The Unabomber is dead

[Magnus McGinty]

Where did you get the burglary from?

I thought he stole food. But maybe not.

After his arrest, the FBI would discover numerous local crimes no one knew he had perpetrated. Kaczynski had sabotaged area mines, poured sugar into random compressor tanks and stole numerous items from the town dump and local backyards (mostly used to build bombs). One day, he used a hunting rifle to take pot shots at a helicopter buzzing his land. Another time, he chopped down a utility pole holding a pay phone Kaczynski believed was stealing his change.

‘My next-door neighbor was the Unabomber, Ted Kaczynski’

Ted Kaczynski used to live down the road from Jamie Gehring. At the same time, he was carrying out his terror campaign, she reveals in a new book.

nypost.com

 

[tim]

"Ted" was he a mate LDC ?

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I didn't say it was full of stunning new insights, and he definitely had some reactionary views (although I can't recall anything racist the manifesto at all) but his positions on technology shared some common ground with plenty of others who are well respected so they're hardly completely off-base. I've never heard anyone say his writing was nicked from Desmond Morris tbh, I'd be surprised if Ted had even heard of him. Some of his criticisms of 'the left' were clunky, but I think had some merit tbh.

The Human Zoo was a major influence. He said so himself.

Kaczynski’s amendments and additions to Ellul are derived from several sources. The most important is The Human Zoo by zoologist Desmond Morris, the 1969 sequel to his 1967 bestseller, The Naked Ape. Drawing on his experience as curator of mammals at the London Zoo, Morris observes that modern city-dwellers are afflicted by many of the same psychological problems that afflict other mammals in captivity. He attributes these problems to the fact that ‘[t]he modern human animal is no longer living in conditions natural for his species’.Footnote63 Human beings, who evolved to be tribal hunter-gatherers, pay a high psychological price for living in the relative safety of their urban ‘zoos’.

Kaczynski’s debt to Morris is well hidden. The Washington Post version of the Manifesto does not cite Morris and contains only subtle allusions to The Human Zoo. After listing the various psychological problems caused by disruption of the power process, Kaczynski adds that ‘ome of the symptoms listed are similar to those shown by caged animals’.Footnote64 On his private copy of the Manifesto, he followed this sentence with a private footnote to The Human Zoo.Footnote65
Kaczynski’s Darwinian spin on Ellul is derived from this book. His 1978–1979 essay, ‘Reflections on Purposeful Work’, closely echoes Morris and anticipates the Manifesto’s idea of biological maladaptation: ‘the reasons [sic] modern man is so prone to frustration and other emotional problems is that in the technological society he lives a life that is highly abnormal; as compared with the life to which evolution has adapted him, namely, the life of a hunter-gatherer’.Footnote66 Kaczynski put an endnote after this sentence, but the endnotes are missing. A reference to The Human Zoo would have fit perfectly.
Kaczynski’s idea of the power process is derived in large part from Morris. In a 1996 letter, written three months after his arrest, Kaczynski recommends ‘two books that seem to give some support to the manifesto’s assertion about the power process: Desmond Morris, The Human Zoo, and Martin E. P. Seligman, Helplessness: On Depression, Development, and Death’.Footnote67 He is vague here because admitting to being the author of the Manifesto would have meant incriminating himself.

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/13569317.2021.1921940

 

[LDC]

"Ted" was he a mate LDC ?

I knew someone would pick up on that pointlessly, was waiting for you.

No, but it's easier than typing his surname isn't it?

 

[Pickman's model]

I knew someone would pick up on that pointlessly, was waiting for you.

No, but it's easier than typing his surname isn't it?

Here's a handy librarian tip from cataloguing, avail yourself of the copy and paste function with hard to spell words and names

 

[hitmouse]

He did inspire a really great footnote, at least:

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Isn't the point about his criticisms of the left that he himself fundamentally misunderstood the nature of the 'hunter-gatherer' societies he thought we had evolved to live in? That absolutely does not mean going off to live on your own in a forest. It means living in a group where your wellbeing is completely tied in with membership of that group.

Ironically, it is only by existing on the margins of a 'technological society' that it is possible to live on your own in the way he did. The way he chose to live had nothing to do with any form of getting back to a state of nature. It was a hobby, a displacement activity, no different from the rest of us.

 

[marty21]

Watched the Netflix doc last night - (Mrs21 insisted) it's a pretty decent doc . Learnt some new stuff about him.

