RubyToogood
RubyTwobikes
The police not taking racial abuse seriously? You jest, surely.
<Note to newcomers - heavy irony alert>
The Tuts make dubious allegations after Brixton Windmill gig
- Thread starter ethel
- Start date
- Status
<Note to newcomers - heavy irony alert>
colacubes
Mr Hot Cookie
God this is all very depressing - both the alleged incident and this thread.
I'm not going to add to this at length, but what I would say is that if the singer thinks she has been assaulted she should go and make a statement to the police and ask them to investigate. They may well have said "nothing will come of it" but they said that a couple of years ago when I was assaulted on the street by a random. I pursued and he was eventually convicted.
I would just say though that allegations of assault are very serious and should be dealt with by police and relevant authorities. But they are just allegations until any criminal proceedings happen.
However, there also seems to be a lot of hyperbole here on both sides. Accusations of sexism of posters here are way off the mark by people who alleged the event. For the person who's twitter has been screenshot - if you don't want that to happen you need to make it private. Anyone could do it. People do it on lots of threads here as lots of people don't have twitter.
However, I think it's also deeply unhelpful people being suspicious of new people coming on and describing what they saw. Some of us know the Windmill well; and also know Brixton well. What might not be seen as serious by some here was obviously disturbing and frightening to people who were there.
And just for the avoidance of doubt for the newbies I'm female and have DJ'd at the Windmill and attended many gigs there over the last 10 years or so. I know the staff. I have never seen anything like this happen before. However, if I did witness something like the alleged incident I'd be pretty fucking disgusted. I'd also think twice about going back. But it's not for you or I to judge whether it's assault. It's for the police and the courts.
I'm not going to add to this at length, but what I would say is that if the singer thinks she has been assaulted she should go and make a statement to the police and ask them to investigate. They may well have said "nothing will come of it" but they said that a couple of years ago when I was assaulted on the street by a random. I pursued and he was eventually convicted.
I would just say though that allegations of assault are very serious and should be dealt with by police and relevant authorities. But they are just allegations until any criminal proceedings happen.
However, there also seems to be a lot of hyperbole here on both sides. Accusations of sexism of posters here are way off the mark by people who alleged the event. For the person who's twitter has been screenshot - if you don't want that to happen you need to make it private. Anyone could do it. People do it on lots of threads here as lots of people don't have twitter.
However, I think it's also deeply unhelpful people being suspicious of new people coming on and describing what they saw. Some of us know the Windmill well; and also know Brixton well. What might not be seen as serious by some here was obviously disturbing and frightening to people who were there.
And just for the avoidance of doubt for the newbies I'm female and have DJ'd at the Windmill and attended many gigs there over the last 10 years or so. I know the staff. I have never seen anything like this happen before. However, if I did witness something like the alleged incident I'd be pretty fucking disgusted. I'd also think twice about going back. But it's not for you or I to judge whether it's assault. It's for the police and the courts.
el-ahrairah
forward communism, forward gerbils!
i know the sort of person you are now radradrad, cheers.
colacubes
Mr Hot Cookie
el-ahrairah
forward communism, forward gerbils!
reported by witnesses without an axe to grind or anything?
Pardon?
ericjarvis
give a feck for the feckless
My take on this, as a muso.
Musos playing a gig often behave like complete arseholes, myself included. It goes with the territory. You can end up in some really weird mind states when performing, not to mention the effect of nerves. Anyone involved in running a gig should be aware of this, and that includes the landlord of a pub venue. Sometimes musicians will do something out of order, and without condoning it, the landlord and the promoter et al have to be able to handle it with a minimum of fuss. That might still mean expelling a musician by force, but certainly not the sort of fracas that appears to have taken place at the Windmill.
Musos playing a gig often behave like complete arseholes, myself included. It goes with the territory. You can end up in some really weird mind states when performing, not to mention the effect of nerves. Anyone involved in running a gig should be aware of this, and that includes the landlord of a pub venue. Sometimes musicians will do something out of order, and without condoning it, the landlord and the promoter et al have to be able to handle it with a minimum of fuss. That might still mean expelling a musician by force, but certainly not the sort of fracas that appears to have taken place at the Windmill.
