file is. I wish you both all the best.

Well, the assessment didn't go ahead. Apparently it is beyond the wit of atos to get a file from Wembley to Marylebone.

buscadora has written a stinking letter with the word "complaint" all over it. I will now use up this fortnight's pittance to take her to the pub.

 

[audiotech]

'Poor reports by Atos doesn't mean the assessment was wrong.' Really? Doublespeak by the ministry goes into overdrive.
Laughable.

We are sorry when we do not meet our own high standards but can reassure that a C-grade report does not mean the assessment was wrong and there are checks and balances throughout the system so that the correct decision on benefit is made by the department.

and:

The professional and compassionate service we provide to claimants and the wellbeing of our people remain our primary consideration.

 

[TruXta]

'Poor reports by Atos doesn't mean the assessment was wrong.' Really? Doublespeak by the ministry goes into overdrive.

Alongside the fact that at least 30% of the assessments were bollocks it makes it even more meaningless. On average you'd then expect at least 30% of the C-graded to be bullcock as well.

 

[audiotech]

'Checks and balances'? 'Correct decision made by the department'?

Economical with the truth there. I was told by a 'Decision Maker' at the DWP that the "department" go on the "sheet" they receive from Atos and that alone in their decision making. It is the independent appeal tribunals who are making the "correct" decisions presently.

 

[equationgirl]

Well, the assessment didn't go ahead. Apparently it is beyond the wit of atos to get a file from Wembley to Marylebone.

buscadora has written a stinking letter with the word "complaint" all over it. I will now use up this fortnight's pittance to take her to the pub.

Sorry to hear that, she must be fuming (as well as you). Bet there's some ridiculousness where all files go to some central processing point in Inverness or Exeter before being sent in.

Liked for pub visit.

 

[Celt]

Sorry to hear that, she must be fuming (as well as you). Bet there's some ridiculousness where all files go to some central processing point in Inverness or Exeter before being sent in.

Liked for pub visit.

Had a phonecall from the DWP today regarding my letter, they said I can proceed one of three ways, my review date is coming up to shoudl they just reassess me? (No, I want them to change the incorrect decision they made(and I accepted till I knew it was wrong)) Should they reassess me taking my change of condition into account (No there has been no change of condition, just their interviewer and I were apparently talking about someone completely different to me) or should they ask a judge whether to accept my late appeal (yes please,) they agreed to give me tome to decide and are ringing me back onFriday

I have spoken to the director of the charity I volunteer for and he has said he will support me and act as my advocate should I need it. I took the paperwork and saw him today, he said that he thinks I should be granted the right to appeal and has offered to write a supporting letter - I am so relieved, its not the fight won, but during our conversation I learnt some stuff that made me understand me more and about the reasons I've let this situation get to this.

Relieved of North Wales

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Benefits and Work has lots of news this month, although no doubt most of it's been posted up already (ie. ATOS reports and incompetence etc.), but here's a summary from the email I just got

Atos have been left reeling after two severe blows to their survival as providers of medical assessments in the course of a week. First, a government audit has found that their work capability assessments are so poor that not only must all their current health professionals undergo retraining but also new providers are to be brought in to break up the Atos monopoly by next summer.

Second, an upper tribunal judge has ruled that the opinion of a physiotherapist – on whom Atos are heavily reliant both for carrying out WCAs and even more so for PIP medicals - is of no value if the claimant has a mental health condition. The ramifications of this decision could be huge.

Meanwhile, GPs in South Wales have been told by their local governing body to always refuse to provide letters for claimants in connection with benefits claims as it is ‘an abuse of the national health service’. Only requests by the DWP will be met in future.

Elsewhere, rumours that the software for universal credit has had to be scrapped and started afresh continue to grow. It is looking more and more likely that there will be no genuine rollout of universal credit before the next general election.

ATOS LOSES MONOPOLY
Atos healthcare is to lose its long-held monopoly stranglehold on work capability assessments (open access) from next summer. The news comes as the DWP revealed that 41% of sampled Atos reports had achieved only a ‘c’ grade in a recent audit.

Atos has been the only provider of work capability assessment medicals for employment and support allowance and of its forerunner, the all work test for incapacity benefit, since DWP medical services were outsourced. Campaigners have long argued that the assessments carried out by Atos were not of an acceptable standard but, up until now, the DWP have always defended Atos as if they were part of the same department.

Now, however, the government has decided that Atos is not up to standard and that an improvement plan has to be put into place. Measures include retraining and re-evaluating all Atos health professionals, bringing in a third party to assess Atos’ own audits of its work and engaging Price Waterhouse Coopers to provide advice on improving quality assurance.

ATOS PHYSIO’S EVIDENCE OF NO VALUE
Atos could be in even more difficulties following an upper tribunal decision that the opinion of an Atos health professional who is a physiotherapist was of “no probative value whatsoever” where it concerned a claimant who had a mental, rather than physical, health condition.

The case involved a claimant who had been placed in the WRAG but had appealed to be placed in the support group. The claimant’s mental health conditions included depression and bouts of uncontrollable rage. The judge stated that:

“I can only express my surprise that in a case where the only issue was the mental health of the claimant and its effect in relation to the mental health descriptors, the report was prepared by a physiotherapist following a 15 minute interview. It is plainly important that questions of mental health should be assessed by a disability analyst with appropriate mental health qualifications if their opinion is to be of any evidential value. Even then tribunals should beware of placing too much weight on such reports, based as they are on a very short interview with a claimant and without access to medical records.“

Although the decision, which was highlighted on the Rightsnet discussion forum for welfare rights workers, relates to ESA there is no logical reason why similar arguments cannot be employed in relation to PIP, where a very similar points based system is in place. This could pose a massive problem for Atos whose successful bid for the PIP medical assessment contract stated that they would be using the following health professionals:

933 physiotherapists
373 nurses
75 occupational therapists
19 doctors.

