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Will you vote for independence?

Scottish independence?

  • Yes please

    Votes: 99 56.6%

  • No thanks

    Votes: 57 32.6%

  • Dont know yet

    Votes: 17 9.7%
  • Total voters
    175
Quartz said:
At this point, I'm pretty much a Yes. I really have just the one issue: will Scotland be run by sensible people like danny la rouge and pogofish or bigots like weepiper and DairyQueen ? I really don't want my nephew and niece to grow up in a country run on the lines of their bigotry, even racism. I've noted that the SNP haven't acted on incidents within their ranks.

Nuclear was an issue, but I think Scotland will have to embrace nuclear power at some point. Defence was also an issue, and I think Scotland will have to significantly invest in naval defence to protect its fisheries. If the Shetlands remain with the rUK, then our negotiating position will be much poorer but we'll get over it.
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I'm glad you're leaning to Yes, but you can't go around calling people racists.

There are other points in your post, but I think you need to deal with that first. You've made a serious allegation against two posters. Since there is no evidence for it, you really need to withdraw it and apologize.
 
danny la rouge said:
I'm glad you're leaning to Yes, but you can't go around calling people racists.

There are other points in your post, but I think you need to deal with that first. You've made a serious allegation against two posters. Since there is no evidence for it, you really need to withdraw it and apologize.
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I was in Ireland years ago and was struck by how friendly people were to myself and my g/f as a couple of English people. The response was that the Irish have no problem with English people, it's the English government they have issues with. The same I think goes for all of the posts in this thread. I've seen no hint of bigotry, all the remarks I've seen have been talking about the British government not English people.

Even though the Scots (and Irish) also have good cause for complaints against many English people, too.

And it's to your credit Quartz that you've changed your mind because of the arguments.
 
Quartz is just barracking people. Don't address the points, shout racist or bigot. It just shows how little Quartz understands of these types of issues. Best to ignore the guy and move on.

He's certainly voting No incidentally if he thinks criticisms of Westminster and Westminster politicians constitute bigotry. This is just Daily Telegraph comments section quality. We've wasted enough time discussing it. Next he will be accusing Salmond and the SNP of being Mugabe-style fascists. if the polls get tighter expect a lot more of this kind of nonsense.
 
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Quartz said:
Nuclear was an issue, but I think Scotland will have to embrace nuclear power at some point.
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Not going to happen. Scotland has always been anti nukes, I really don't see that changing and I've lived here a lot longer than you :D A LOT of people are voting Yes to get rid of the nukes, I'm sure I've written this before :hmm:
Why the hell do we need them anyway when we could have green energy coming out of our ears? We've got hydro, wind, solar, then the oil(not so green).

As for Shetland, afaic see the only rumblings about them staying with rUK are from Carmicheal. Last time I saw anything about it was Shetlanders telling him to butt out.
 
danny la rouge said:
Not least because the English people suffer at the hands of Westminster, too. We have a tool to use and we need to use it. Hopefully it will also create the space English people need in order to act, too.
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if scots indy can do one thing for english people it is simply to wound the tory party. Probably not fatally, the bastards are like armoured cockroaches, they will return. I don't really know how well younger scottish voters raised on a slab/snp two horse race can understand just how toxic, how anti-human and downright shitbaggy the tory party really is. How much they genuinely hate us.
 
Just saw the stuff below in the comments on this piece in the guardian
http://www.theguardian.com/news/dat...tish-independence-referendum-poll-gap-narrows
For what it's worth, if I had a vote in this I'd be a Yes (for the reasons danny la rouge gave a page or two back), but I'm not so much posting it for the specific bullet points. It's the bolded bit at the top - it really would be hard to make an active case for joining the UK.

An interesting thought experiment is to imagine Scotland was currently independent, and the referendum would be to join the UK.
Could the Pro-union side convince us that getting together would be better when we were told what would happen to Scotland after such a union? Some bullet points from the campaign…

-Your main Parliament will move 600 miles away, and your MPs will be in a tiny minority & will therefore have limited ability to effect policy on your behalf
-Scotland will get a government it didn’t vote for.
-All of your oil and gas revenues will be handed over to the treasury in London.
-Even though not 1 inch of track will touch Scottish soil your taxpayers will contribute £4.2bn to the HS2 project.
-Your taxpayers will also subsidise the crossrail project in London.
-The biggest nuclear weapons facility in Western Europe will be built on the river Clyde, just 30 miles from your largest city.
-Even though you only have 8.2% of the UK’s population you will contribute 9.9% of the UK’s total tax take yet will only receive 9.3% of that tax take back to spend in Scotland (you will lose £4.4bn per year to the UK treasury)
-You will devolve all of the economic levers you have used to shape your economy directly to London and will now only have control of 7% of your economy
-Even though 79% of your MP's voted against it we will privatise your publicly owned mail service
-Even though 91% of your MPs voted against the bedroom tax in your parliament, we will impose it.
-Even though 82% of your MP's believed that a VAT increase would be detrimental to your economy, we will impose a VAT increase.
-You will join a country whose health and education services are rapidly being privatised.
-Now and again you’ll get dragged into an illegal foreign war.
-An austerity budget will be imposed from London cutting jobs and threatening vital public services even though 81% of your MP's voted against the cuts.
-The financial regulation system will be so weak and so lax that your whole economy will be brought to the brink of collapse.
-The most weak and vulnerable in society, instead of getting the protection and support they deserve will be interrogated and humiliated in an effort to get them off the meagre levels of support to which they are entitled.
Who would vote for that Union?
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I see Quartz hasn't been back to retract and apologise yet. I was going to leave it but really I object in the strongest terms to being called a bigot and a racist. I have never, not once, said anything even remotely anti-English (which is what I presume he's getting at with his accusation of bigotry and racism) and I think I deserve an apology. Simply disagreeing with someone who happens to be English does not qualify you as a bigot. I don't think DairyQueen has either. That sort of insult shouldn't be thrown around lightly on a board like this just because you dislike someone's posting style.
 
I've not seen anything anti-English beyond referring to 'those twats in Whitehall' or similar. A good portion of those twats in Whitehall not being English as it happens...
 


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Radical Independence Glasgow North and East's facebook page said:
We had so many people out helping us today we were able to keep a table at Parkhead job centre all day plus do an afternoon shift in Easterhouse.

One of these pics shows us registering 5 people at the same time.

I've got to say that some of us were getting emotional by what was happening around about us. We are part of history, we are part of a tide of positivity that we might never see again.

We must have registered around 100 people to vote today as well as having important conversations with many more.
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10624898_284363965092138_6438458834806423462_n.jpg
 
Another debate on the telly tonight.

In Scotland that is, England is getting a programme about Prince Harry's 30th birthday or something.
 
cheers you two. I'll have to find an stv stream again, there was a decent one for the first salmond/darling fracas.
 
danny la rouge said:
Not least because the English people suffer at the hands of Westminster, too. We have a tool to use and we need to use it. Hopefully it will also create the space English people need in order to act, too.
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I agree with this too. If I were in England, I would certainly be praying for a yes. Nothing would shake up Westminster more. The higher the yes vote, the higher probability genuine reforms will be made to make politics interesting again.
 
Why do you think that? What reforms?

All I can see is a load of non-tory seats fucking off, which only serves to make the tory majority more secure. :(
 
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