A thank you to Brexiteers.

[littlebabyjesus]

I get that, also get that a return to the same relationship UK had pre 2016 is impossible (not sure most people do). In the meantime the EU has challenges of its own to overcome

A return to pre-2016 is impossible, yes. The UK had a unique status in the EU. It was like Norway's relationship but with voting rights. They won't get that back.

 

[Pickman's model]

A return to pre-2016 is impossible, yes. The UK had a unique status in the EU. It was like Norway's relationship but with voting rights. They won't get that back.

Nor the rebate nor the commissioner etc

 

[Louis MacNeice]

Tory is fucking idiot shock

Tory is fucking lying idiot shock.

He got called on the lying on the radio today and just said 'I wasn't lying, that's collective responsibility'; as if both things were somehow mutually exclusive!

Cheers - Louis MacNeice

 

[Karl Masks]

It’s a crap joke.

you're the expert

 

[Karl Masks]

It won’t make trade impossible. Capital likes to trade and finds a way.

Cool, what are the options on the table? Go...

 

[Karl Masks]

It has been 0 days since the thread degenerated into slagging off Leave\Remain voters

just the clowns who, despite the evidence, still believe we're better off in fantasy land.

I don't hold anyone who fell for a complex well funded campaign of deceit. People are entitled to be wrong and make mistakes. To continue arguing for this now is an act of utter folly and self harm

 

[Pickman's model]

I don't hold anyone who fell for a complex well funded campaign of deceit.

Good. It'd be better if it meant something.

 

[Tanya1982]

and while you're at it, vote trump

Indeed. Brexit's twin. All that manufacturing will be racing back to the rust belt any day now. Any day. Probably tomorrow. Almost certainly this century. Just hang on and hope - just as with Brexit the horizon depends on what you're looking for and changes frequently, so you can project whatever dreams and fantasies you want onto it.

 

[Smokeandsteam]

Indeed. Brexit's twin. All that manufacturing will be racing back to the rust belt any day now. Any day. Probably tomorrow. Almost certainly this century. Just hang on and hope - just as with Brexit the horizon depends on what you're looking for and changes frequently, so you can project whatever dreams and fantasies you want onto it.

You do realise he isn’t President anymore right?

As for the slightly patronising tone you favour, as usual with middle class liberals the symptoms are often mistaken for the cause when it comes to ire. How dare these ignorant sheeple want jobs to come back to their community eh? How dare these imbeciles turn their backs on their self professed leaders (who didn’t nothing to prevent the jobs going) eh?

 

[gosub]

A return to pre-2016 is impossible, yes. The UK had a unique status in the EU. It was like Norway's relationship but with voting rights. They won't get that back.

No Norway deal is different EFTA and its transparency on payments...UK can't even go down that route EFTA considers UKs size makes it incompatible with membership.

 

[gosub]

just the clowns who, despite the evidence, still believe we're better off in fantasy land.

I don't hold anyone who fell for a complex well funded campaign of deceit. People are entitled to be wrong and make mistakes. To continue arguing for this now is an act of utter folly and self harm

I know, yet years after the tax payer funded sham ended there are people who carry on like they can't accept the result

 

[gosub]

You do realise he isn’t President anymore right?

Not sure he's fully absorbed that himself tbh

 

[newme]

Not sure he's fully absorbed that himself tbh

Which is remarkable considering how fucking horrified he looked to be elected to begin with

 

[Karl Masks]

Indeed. Brexit's twin. All that manufacturing will be racing back to the rust belt any day now. Any day. Probably tomorrow. Almost certainly this century. Just hang on and hope - just as with Brexit the horizon depends on what you're looking for and changes frequently, so you can project whatever dreams and fantasies you want onto it.

We've just given away our agriculture to the Aussies and then admitted that was a terrible idea. But Project Fear....

 

[Karl Masks]

You do realise he isn’t President anymore right?

As for the slightly patronising tone you favour, as usual with middle class liberals the symptoms are often mistaken for the cause when it comes to ire. How dare these ignorant sheeple want jobs to come back to their community eh? How dare these imbeciles turn their backs on their self professed leaders (who didn’t nothing to prevent the jobs going) eh?

Extraordinary. Nothing in that post inspires such a bad faith reading.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

No Norway deal is different EFTA and its transparency on payments...UK can't even go down that route EFTA considers UKs size makes it incompatible with membership.

EFTA has expressed concerns, yes. A good faith UK could work something out, though. One of the problems - the biggest problem - is that nobody trusts the good faith of the UK. The UK was a founding member of EFTA. Its relative size wasn't a problem then.

There was total transparency on the UK's payments to the EU, btw, if that's what you're getting at. One of the big lies put about by Johnson was the idea that the UK pays all this money and it goes 'god knows where'. Johnson himself knew full well that all the money was accounted for, and that EU payments are all laid out online for anyone to have a look at. One of the many lies of the Leave campaign.

And if people think I'm obsessing on this, I'm not. I'm just posting on a thread about Brexit. I don't think about Brexit that much, but whenever I do, I reflect on how much of a total fuck up it has been and how fucking deluded everyone who still thinks it was a good idea is.