There seems little doubt that the DWP will appeal the decision. Meanwhile, however, we’ll be updating our ESA appeals guide in the near future to take account of this decision – and to look at the potential advantages and risks of using it in your own appeal.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

and

and

CLAIMANTS ‘ABUSE’ OF NHS RESOURCES
Finally for ESA, GPs in south east Wales have been told by their local medical council (LMC) to stop writing letters for patients who need support with a benefits claim or appeal. The LMC have even issued a standard letter for GPs to send to patients which claims that “making such requests to GPs represents an abuse of NHS resources.”

Whilst patients will still be able to request copies of their medical records for a fee of up to £50, it means that Atos/DWP will be the only ones who will be able to get specific GP evidence and they will also be able to choose not to do so, if it suits them .

However, if GPs have a blanket ban on providing such evidence even if offered payment by claimants but do not have a similar blanket ban for say, life insurance companies paying for evidence, then this may be a relatively straightforward case of disability discrimination. We look forward to hearing from members who are prepared to take legal action against GPs in south east Wales or against the Bro Taf LMC.

More details on this story are available from the BBC website and from the Pulse website.

UNIVERSAL CREDIT DOUBTS MULTIPLY
It seems increasingly likely that the software needed for the introduction of universal credit (UC) has had to be scrapped and is now being designed again almost from scratch.
Tweets based on an anonymous source allegedly working within UC claim that the original software has been ditched at a cost of £300 million and that new claims for UC will not now start nationally until 2015.

This fits with claims in the Register that almost all UC information is having to be entered by hand because the software is not fit for purpose.
It also makes sense of the decision this month to roll out UC to just six more Jobcentre Plus offices in October, a mere 1.5% of the total number, and even then to only include the simplest possible types of claim.

The possibility that UC could be abandoned or dramatically scaled down, depending on who wins the next general election, continues to increase.

PIP – BIG DELAYS ALREADY?
One Benefits and Work member has posted (open access) that they had their Capita medical assessment for PIP over a month ago but that the DWP have still not received a copy of the medical report, which was supposed to have been sent on the day of the medical. According to our member, the DWP say that many people are experiencing the same problem. We’d be very interested to hear from you if you are experiencing long delays in your PIP medical arriving with the DWP.

Good point about GP reports (highlighted in red)

 

[Greebo]

Benefits and Work has lots of news this month, although no doubt most of it's been posted up already (ie. ATOS reports and incompetence etc.), but here's a summary from the email I just got

Yesssssssssssss!

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Yesssssssssssss!

 

[Greebo]

The "Yesssssssssssss!" referred to the first bit of that email summary.

It's the start of official recognition that ATOS should be given the Grand Order of the Boot (ie. scrapped, done away with, and preferably not replaced).

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

It's the start of official recognition that ATOS should be given the Grand Order of the Boot (ie. scrapped, done away with, and preferably not replaced).

oh right. I assumed it had been posted on here already so wondered why you were getting excited

Have had to step away from all these benefit threads for a while as they're just depressing me

 

[ddraig]

has this been posted?
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...e-disability-benefit-assessments-8727115.html

More than 600,000 of the 1.8 million assessments carried out by Atos since 2009 have been the subject of an appeal, at a cost of £60m. Around 30 per cent of the appeals succeeded. Mark Hoban, minister for Employment, said: “Where our audits identify any drop in quality, we act decisively … It’s vital we continue to improve the service to claimants, which is why we are introducing new providers to increase capacity.”
Richard Hawkes, chief executive of the disability charity Scope, said: “It’s about time the Government told Atos to smarten up its act. But, it’s also strikingly clear to disabled people that the whole £112m per-year system is broken.”

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

The "Yesssssssssssss!" referred to the first bit of that email summary.

It's the start of official recognition that ATOS should be given the Grand Order of the Boot (ie. scrapped, done away with, and preferably not replaced).

Yes, but they'll only be given a slap on the wrist and share the contract with the likes of Crapita or something equally dire that will just make us all realise that things probably won't change for the better significantly enough for us to all sigh with relief

 

[ViolentPanda]

Just opened a Brown Envelope of Despair© (dated a week ago, naturally!) that informs me that THE BENEFIT YOU RECEIVE IS CHANGING, and that the DWP will be phoning me to answer any questions I have about ESA (I suspect they won't answer stuff like "is the allowance fit for purpose?", though), and that after we've spoken they'll send me a form to fill in. So far, so "fuck me, another fucking form!".
Apparently, if I haven't heard from the within two weeks of the date of the letter (that's next friday, then!), I should phone THEM. Fuck off, you piss-taking cunts. Do your job or don't do it, but don't expect me to pick up your slack, you incompetent wankrags!

E2A: Just put fresh batteries in my dictaphone. They're going to get the "this call is being recorded for training purposes" treatment!

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Just opened a Brown Envelope of Despair© (dated a week ago, naturally!) that informs me that THE BENEFIT YOU RECEIVE IS CHANGING, and that the DWP will be phoning me to answer any questions I have about ESA (I suspect they won't answer stuff like "is the allowance fit for purpose?", though), and that after we've spoken they'll send me a form to fill in. So far, so "fuck me, another fucking form!".
Apparently, if I haven't heard from the within two weeks of the date of the letter (that's next friday, then!), I should phone THEM. Fuck off, you piss-taking cunts. Do your job or don't do it, but don't expect me to pick up your slack, you incompetent wankrags!