The working from home thread

[quimcunx]

Although many workers would save money on their commute.

 

[Roadkill]

Although many workers would save money on their commute.

Yes, there is that. I don't know what proportion of workers whose jobs are amenable to being transferred home do commute, but it's probably pretty high, especially in London. I'd see no benefit - I'm fortunate enough to live where I can walk to work - but I'm in a minority even here, in a relatively small city.

Another factor which has just occurred to me is health and safety, which employers could easily use general WFH to compromise and/or pass responsibility and cost for onto their workforces. When I moved into my present office a few years ago I shared with a colleague who used an elderly office chair. The H&S people came along one day, took one look and replaced it pronto with something that you can actually use for a few hours without getting backache. I have almost exactly the same kind of chair in my office at home, and no-one either to highlight it as a health hazard or pay for its replacement...

 

[farmerbarleymow]

The problem there is that in reducing office space they're also passing some of their overheads - heating, lighting, cleaning etc - onto their employees. Are they going to increase wages to compensate? I very much doubt it...

edit - from their point of view it'll also have the advantage of atomising the workforce and making it harder for unions to organise.

There is some kind of tax rebate you can claim for working at home to help with those costs - and employers can choose to add the same amount to wages if they require people to work at home (most won't of course). It says you can only claim if you have to work at home, rather than choose to.

Claim tax relief for your job expenses

Claiming tax relief on expenses you have to pay for your work, like uniforms, tools, travel and working from home costs.

www.gov.uk

But overall it's better for workers to be able to not travel to an office I think. Unions will just have to adapt and change how they interact with members/potential members.

 

[purenarcotic]

I think it depends on the job and the person farmerbarleymow - staff in my job are really struggling with working from home as it really reduces the capacity for informal supervision and support from a colleague. The research into working from home in the social care service also suggests it’s a really awful idea (the same goes for hot desking). For some people their work is their escape from difficult home lives (I find it interesting how quickly we recognise school is a child’s safe place but seem to never think about how work might be an adults safe place) or it’s the only place they get social interaction with others.

I am all for making it easier to work from home for those who want to but I would really worry about any drive to really push people into it and to make going into offices the exception to the norm.

 

[mx wcfc]

The problem there is that in reducing office space they're also passing some of their overheads - heating, lighting, cleaning etc - onto their employees. Are they going to increase wages to compensate? I very much doubt it...

edit - from their point of view it'll also have the advantage of atomising the workforce and making it harder for unions to organise.

It's your second point which is the killer - it's absolutely going to have that effect.

On costs, I suspect the argument will be that "you are saving a fortune on commuting". Which I am. But I have colleagues who walk to work - they will feel more strongly. It'll be a bit more of an issue, when it gets cold again. I don't fancy running the heating all day.

 

[May Kasahara]

existentialist thanks again for sharing your story about the person collapsing on a video call (and I hope she's okay btw). I've raised it with various colleagues as a potential safeguarding/lone working risk to be aware of and they've all been very appreciative, so

 

[existentialist]

existentialist thanks again for sharing your story about the person collapsing on a video call (and I hope she's okay btw). I've raised it with various colleagues as a potential safeguarding/lone working risk to be aware of and they've all been very appreciative, so

Thanks for that, May Kasahara - something good had to come of it! We are still waiting for more news, but she was diagnosed with a very severe brain cancer as a result, and given only a very short time to live. They're waiting on a second opinion, but she's being an absolute trouper, and insisting that, like Arnie, she'll be back.

I've had quite a harrowing two days putting together a video from all the students and tutors to send to her in return for her "check in" video she sent on Monday. I'm on top of this, but fuck me, there's a lot of grief - and uncertainty - to carry.

But yeah - ever since, I check round group participants and confirm where they are. That's three quarters of an hour I never want to relive, ever again.