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

How did he survive all those years in the wilderness? It doesn't seem to be something that's come up in anything I've seen about him, not that I've read all that much. Even he was able to be self-sufficient in providing himself with food and fuel and clothing, he must have needed cash for postage at the very least. But probably other things as well. And he'd only worked a few years as a teacher, so couldn't have saved up all that much, even as someone who was unlikely to have expensive tastes.

As I understand it, his brother put up most of the cash for the property. His mother sent him checks for $1,000 to $2,000 for Christmas. After that, he worked odd jobs for a few months at a time. After he was arrested, they figured out that he had been the one behind numerous instances of vandalism, such as putting sugar in gasoline, etc.

My favorite story about him was that he regularly went to the library in town. Sometimes he brought the lady librarian there produce from his garden. No telling if he was being "country friendly" or it was his way of courting her. But the kicker on the story is that after he was arrested, they interviewed this librarian, and she was grossed out to learn that he'd been fertilizing his garden with his own waste. This isn't as odd as you think. As long as you compost it before putting in on the garden its relatively safe from pathogens.

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

Isn't the point about his criticisms of the left that he himself fundamentally misunderstood the nature of the 'hunter-gatherer' societies he thought we had evolved to live in? That absolutely does not mean going off to live on your own in a forest. It means living in a group where your wellbeing is completely tied in with membership of that group.

^This. His understanding of native cultures is pretty limited, especially his understanding of women in native culture. For example, he actually asked a woman to be his "squaw." "Squaw" means slave not wife. I have my doubts if he understood the difference in any case. I think he had dreams of building a community, maybe. But, his lack of any social skills made that impossible. This is also my problem with a lot of survivalists. They think that surviving means moving off grid by themselves and using guns to hold off anyone else. If the TEOWAKI happens, these folks might not be the first to go, but they won't be long-term survivors for this very reason.

 

[_Russ_]

Was an interesting Hardtalk guest the other day with some similar views to Ted BBC World News - HARDtalk, Professor Daron Acemoğlu - Economist, Economist Daron Acemoğlu: AI could increase inequality

BTW has our resident pedant not complained about the thread being in here yet?

 

[The39thStep]

Was an interesting Hardtalk guest the other day with some similar views to Ted BBC World News - HARDtalk, Professor Daron Acemoğlu - Economist, Economist Daron Acemoğlu: AI could increase inequality

BTW has our resident pedant not complained about the thread being in here yet?

Any updates on revealing the walts?

 

[likesfish]

^This. His understanding of native cultures is pretty limited, especially his understanding of women in native culture. For example, he actually asked a woman to be his "squaw." "Squaw" means slave not wife. I have my doubts if he understood the difference in any case. I think he had dreams of building a community, maybe. But, his lack of any social skills made that impossible. This is also my problem with a lot of survivalists. They think that surviving means moving off grid by themselves and using guns to hold off anyone else. If the TEOWAKI happens, these folks might not be the first to go, but they won't be long-term survivors for this very reason.

Catafarians they think they are all rugged individuals completely ignorant of the system and infrastructure that supports their lifestyle like housecats.

 

[_Russ_]

Any updates on revealing the walts?

I'll let you know when I actually give enough of a fuck to let you know

 

[The39thStep]

I'll let you know when I actually give enough of a fuck to let you know

Don't be like that Russ. The suspense is causing havoc on that thread, many posters are looking over their shoulders.

 

[moody]

Thought you meant Luke the Manchester DJ

there was two of them, the other one was called justin irc?

 

[Flavour]

Ironically, it is only by existing on the margins of a 'technological society' that it is possible to live on your own in the way he did.

precisely. but you try convincing people to abandon their material lives and join your hunter-gatherer tribe. sending letter bombs and eating stolen beef jerky in a cabin much easier

 

[The39thStep]

there was two of them, the other one was called justin irc?

There were two, never came across the second tbh. I've known Luke since his SWP days

 

[Charles Ufarley]

Him and the FBI grass both deathed in a week. Anyone notice how jet fuel can’t melt ADX Florence…

Got the chance to have a look around some of ADX Florence, once. Not as an inmate, I hasten to add. Lives up to it's reputation and nickname.

 

[Knotted]

Kaczynski's philosophy was primitivist and anti-social. It's not like you can separate the goals from the deeds.

