butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Cuddly dave who called Robin Yassin-Kassab a jihadi. I feel pretty resentful about that given his own PKK-pimping.
Tommy Robinson, the court case and (guffaw) 'free speech'
- Thread starter Cloo
- Start date
Jeremiah18.17
Well-Known Member
Amen, fellow worker.
The problem comes with people not wanting to listen to US. Because they have “heard it all before”, and in the current iteration of Western individualist culture “nobody can tell me what to do/think”. The meme wave upon which all the army of dementors ride- beyond logic, reason or human compassion....
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
What can i do for you? In simple exact terms. What do you want doing? In exact simple terms. What can we do to get these things. In exact simple terms.
hot air baboon
Well-Known Member
they've had a few flirtations they'd probably rather keep quiet about these days
Here Comes Hitler – Scottish Review of Books
Andrew Dewar Gibb held a chair of Law at Glasgow University as well as senior office within the Scottish National Party but in his 1930 book Scotland in Eclipse he wrote in obscenely racist terms about the Catholic Irish community in Scotland.
Gibb was someone whom Gerhard von Tevenar, a Nazi emissary to Scotland in 1937 and 1938 was anxious to meet though he had to settle for writing to him as part of his quest for ‘Blutsgefuhl’, i.e. a sense of race awareness within Scottish nationalism. He had to conclude that there was little of it but there was some, as the crass anglophobia of some contributions to the pre-war Scots Independent serve to remind us. An example of this was Arthur Donaldson and today’s SNP should surely take no pride in his post-war rise to a ten-year tenure as its chairman or indeed in still having an annual conference lecture named after him. Having been expelled from the party for his open support of Scottish neutrality in the war Donaldson, though not a Fascist in any card-carrying sense, was at the very least a defeatist in 1940 when Hamish Henderson and many more who thought as he did were already in uniform. In 1940 and 1941 Donaldson talked and wrote of a Nazi victory as a moment of political opportunity for Scottish nationalism.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
My next book, and i'm not joking, is Fascist Scotland by Gavin Bowd. How they got away with it is amazing - the petainst scum
I doubt Millenial Woes would consider himself a fan of her; he's a racist misogynist youtuber!
There is a clear case in economics-liberal economics, if you must-that immigration is required to Scotland to increase growth. It's not a bit of fluffiness, but the window dressing is.
The SNP are an engine for independence who, by default, look relatively sane. There's not a lot of competition.
existentialist
Tired and unemotional
I think it's something along the lines of "Yaxley-Lennon and all of that ilk aren't necessarily racist bastards, they're just a bit misunderstood. And if you took the trouble to understand them better, you'd see that they have a point."
Attachments
mojo pixy
...שלא נמצא בשמאל
Alright, so then how does that relate to the topic at hand, hate speech as "free speech"?
Do you personally think anything should be permissible in public discourse? Should utter bellends with zero empathy have some notional Right to be Heard like that can or should ever be a thing? Do you personally have skin in this game? (FTR I don't agree "we all" have skin in this particular game)
Ref Mr Bishies post.
Mr.Bishie
pickled egg
Fuck off.
keybored
Well done. You remember cat good.
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
Anyone noticed the number of 'truthers' 'justice for ...' and other other weird cover up activists who have links with the Free Tommy campaign . There's the three boys who were killed in a horrible car incident who think it was a terrorist attack a campaign for an inquiry into the death of a wythenshaw bloke convicted of drug trafficking who died in prison abroad, a campaign over a CSA survivor who was detained re mental health . Some of these campaigns have linked up for a demo on Saturday in London and have an EDL activist from Bolton speaking . There's also a cross over with self appointed historic abuse investigators which has now got the benefit of RedPill Phil ( a TR supporter) interviewing some bloke out of East17. Very weird lot. Personally I blame Facebook.
MightyTibberton
Well-Known Member
Aye. YouTube might be even worse though. We're being Info War-d!
RD2003
Got a really fucking shitty attitude
The number of people who have disapeared down the YouTube rabbit hole is faintly disturbing, if entertaining.
MightyTibberton
Well-Known Member
https://www.cjr.org/analysis/algorithm-russia-facebook.php
(That opens on Facebook but gets into YouTube further down - it's quite long.)
I work from home and I'm online all the time. I used to have YouTube on a lot, but if you go into anything political (or increasingly anything informational even) you end up being recommended really extreme stuff really quickly.
