Assange to face extradition

[phildwyer]

Hmm.

The best quote there is from John Pilger:

"By standing up to the most rapacious forces in the world today, and telling people in many countries what the powerful say and do behind their backs, he's made enemies of a kind journalists should wear as a badge of honour, but rarely do. The jealousy and envy he attracts often come from those aware of their own collusion with power and unforgiving of one who refuses to join their incestuous club."

Precisely correct imo.

 

[Random]

That's assuming the presence of envy in the first place. The only ones I can see who are definitely motivated by jealousy are his former and now pissed-off co-workers in Wikileaks, who surely share the same badge of honour?

 

[phildwyer]

That's assuming the presence of envy in the first place. The only ones I can see who are definitely motivated by jealousy are his former and now pissed-off co-workers in Wikileaks, who surely share the same badge of honour?

And the real point about all this is made by one "stevecook" in the CiF response to the Guardian piece:

"This isn't about Julian Assange. It's not even about dubious sexual molestation allegation and never has been. What this is about is the pillaging, killing, torture and rape of people with brown skin on the other side of the planet by armed representatives of the most powerful empire on earth. It is about Wiki Leaks' part in exposing those heinous crimes against humanity and about the attempts by the political representatives of that empire to suppress the dissemination of that information by any means. Including ensuring the collusion by the MSM in the dissemination of propoganda."

 

[trashpony]

This is about one sleazy man's colossal ego. Christ, he must be enjoying himself

 

[IC3D]

Identity politics trumps human rights on urban

 

[phildwyer]

This is about one sleazy man's colossal ego.

You don't think what he did was in any way courageous or worthwhile?

 

[Pickman's model]

I do think the septicks would have been rather more inventive and forthright if they really wanted assange. After all, they hardly beat about the bush with hackers, do they? Seems to me a lot of people want to see monsters under the bed here.

 

[trashpony]

You don't think what he did was in any way courageous or worthwhile?

I think it's irrelevant.

 

[Pickman's model]

You don't think what he did was in any way courageous or worthwhile?

If you mean trying to fuck a sleeping woman, then no, I don't.

 

[phildwyer]

I think it's irrelevant.

Huh? You think Wikileaks is irrelevant to the Julian Assange case?

 

[trashpony]

Huh? You think Wikileaks is irrelevant to the Julian Assange case?

I think it's perfectly possible to be the founder of wikileaks and be a rapist. Something that seems a bit difficult for some people to get their heads around for some reason.

 

[RaverDrew]

I think it's perfectly possible to be the founder of wikileaks and be a rapist. Something that seems a bit difficult for some people to get their heads around for some reason.

Sounds like you've found him guilty in your mind already.

 

[trashpony]

Sounds like you've found him guilty in your mind already.

I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion. He's been accused of a crime - I have no idea whether he's guilty or not. But being the founder of wikileaks has no bearing on that one way or the other

 

[RaverDrew]

But being the founder of wikileaks has no bearing on that one way or the other

Can't see where I said it did

You've already denounced him as "sleazy" a few posts ago, and have also equated the possibility of him being the founder of wikileaks, with the possibility of him being a rapist. This to me seems to indicate that you've already made your mind up about whether he is guilty or not.

 

[articul8]

Bradley Manning is the real hero of Wikileaks.

 

[butchersapron]

Can't see where I said it did

You've already denounced him as "sleazy" a few posts ago, and have also equated the possibility of him being the founder of wikileaks, with the possibility of him being a rapist. This to me seems to indicate that you've already made your mind up about whether he is guilty or not.

Excellent, you support his extradition to sweden then right?

 

[Random]

And the real point about all this is made by one "stevecook" in the CiF response to the Guardian piece
"This isn't about Julian Assange. It's not even about dubious sexual molestation allegation and never has been. What this is about is the pillaging, killing, torture and rape of people with brown skin on the other side of the planet by armed representatives of the most powerful empire on earth. It is about Wiki Leaks' part in exposing those heinous crimes against humanity and about the attempts by the political representatives of that empire to suppress the dissemination of that information by any means. Including ensuring the collusion by the MSM in the dissemination of propoganda."

Sounds like the use of 'brown people' to say that certain high profile people should never have to answer an assault case.

 

[butchersapron]

Sounds like the use of 'brown people' to say that certain high profile people should never have to answer an assault case.

As someone so eloquently put it earlier Identity politics trumps human rights on urban.