 

[Knotted]

Just been reading the manifesto. There are certain passages that really seem to be spot on commentary about the world, but the overall thinking is technology is the problem not so so much economics and the critique of technology is rooted in a biological/anthropological thesis.

I think a lot of people try to find meaning in life and in many ways realise that you can't find meaning. Think of Aldhous Huxley and Brave New World which he gives a nod to. There's always something very powerful about reading somebody who has had similar thoughts. But if you step back a bit from the writing, it's a thesis about human satisfaction necessarily being gained from struggling to gain the power to complete tasks mostly in the necessary for survival category. This is both questionable and vulgar scientism ironically enough. His critique of science is a combination of the meaninglessness of the specialisiation of science (I think that's quite a powerful little point in there btw) and the way science relates to technology and the ongoing industrial revolution. But otherwise he's quite the 19th century style big brained mathematical/scientific thinker, he lays things out in a very logical suppose this - the alternatives are this and this and there maybe a caveat here but we can ignore it. The bulk of the manifesto is his armchair anthropology/psychology. As he looks towards biology and hunter gatherer societies he sees the solution in terms of individual freedom and freedom for small (sometimes captialised SMALL) groups. So there's an odd combination of wanting to turn the clock right back to the year zero but in terms that sound like they're from 19th century and the most aggressive phase of industrialisation.

He's explicitly against "leftism" and it maybe that you think it's a certain kind of leftism that he's railing against - eg. politically correct liberal types. But later on and in fact the whole manifesto make it clear that it's the leftist collectivism and it's inevitable relation to technology that appalls him and that he saw the left as the most acute expression of the system. There are certain passages that read very like modern anti-work diatribes. (Albeit with more nuance than those diatribes, he didn't have the same agenda as these conservatives.) There are certain passages about leftist power seeking that I feel Jordan Peterson may have cribbed from him.

There's very little in the manifesto about ecological/green issues, apart from general concern. There's a lot about overpopulation and crowding.

He thought change would come about by people rising up against the system while the system at once floundered. He didn't think he could overthrow the system through terrorism - I believe his terrorism was modest in its aims ie. self-publicity and well frankly it worked otherwise I wouldn't be sitting here reading this. He considered human dignity to be more important than human life when push comes to shove. There's a fair bit of cold consequentialist logic going on and a fair bit of criticism of "oversocialised" leftist moralism, I think he would be the type to make a moral calculation when it comes to a bombing campaign. He's the type who sees himself as having the central insight into the workings of the world without input from others, even Breivik listed references.

Oh yeah and he saw nazis as rebels against the system.

Overall even the occasional passage where I am nodding along with him it's because it's a well articulated sense of alienation and I think that sense of alienation is real. I don't think he either found where that sense of alienation came from or found a solution to it.

 

[DaveCinzano]

I knew someone would pick up on that pointlessly, was waiting for you.

 

[DaphneM]

‘His ideas resonate’: how the Unabomber’s dangerous anti-tech manifesto lives on

Ted Kaczynski’s ‘prescient’ views have been praised by Elon Musk and Tucker Carlson – and continue to draw misguided new followers

www.theguardian.com

 

[tim]

‘His ideas resonate’: how the Unabomber’s dangerous anti-tech manifesto lives on

Ted Kaczynski’s ‘prescient’ views have been praised by Elon Musk and Tucker Carlson – and continue to draw misguided new followers

www.theguardian.com

Nasty pieces of work venerate murdering nasty piece of work

 

[Pickman's model]

Got the chance to have a look around some of ADX Florence, once. Not as an inmate, I hasten to add. Lives up to it's reputation and nickname.

Was this as a screw?

 

[GroovySunday]

Not that I'm going full on primmie or anything, and I can't say I agree with what Kaczynski did. But Industrial Society and It's Future is a very interesting, genuinely thought-provoking, logical bit of reading material tbh. I've read more than half of it so far anyway.

 

[NoXion]

Including the social Darwinist bits?

 

[GroovySunday]

Including the social Darwinist bits?

Oh especially those.

 

[NoXion]

Bloody hell.

 

[GroovySunday]

Bloody hell.

Yeah, I wasn't being serious. And as I say, though I find it a pretty good, interesting read, I'm not about to go full on primitivist.

At the very least, I am fond of medical technology, medicine and science (though science can obviously be abused).