The first example I had of it personally was because I was interested in meditation. I watched an American journalist called Dan Harris who'd done some stuff on mindfulness on big American TV shows. He did an interview with (famous atheist and now "intellectual dark web" (ha!) member Sam Harris), and that opened up a huge wormhole. I watched a couple of things by him and was soon getting recommended things by channels with crusader knights and templars all over them talking about the "Muslim invasion of Europe" and the like.
More recently, I watched one video by the David Pakman show (liberal US commentator) on Jared Kushner being mocked during a live interview with a Jewish organisation. I was then recommended some coverage of the actual event, so I watched that, and next up on autoplay is an hour long video of insane anti-semitic conspiracy theories about Kushner - Kushner's a dick, but this was really bad stuff, which I reported. . . I don't know if anything came of that, I doubt it. . .
I'm sure the content producers are aware of how it works, and are pushed to create more and more edgy and controversial material. . .
"Engagement" algorithms will give us auto-suggest fascism!
(That opens on Facebook but gets into YouTube further down - it's quite long.)
I work from home and I'm online all the time. I used to have YouTube on a lot, but if you go into anything political (or increasingly anything informational even) you end up being recommended really extreme stuff really quickly.
The first example I had of it personally was because I was interested in meditation. I watched an American journalist called Dan Harris who'd done some stuff on mindfulness on big American TV shows. He did an interview with (famous atheist and now "intellectual dark web" (ha!) member Sam Harris), and that opened up a huge wormhole. I watched a couple of things by him and was soon getting recommended things by channels with crusader knights and templars all over them talking about the "Muslim invasion of Europe" and the like.
More recently, I watched one video by the David Pakman show (liberal US commentator) on Jared Kushner being mocked during a live interview with a Jewish organisation. I was then recommended some coverage of the actual event, so I watched that, and next up on autoplay is an hour long video of insane anti-semitic conspiracy theories about Kushner - Kushner's a dick, but this was really bad stuff, which I reported. . . I don't know if anything came of that, I doubt it. . .
I'm sure the content producers are aware of how it works, and are pushed to create more and more edgy and controversial material. . .
"Engagement" algorithms will give us auto-suggest fascism!
RD2003
Got a really fucking shitty attitude
I watched the England semi-final at the home of a secular(ish) Muslim friend of my wife who seemed genuinely convinced that the Jews are behind almost everything bad, which may not necessarily be a YouTube/Internet thing... Another friend, a 'soft' Corbyn supporter, maintained that 'they' indisputably assassinated Diana. Others, some looking a little uneasy, were prepared to take both contentions seriously.
This stuff seems more widespread than you might think.
This stuff seems more widespread than you might think.
MightyTibberton
Well-Known Member
Sheesh!
I thought for a laugh I'd go and look at the comments under a Princess Diana story at the Express. Here you go, first comment up:
From Diana to Madeleine McCann to...
Not that this stuff is totally new I reckon. I used to read a lot of James Ellroy books. It's not history I know, but I think it's pretty authentic and well researched, and they (set in the 60s mostly) feature loads of far right conspiracy loons, usually clustered around the KKK. So Alex Jones and his pals are nothing new, it's just they don't have pirate radio transmitters and printing presses any more and they consequently have a far bigger reach.
I thought for a laugh I'd go and look at the comments under a Princess Diana story at the Express. Here you go, first comment up:
From Diana to Madeleine McCann to...
Not that this stuff is totally new I reckon. I used to read a lot of James Ellroy books. It's not history I know, but I think it's pretty authentic and well researched, and they (set in the 60s mostly) feature loads of far right conspiracy loons, usually clustered around the KKK. So Alex Jones and his pals are nothing new, it's just they don't have pirate radio transmitters and printing presses any more and they consequently have a far bigger reach.
krtek a houby
Merry Xmas!
Friend of mine, an Irish Republican and very proud of his Republican heritage is sound on most things but once he brings up "the Jews", I'm out. Same with another friend who's of Jamaican heritage - she absolutely says there's no room for racism in her life. Told me some terrible stories of her growing up in the Midlands and what she faced not just from kids but cops. Then she'd launch into a tirade about "the Jews are just as bad, the way they treat black people".