 

[belboid]

Eek, the source has claimed that Greenwald misinterpreted his work, didn't ask him about it and has now agreed with David Allen Green.

your thoughts, belboid?

my thought is that you didnt read the Greenwald article very closely in the first place then. He quoted klamberg because he was (generally) on DAGs side. The fact that an absolute guarantee cannot be given has always been accepted. DAGs disputation of that was dishonest. So this makes absolutely no difference to anything

 

[cesare]

my thought is that you didnt read the Greenwald article very closely in the first place then. He quoted klamberg because he was (generally) on DAGs side. The fact that an absolute guarantee cannot be given has always been accepted. DAGs disputation of that was dishonest. So this makes absolutely no difference to anything

To be fair, that Greenwald article was very difficult to read (as I know you acknowledged from the outset). But in any event, I've found going to the sources preferable including the Swedish law.

 

[Balbi]

Ah, the la, la I can't hear you approach.

 

[cesare]

Many journalists have contacted me on the issue whether Julian Assange can be extradited to the US via Sweden for espionage where he might face the death penalty. The short answer is: no. Below you will find the long answer.

 

[Wilf]

And the real point about all this is made by one "stevecook" in the CiF response to the Guardian piece:

"This isn't about Julian Assange. It's not even about dubious sexual molestation allegation and never has been. What this is about is the pillaging, killing, torture and rape of people with brown skin on the other side of the planet by armed representatives of the most powerful empire on earth. It is about Wiki Leaks' part in exposing those heinous crimes against humanity and about the attempts by the political representatives of that empire to suppress the dissemination of that information by any means. Including ensuring the collusion by the MSM in the dissemination of propoganda."

What appears to be the logic behind that is contemptible (I say appears as I can't see the original and what stevecook might, if anything, be saying about the rape investigation). Sometimes things are messy, sometimes the enemy of my enemy isn't my friend in every respect, sometimes you've got be honest about someones personal behaviour even if you adore their political stance (and to be clear, whilst the actual leaks are positive, I don't adore the politics that surround wikileaks). You diminish your politics if it leaves you one eyed about personal behaviour.

Of course if wikileaks had remained more of a collective, more of a wiki if you like, this would all be less damaging. The more it has become the personality cult of Saint Julian the more it left itself open to his feet of clay (and by that I'm not pre-judging the actual rape investigation - just his wandering guru status, Icke sans lizards etc. The grauniad might have turned on their former 'superstar', but some of those tales in agricola's link are very telling).

edit: oh, Random said it quicker.

 

[Wilf]

Can't see where I said it did

You've already denounced him as "sleazy" a few posts ago, and have also equated the possibility of him being the founder of wikileaks, with the possibility of him being a rapist. This to me seems to indicate that you've already made your mind up about whether he is guilty or not.

Regardless of whether he committed rape and/or sexual assault, that he is sleazy in his approach to women seems to be the one thing it's hard to argue against. Can't be bothered searching for the links, but there are enough direct quotes from women (as opposed to journalist cases against him) to reach that 'common sense' conclusion. It's subjective of course, defenders might say he 'made the most of his fame', but I'm less inclined to be so charitable.

Edit: this, from agricola's post - if anything like the truth - will do:

I followed up with requests to interview him for my book. I received florid emails such as, "I will have you, Heather, of course I will. But let us be messiahs to generation WHY, not a bunch of ageing hacks looking for a pension... regards from intrigue hotel... I have more interesting adventures for you..."

When he suddenly turned up in London, he wanted me to put him up and act as some sort of mother surrogate. "I have a fever. I'm not sure yet if it's going up or down," he told me. "I need some mothering. Someone to make me chicken noodle soup and bring me cookies in bed."

I later heard from two other women who said Assange pulled the same "poor little lost boy" trick on them in an attempt to finagle his way into their homes. I said that was not how I conducted interviews. He complained that I didn't have a maternal instinct, adding in drama-queen fashion: "I have two wars to stop."
I replied: "Yeah, it's a tough life being a messiah." His response left me speechless: "Will you be my Mary Magdalene, Heather? And bathe my feet at the cross."

 

[butchersapron]

I will have you, Heather, of course I will.

 

[Wilf]

Wonder if his fridge has been delivered yet?

 

[phildwyer]

Regardless of whether he committed rape and/or sexual assault, that he is sleazy in his approach to women seems to be the one thing it's hard to argue against.

Heh.

Whenever men accuse other men of being "sleazy in their approach to women" I can't help feeling that a teensy bit of envy just may possibly be involved in their assessment.

 

[laptop]

Ian Katz recalls his last conversation with Assange conclusing the above piece...

... a few flashes of menace (one former colleague suspected of leaking had now been "sat on") and some eye-wateringly unsavoury references to sex

 

[goldenecitrone]

Heh.

Whenever men accuse other men of being "sleazy in their approach to women" I can't help feeling that a teensy bit of envy just may possibly be involved in their assessment.

And yet they still love the Stones.

 

[phildwyer]

Ian Katz recalls his last conversation with Assange conclusing the above piece...

Heh.

Whenever men accuse other men of being "sleazy in their approach to women" I can't help feeling that a teensy bit of envy just may possibly be involved in their assessment.