 

[_Russ_]

just the clowns who, despite the evidence, still believe we're better off in fantasy land.

I don't hold anyone who fell for a complex well funded campaign of deceit. People are entitled to be wrong and make mistakes. To continue arguing for this now is an act of utter folly and self harm

So why do you keep doing it.


P.S. Fuck off

 

[TopCat]

Extraordinary. Nothing in that post inspires such a bad faith reading.

It deserves a harsher response you pompous twat.

 

[Pickman's model]

You do realise he isn’t President anymore right?

As for the slightly patronising tone you favour, as usual with middle class liberals the symptoms are often mistaken for the cause when it comes to ire. How dare these ignorant sheeple want jobs to come back to their community eh? How dare these imbeciles turn their backs on their self professed leaders (who didn’t nothing to prevent the jobs going) eh?

Yeh the crop in power now have presided over the selling off of not just the family jewels but the family home.

 

[Tanya1982]

Extraordinary. Nothing in that post inspires such a bad faith reading.

There's not much to be said to someone who thinks that an arguable 'slightly patronizing' tone is worse than a definitely 'fucking lying' tone. It's not me who's lying to those people as part of my grift, so I rest easy.

Candlestick makers of the world unite!

 

[Maggot]

The former: a dwindling number of obsessive weirdos who view everything through the prism of Brexit.

The majority of the country recognise a) that a multiplicity of factors are at work b) that the structural economic problems that Britain faces pre-date Brexit and c) that the Tories have botched Brexit and Truss’ budget lit the fuse.

Most people recognise that the EU debate is settled and want an economic plan that improves matters. They don’t have a disabling confirmation bias. Unlike remainers.

This is hilaroius.

Brexit has shrunk our economy by 4%, cost billions; Damaged exports and made them almost impossible or uneconomic for many firms; contributed to labour shortages in hospitality, social care and other areas; Led to an unsolvable problem with the Good Friday Agreement; Screwed fisherman and farmers.

Yet the people who point this out are 'a dwindling number of obsessive weirdos'.

 

[gosub]

This is hilaroius.

Brexit has shrunk our economy by 4%, cost billions; Damaged exports and made them almost impossible or uneconomic for many firms; contributed to labour shortages in hospitality, social care and other areas; Led to an unsolvable problem with the Good Friday Agreement; Screwed fisherman and farmers.

Yet the people who point this out are 'a dwindling number of obsessive weirdos'.

Can you colour in the impacts of other things such as covid, Ukraine, QE+QT to give a percentage impact on the economy, just out of interest? Or have you decided to say 4% Brexit and started laughing....If so is probably hysteria rather than hilarity

 

[Smokeandsteam]

This is hilaroius.

Thanks. What’s tragic is the number of people on here who endlessly bemoan the termination of membership of a trading bloc managed by unelected bureaucrats, the ECB and IMF. Weep at the relative drying up of cheap labour and who trot out estimates produced by administrators of capital that try to explain away the structural and corporeal consequences of it.

To have had your horizons lowered to the extent that the restoration of the EU order is what you are fighting for is depressing.

 

[Maggot]

Can you colour in the impacts of other things such as covid, Ukraine, QE+QT to give a percentage impact on the economy, just out of interest? Or have you decided to say 4% Brexit and started laughing....If so is probably hysteria rather than hilarity

That is the figure given by the statisticians at the Office for Budget Responsibility. They also said that Brexit has reduced imports and exports by 15%.

 

[Smokeandsteam]

That is the figure given by the statisticians at the Office for Budget Responsibility. They also said that Brexit has reduced imports and exports by 15%.

No. It’s an assumption and forecast made by the OBR. You can tell this because it’s in the section of the report marked as such. I can forecast that the OBR - produced by those working at the heart of establishment remain - will be wrong because it’s based on a series of assumptions frozen at a particular moment in time and given the war, covid, Brexit and the cost of living crisis inevitably can only be a guess.

 

[Maggot]

No. It’s an assumption and forecast made by the OBR. You can tell this because it’s in the section of the report marked as such. I can forecast that the OBR - produced by those working at the heart of establishment remain - will be wrong because it’s based on a series of assumptions frozen at a particular moment in time and given the war, covid, Brexit and the cost of living crisis inevitably can only be a guess.

I'm sure you know much better than the professional statisticians who spend their working lives analysing and producing these figures.

 

[Smokeandsteam]

I'm sure you know much better than the professional statisticians who spend their working lives analysing and producing these figures.

Maybe, but I definitely know the difference between an assumption and a fact

 

[Pickman's model]

I'm sure you know much better than the professional statisticians who spend their working lives analysing and producing these figures.

Liars, damned liars, and statisticians

 

[bimble]

When this gets to around 80% I think the politicians might feel safe enough to mention brexit again.

(For respondents under the age of 50 this poll got only 19% thinking we were right to leave).

 

[Mezzer]

Maybe, but I definitely know the difference between an assumption and a fact

The irony is, you're happy to assume that having cut our close ties with our closest trading partners, there's no appreciable downturn in trade. How completely unlikely that is.