ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Repetition does not confer veracity, and being "publically" [sic] branded a liar by you carries no weight, not even on Urban, where posters are all too familiar with your tactics and your posturing.
Apparently, Feminism is dead!!!
- Thread starter Treacle Toes
- Start date
Repetition does not confer veracity, and being "publically" [sic] branded a liar by you carries no weight, not even on Urban, where posters are all too familiar with your tactics and your posturing.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Hmmm, and you're able to make a meaningful content and context analysis on the basis of a couple of dozen posts?
How very interesting.
Let me stop you right there.
Now, you know sometimes grown-ups might say things that arenb't quite exactly what really happened? Well...
Oh bugger it. I'm off to wave. Weepiper, I forgive you. Go forth and sin no more.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Selective memory is quite common in people with a well-developed sense of self-regard, fed.
E2A: Especially academics.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Is feminism actually feminism? Isn't it, at the end of the day, peopleism, in terms of attempting to achieve equality in all spheres between women and men?
But not forgotten.
YouSir
Retired from Urban
Selective memory is quite common in people with a well-developed sense of self-regard, fed.
E2A: Especially academics.
Hell with you, the sins of Dwyer are not the sins of academia.
YouSir
Retired from Urban
Unlike yourself, who within a matter of years will be but a whisper on the winds, all forgotten but desperately clinging to a sense of relevance.
Cesare, I find one part of your stance unhelpful.
You seem to think that as a man, I can have no stake in feminism, no understanding of it and can have nothing to offer in the attempt to identify, define and fight for it.
I think you're wrong on all counts. I have no right to attempt to control it, sure. But to shut 50% of the population from contributing is exceedingly unhelpful, counter-productive and even naïve. Any future for feminism will directly affect 50% of my nearest and dearest and include on the journey the other 50% in order to succeed. It isn't about shutting others out of your club, it's about the kind of society we are striving for. We all have a stake in that.
You seem to think that as a man, I can have no stake in feminism, no understanding of it and can have nothing to offer in the attempt to identify, define and fight for it.
I think you're wrong on all counts. I have no right to attempt to control it, sure. But to shut 50% of the population from contributing is exceedingly unhelpful, counter-productive and even naïve. Any future for feminism will directly affect 50% of my nearest and dearest and include on the journey the other 50% in order to succeed. It isn't about shutting others out of your club, it's about the kind of society we are striving for. We all have a stake in that.
cesare
shady's dreams ♥
Fuck knows what some of these men would feel like if presented with some proper radfem politics 
Edit: talking of which, this caused a shitstorm this year: http://gendertrender.wordpress.com/2012/05/18/radfem-2012-first-speakers-announced/
Edit: talking of which, this caused a shitstorm this year: http://gendertrender.wordpress.com/2012/05/18/radfem-2012-first-speakers-announced/
So opinions are fine so long as we keep them to ourselves? We have a stake but can have no agency despite that stake?
This isn't an academic exercise for me just because it is my wife, mother and sister directly affected instead of me. I see and feel the injustice of those who matter most to me. This isn't the oppression of a segregated minority.
And as regards your last point: I bet I grew up in a much more radfem household than you did. But is comparing the size of our radfem really the level you want to descend to?
This isn't an academic exercise for me just because it is my wife, mother and sister directly affected instead of me. I see and feel the injustice of those who matter most to me. This isn't the oppression of a segregated minority.
And as regards your last point: I bet I grew up in a much more radfem household than you did. But is comparing the size of our radfem really the level you want to descend to?
You must be joking. I'm not touching that and especially not on here.
I'll tell you this though: the radical feminists I grew up surrounded by would have been incredibly pissed off at the claiming of Cheryl Cole as a female role model, strong or otherwise.
I'll tell you this though: the radical feminists I grew up surrounded by would have been incredibly pissed off at the claiming of Cheryl Cole as a female role model, strong or otherwise.
Well fuck the radfems then, whoever they may be.
cesare
shady's dreams ♥
Here is not a particularly feminist place, Kabbes. You might get a couple of views that are a bit stronger than yours, but you can relatively easily shut them up (look at how easy it is for you to convert my stance into one of denying 50% of the population of their opinions, for example).
And now faced with being asked for an opinion on radfem politics, from someone that grew up "in a much more radfem environment" you're reluctant and just offer again your opinion that you and your family don't think much of Cheryl Cole as a role model. Well, fine. Don't have her as one, then.
And now faced with being asked for an opinion on radfem politics, from someone that grew up "in a much more radfem environment" you're reluctant and just offer again your opinion that you and your family don't think much of Cheryl Cole as a role model. Well, fine. Don't have her as one, then.
cesare
shady's dreams ♥
Have a look at that link I provided for an insight. There's some very unpleasant stuff at the heart of what's emerging (in my view).
Random
Ethnic nalgocrat
From what I can see, it seems to be a split between different feminist groups/websites due to the RadFem conference only allowing born-women to attend. What's the unpleasant development you're talking about, cesare? The feminist non/acceptance of trans women has been an issue for as long as I can remember.
cesare
shady's dreams ♥
Yes, the trans women acceptance has been an issue for a long time. But it seems to be getting far more vitriolic. Also, opinion seems to be polarising around the sex industry argument. There's also the "privilege" discourse, which seems to be gaining traction. And also this retreat into "safe spaces". So, off the top of my head, it's a number of factors which combine to make quite unpalatable reading at first glance. There's more to all of these on analysis, but I'm mainly observing about the cumulative effect.
cesare
shady's dreams ♥
Many more than 5
And their conditions preclude intersex people too.
Random
Ethnic nalgocrat
And just to summarise my own position on sex workers and feminism. If you think that sex work is demeaning to the women involved, if you think they're being abused and you think it's damaging to women in general, then your move should surely be to support those workers, to find out what you can do to make their bargaining position stronger. Otherwise you're simply piling on the pressure on those people who're already facing a hard time.
cesare
shady's dreams ♥
And also some people do it from choice and not from conscription or economic necessity. And they shouldn't be demeaned for doing so. Far worse to become a copper out of choice!
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