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Will you vote for independence?

Scottish independence?

  • Yes please

    Votes: 99 56.6%

  • No thanks

    Votes: 57 32.6%

  • Dont know yet

    Votes: 17 9.7%
  • Total voters
    175
Quartz said:
Don't be silly. Firstly, they toe the line their owners, the Barclay Bros not the Establishment, tell them to take. Secondly, we have freedom of speech, so they're allowed to be right wing. And we must respect that. So we take those into consideration when you read their reporting. Just like we take the left-wing nature of the Guardian into account. (I do hope you don't take the Guardian as gospel truth). Your nihilipilification of them says more about you than them.
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I am not saying they are not allowed to be right-wing. I am saying it is a poor right wing newspaper. I also said this referendum has made me question a lot about the nature of our press, I could formulate an argument to counter that statement but I disagree with it. What you have not explained is why you think the nature of the press coverage in this referendum, biased or overwhelmingly biased, is acceptable in a democratic country.

Saying the Barclay Brothers is not part of the establishment is weird. They could probably meet David Cameron without an appointment.
 
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DairyQueen said:
What you have not explained is why you think the nature of the press coverage in this referendum, biased or overwhelmingly biased, is acceptable in a democratic country.
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I don't have to. It's a free country. People and papers are free to speak as they see fit, and if most of one or the other or both don't speak your way, then that's their prerogative. You're free to start a paper that is pro-independence. Or distribute pamphlets: that worked in 1776.

Saying the Barclay Brothers is not part of the establishment is weird. They could probably meet David Cameron without an appointment.
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They may be part of the establishment, but they're not all of it, and they don't speak for it.
 
DairyQueen said:
There is the manner in which the SNP is being made out to be undemocratic in the press so that Alistair Darling can claim an independent Scotland would be a dictatorship.
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That's a bit extreme Salmond is no Putin, a bullying Tammany Hall big boss Mayor more like.
 
DairyQueen said:
This is what I don't really get. The Scottish Parliament has less powers than a US state, maybe even less than some US towns. How anyone could get so worked up about Salmond is beyond me.
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Unless you were a minority Labour government in coalition with him. Unlike Plaid or the SDLP he would be talking to the Tories within six months to try and squeeze your balls.
 
youngian said:
Unless you were a minority Labour government in coalition with him. Unlike Plaid or the SDLP he would be talking to the Tories within six months to try and squeeze your balls.
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If you are referring to 1979, Labour refused to implement a paper tiger parliament in Scotland when they relied on SNP votes to keep them in power.

I can't see a coalition between the SNP and Labour ever working, but that is more to do with the west of Scotland Labour MPs hating the SNP.
 
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DairyQueen said:
If you are referring to 1979, Labour refused to implement a paper tiger parliament in Scotland when they relied on SNP votes to keep him in power.

I can't see a coalition between the SNP and Labour ever working, but that is more to do with the west of Scotland Labour MPs hating the SNP.
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Or any Labour MP for that matter. That was more the assessment of most of them if such a deal was possible at the last election.
 
youngian said:
Or any Labour MP for that matter. That was more the assessment of most of them if such a deal was possible at the last election.
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Are you in England? What is your take on this? The perception I get is England is getting a very jaundiced view of Scotland.

I think there is an issue around the fact that if the SNP/Plaid were the deciding factors on education and health policies in England there would be something of a crisis.

I would like to see Salmond in an independent Scotland, that's when Scottish politics would get interesting.
 
two sheds said:
Yes, you're free to do that if you have a few tens of millions of quid spare. Bit of a strange definition of 'freedom' don't you think?
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There are these people who risk money called 'investors'. You might have heard of them. I've also heard that you can borrow money from organisations called 'banks'; perhaps you've heard of those too?
 
Quartz said:
There are these people who risk money called 'investors'. You might have heard of them. I've also heard that you can borrow money from organisations called 'banks'; perhaps you've heard of those too?
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Alan Hello.
Noel Hello.
Alan Well, last week we showed you how to become a gynaecologist. And this week on 'How to do it' we're going to show you how to play the flute, how to split an atom, how to construct a box girder bridge, how to irrigate the Sahara Desert and make vast new areas of land cultivatable, but first, here's Jackie to tell you all how to rid the world of all known diseases.
Jackie Hello, Alan.
Alan Hello, Jackie.
Jackie Well, first of all become a doctor and discover a marvellous cure for something, and then, when the medical profession really starts to take notice of you, you can jolly well tell them what to do and make sure they get everything right so there'll never be any diseases ever again.
Alan Thanks, Jackie. Great idea. How to play the flute. Well here we are. You blow there and you move your fingers up and down here.
Noel Great, great, Alan. Well, next week we'll be showing you how black and white people can live together in peace and harmony, and Alan will be over in Moscow showing us how to reconcile the Russians and the Chinese. So, until next week, cheerio.
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Don't know if anyone saw this last night but Question Time was in Inverness

BBC's Question Time panel in Inverness 'a UK first'
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-28254618
A panel put together for the latest edition of BBC One's Question Time was believed to be the first of its kind in the programme's history.
There were no politicians in the line-up for Thursday night's programme from Inverness.
The programme makers said it was thought to be a first.
On the panel were singer and broadcaster Ricky Ross, journalist Joan Burnie, businessman Alan Savage and former rugby player Scott Hastings.
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The program can be seen here:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b049bj5f/question-time-10072014
 
Or, you know, you could follow the route the Barclay Brothers and Murdoch took: raise funds, buy an existing paper, and direct the editorial line.
 
Quartz said:
There are these people who risk money called 'investors'. You might have heard of them. I've also heard that you can borrow money from organisations called 'banks'; perhaps you've heard of those too?
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Have you read Chomsky and Herman's Manufacturing Consent? There's some relevant stuff about investment in media and specifically what investors and advertisers will fund. There's even mention of a British left of centre daily paper (actual, not imagined), and how it fared, not in sales (it sold well), but in the actual business of a newspaper, selling advertising space.
 
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