I don't understand how some people can deviate in an instant from the rational to the irrational
I don't understand how some people can deviate in an instant from the rational to the irrational
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
Yes. I've met some right nutters in Portugal who spend far too much time on Youtube or by themselves. There's a Portuguese bloke who I bump into in one of the local bars every now and again who likes to speak English with me and is obssesed with some theory that the real killer of JFK is actually in prison but they wont charge him for some reason. Theres an English bloke who only speaks about what hes seen on RT and keeps sending me Youtube vides of aliens and coverups and another barmy English couple who after smoking to much wacky baccy ramble on about cannabis oil being supresssed because it is a threat to multi international drug companies and having met the man who invented barcodes who is now in hiding, which apparantly were originally designed to be tatooed on humans by the 'powers that be'. I'm very grateful for the fact that as they spend so much time watching this garbage that I dont see them very often.
sim667
All aboard the 303 bus.
The man who invented barcodes is actually a very old freinds dad. AFAIK he retired, moved abroad and passed away.
Edit: no, sorry, I've got it wrong, its the guy who invented black strips on the back of train tickets etc.
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
that barcodes as tattoos for control used to show up in xtian end time armageddony after the rapture ramblings.
I'd hope these days they've updated it to rfid/gps chips implanted at birth, otherwise the theory hasn't moved with the times
I'd hope these days they've updated it to rfid/gps chips implanted at birth, otherwise the theory hasn't moved with the times
andysays
Love and solidarity
Inside every anti-establishment conspiraloon beats the heart of a traditionalist
hot air baboon
Well-Known Member
The Paranoid Style in American Politics
By Richard Hofstadter
from the November 1964 issue
The Paranoid Style in American Politics | Harper's Magazine
American politics has often been an arena for angry minds. In recent years we have seen angry minds at work mainly among extreme right-wingers, who have now demonstrated in the Goldwater movement how much political leverage can be got out of the animosities and passions of a small minority. But behind this I believe there is a style of mind that is far from new and that is not necessarily right-wing. I call it the paranoid style simply because no other word adequately evokes the sense of heated exaggeration, suspiciousness, and conspiratorial fantasy that I have in mind. In using the expression “paranoid style” I am not speaking in a clinical sense, but borrowing a clinical term for other purposes. I have neither the competence nor the desire to classify any figures of the past or present as certifiable lunatics. In fact, the idea of the paranoid style as a force in politics would have little contemporary relevance or historical value if it were applied only to men with profoundly disturbed minds. It is the use of paranoid modes of expression by more or less normal people that makes the phenomenon significant.
Of course this term is pejorative, and it is meant to be; the paranoid style has a greater affinity for bad causes than good. But nothing really prevents a sound program or demand from being advocated in the paranoid style. Style has more to do with the way in which ideas are believed than with the truth or falsity of their content. I am interested here in getting at our political psychology through our political rhetoric. The paranoid style is an old and recurrent phenomenon in our public life which has been frequently linked with movements of suspicious discontent.
By Richard Hofstadter
from the November 1964 issue
The Paranoid Style in American Politics | Harper's Magazine
American politics has often been an arena for angry minds. In recent years we have seen angry minds at work mainly among extreme right-wingers, who have now demonstrated in the Goldwater movement how much political leverage can be got out of the animosities and passions of a small minority. But behind this I believe there is a style of mind that is far from new and that is not necessarily right-wing. I call it the paranoid style simply because no other word adequately evokes the sense of heated exaggeration, suspiciousness, and conspiratorial fantasy that I have in mind. In using the expression “paranoid style” I am not speaking in a clinical sense, but borrowing a clinical term for other purposes. I have neither the competence nor the desire to classify any figures of the past or present as certifiable lunatics. In fact, the idea of the paranoid style as a force in politics would have little contemporary relevance or historical value if it were applied only to men with profoundly disturbed minds. It is the use of paranoid modes of expression by more or less normal people that makes the phenomenon significant.
Of course this term is pejorative, and it is meant to be; the paranoid style has a greater affinity for bad causes than good. But nothing really prevents a sound program or demand from being advocated in the paranoid style. Style has more to do with the way in which ideas are believed than with the truth or falsity of their content. I am interested here in getting at our political psychology through our political rhetoric. The paranoid style is an old and recurrent phenomenon in our public life which has been frequently linked with movements of suspicious discontent.