 

[cybershot]

I've been WFH now for 2 months, just noticed the anniversary by scrolling through my Instagram! In some ways it's gone fast, but ultimately I feel like I've achieved very little and getting less and less motivated as the days go by. Not helped by the likes of today where I have 6 conference calls/meetings, meaning there's just no momentum to do anything else, but the to do list just grows and grows.

Especially as confirmed the building I work in will be in our phase 1 of buildings to reopen on June 1. I'm not sure if that energises me or just adds to the stress. My emotions don't seem to exist anymore.

 

[weltweit]

9 weeks WFH here, am amazed it has been so long. Going ok though as there is plenty of work to do and no video meetings to bother with. Work have pretty much left me alone, they can see I am working though. I get a couple of calls a week from my boss to check I am ok.

Nearly forgot about the bank holiday though! Grr .. still what can you do .. with it?

 

[circleline]

Confirmed by work yesterday that our office will not be open again 'before mid-summer'. Deliberately vague and tentative it seems..

 

[May Kasahara]

Really sorry to hear that existentialist, how awful

 

[existentialist]

Really sorry to hear that existentialist, how awful

Yes, it is terribly sad. Unless there's a miracle...

 

[marty21]

I’ve found that it’s the younger members of my team, for whom the office also serves as more of a social hub, that would like to stop working from home. The more mature, settled team members (who tend to live further out of town too) are more than happy for WFH to carry in indefinitely.

I'm more 'mature' and settled, and I'd prefer to be in the office , at least some of the time - mrs21 is happy to continue wfh until the end of time or she retires, whichever comes first.

 

[8ball]

existentialist thanks again for sharing your story about the person collapsing on a video call (and I hope she's okay btw). I've raised it with various colleagues as a potential safeguarding/lone working risk to be aware of and they've all been very appreciative, so

I'm pretty much alone in my office and have some health conditions. They seem happy enough to leave me to it and I'd be alone if working from home, but was a little surprised they didn't ask any questions.

 

[8ball]

edit - from their point of view it'll also have the advantage of atomising the workforce and making it harder for unions to organise.

I've noticed that among some companies in my industry that have had WFH as the norm for years, it is very common to do that "pretend self-employment" thing.

 

[marty21]

I have developed a wfh routine, out for a walk on the marshes in the morning , about 5 miles, log on 9.15 ish do work stuff - occasional Skype team meetings, or department meetings - for the departmental ones, I just go on mute a lunch time walk (2 miles) back on the lap top, til about 4.30ish - then turn the laptop off, and go for another 2 mile walk - I do like this routine tbf - but also miss work place interaction, and my job does usually involve meeting with tenants, contractors, leaseholders, other council services, so there is a lot of stuff that is difficult to do without meeting folk.

 

[8ball]

I have developed a wfh routine, out for a walk on the marshes in the morning , about 5 miles, log on 9.15 ish do work stuff - occasional Skype team meetings, or department meetings - for the departmental ones, I just go on mute a lunch time walk (2 miles) back on the lap top, til about 4.30ish - then turn the laptop off, and go for another 2 mile walk - I do like this routine tbf - but also miss work place interaction, and my job does usually involve meeting with tenants, contractors, leaseholders, other council services, so there is a lot of stuff that is difficult to do without meeting folk.

Hang on, don't you drive an Amazon van?

edit: I need to learn to read

 

[marty21]

Also, my work station, is sitting on the sofa, as mrs21 bagged the desk in the spare room and refuses to give it up (haven't actually asked her as I like being on the sofa)

 

[marty21]

Hang on, don't you drive an Amazon van?

no

 

[8ball]

no

Sorry, I'm having a real derp day today.

 

[Roadkill]

I've noticed that among some companies in my industry that have had WFH as the norm for years, it is very common to do that "pretend self-employment" thing.

Depressing, but I'm not surprised to hear it...

 

[8ball]

Depressing, but I'm not surprised to hear it...

They do pay signficantly more (like more than twice as much, with advice on the tax dodges available), so those not of a political persuasion are very hot on chasing these jobs.

 

[Roadkill]

They do pay signficantly more (like more than twice as much, with advice on the tax dodges available), so those not of a political persuasion are very hot on chasing these jobs.

That's the problem in a nutshell, isn't it: it can be made to make a lot of short-term financial sense for the individual to go for the WFH/faux-self employed position, but in the longer run it comes with none of the protections and benefits of being an employee and undermines attempts to improve pay and conditions for all.

Thankfully, as a public sector worker I don't expect to be presented with the choice. Just my P45 instead.

 

[8ball]

That's the problem in a nutshell, isn't it: it can be made to make a lot of short-term financial sense for the individual to go for the WFH/faux-self employed position, but in the longer run it comes with none of the protections and benefits of being an employee and undermines attempts to improve pay and conditions for all.

In a way, it's not the problem. It's the entire point of the exercise.
And once all employment protections are gone, they can do what they like with the wages.

 

[stavros]

I was in a Teams meeting today with some known tossers. It got me remembering that episode of The Thick Of It where Hugh sends an email about someone he meets to the wrong address of a colleague, instead going to a young girl.

ETA: It's on the iplayer, so I've done screenshot:

 

[Puddy_Tat]

keeping 'teams' video chat on most of the day to keep in touch with colleagues who are working from home is variable.

it's been fine most of the day, especially when cats / dogs want to say hello. then when we are actually trying to talk, then it's all "is your microphone on?" "we seem to have lost you" "you've frozen, are you still there?" "sorry, i didn't hear any of that" and so on. i think we got 5 minutes communication in a half hour team meeting today.



one of my colleagues has an alexa thingy in her home office / spare bedroom. another colleague realised this, waited for her to go to the bog then said "alexa, play hungarian folk music". alexa might do something else weird tomorrow...

 

[farmerbarleymow]

ne of my colleagues has an alexa thingy in her home office / spare bedroom. another colleague realised this, waited for her to go to the bog then said "alexa, play hungarian folk music". alexa might do something else weird tomorrow...

It mystifies me why anyone would have spyware in their house tbh. I know mobiles have similar capabilities, but a dedicated device - fuck no.

 

[kabbes]

It mystifies me why anyone would have spyware in their house tbh. I know mobiles have similar capabilities, but a dedicated device - fuck no.

You can tell it to time things and put the lights on. And you used to be able to tell it to play radio 4 but that doesn’t work any more because the BBC are cunts.

 

[pinkmonkey]

Another factor which has just occurred to me is health and safety, which employers could easily use general WFH to compromise and/or pass responsibility and cost for onto their workforces. When I moved into my present office a few years ago I shared with a colleague who used an elderly office chair. The H&S people came along one day, took one look and replaced it pronto with something that you can actually use for a few hours without getting backache. I have almost exactly the same kind of chair in my office at home, and no-one either to highlight it as a health hazard or pay for its replacement...

This was my big WFH lesson learned. Have been freelance and WFH for over 16 years, but I learned the hard way about ergonomics and setting up your workspace properly. Don’t have a fancy chair, but I’ve followed the basics from one of those diagrams. Have a Togu dynair cushion, which is a compromise if you can’t stretch to much else, it will protect your back. And the cantilevered arm rest helps, I spend hours using a mouse doing CAD work.
My other WFH lesson is IT issues: making sure you back everything up. I guess your employers will have planned this in, but I obviously don’t have employers. I work in Dropbox, that’s where I save everything I’m currently working on (and past projects), I also keep a set of hard drives here and also off site. I once lost one set of hard drives and my laptop on a train - was saved by Dropbox and my off site archive.
Oh and even a laptop riser will save both your back, because the height of the screen is more comfortable - and your laptop from coffee spills. El Jugs always uses a riser.

 

[sleaterkinney]

Well they are mothballing my office, so I will be wfh from home for the foreseeable. I got a proper keyboard, mouse and monitor which makes a massive difference compared to a laptop.