Well if it was the word of a man who attempted to punch you and nearly ripped, and partially damaged, the t-shirt you were wearing unprovoked against those of people who also faced his wrath who would you lean towards?
a bigoted woman
Member
Landlords owning a pub often behave like complete arseholes, myself included. It goes with the territory. You can end up in some really weird mind states when owning a pub, not to mention the effect of drinks. Anyone involved in going to a pub should be aware of this, and that includes the musos in a band. Sometimes publicans will do something out of order, and without condoning it, the punters and the performers et al have to be able to handle it with a minimum of fuss. That might still mean being expelled by the landlords by force, but certainly not the sort of fracas that appears to have taken place at the Windmill.
a bigoted woman
Member
I don't really own a pub.
Minnie_the_Minx
someinenhhanding menbag and me ah bollox
Right, I just heard back from my friend.
Says that Saemus caught Nadia drinking her own alcohol in the bar, asked her to leave, at which point she started trying to throw punches at him. He then used reasonable force to remove her, but she was being leary, very aggressive, and drunk.
Says that Saemus caught Nadia drinking her own alcohol in the bar, asked her to leave, at which point she started trying to throw punches at him. He then used reasonable force to remove her, but she was being leary, very aggressive, and drunk.
Rushy
basically a scrotum
So am I to understand that this is being painted as a racist and sexist incident because someone may or may not have heard the landlord use the word Paki after the incident was over and the Police had turned up, and the alleged victim was a girl?
Sounds like Seamus acted disproportionately to a punter/performer being juvenile and selfish. Seamus should very quickly learn better how to diffuse situations and the punter/performer should grow up a bit. If Seamus' action might have amounted to assault, get the police involved. (ETA : or the girl's attempt to hit Seamus, for that matter).
Incidentally, I just had a listen to The Tuts on myspace and rather liked it.
Sounds like Seamus acted disproportionately to a punter/performer being juvenile and selfish. Seamus should very quickly learn better how to diffuse situations and the punter/performer should grow up a bit. If Seamus' action might have amounted to assault, get the police involved. (ETA : or the girl's attempt to hit Seamus, for that matter).
Incidentally, I just had a listen to The Tuts on myspace and rather liked it.
Kanda
Diving wanker
wurlycurly
diss member
All the talk of smuggled-in booze, pissed people, arguments etc is merely acting as a smokescreen for two allegations - did Seamus grab the singer by the hair, and was she racially abused? The promoter says he won't be putting on Windmill gigs again, and that seems pretty significant to me. My default position will be to avoid the Windmill until this is sorted out. Grim stuff.
el-ahrairah
forward communism, forward gerbils!
fair enough wurlycurly.
why would seamus be dumb enough to use racially aggravating language in the presence of the police. that would be a thing i doubt a man with his experience would do, even if he thought it? i've never seen him say anything like that in the face of aggravation and an ability to get away with it.
why would seamus be dumb enough to use racially aggravating language in the presence of the police. that would be a thing i doubt a man with his experience would do, even if he thought it? i've never seen him say anything like that in the face of aggravation and an ability to get away with it.
I've heard direct from a witness that this Nadia tried to throw a huge punch at Saemus and totally missed, which only made her more wound up and aggressive. 
Once you throw a punch at a landlord I don't think you have ANY grounds to be moaning about how rough they were in trying to remove you.
Once you throw a punch at a landlord I don't think you have ANY grounds to be moaning about how rough they were in trying to remove you.
King Biscuit Time
Well-Known Member
The promoter said he wouldn't use the Windmill again because 'he couldn't get a crowd in'. That's an important distinction.
Minnie_the_Minx
someinenhhanding menbag and me ah bollox
I've heard direct from a witness that this Nadia tried to throw a huge punch at Saemus and totally missed, which only made her more wound up and aggressive.
Once you throw a punch at a landlord I don't think you have ANY grounds to be moaning about how rough they were in trying to remove you.
What did your friend say about the racist language or didn't they hear it?
a bigoted woman
Member
again, wasn't there - but is "using racist language" and "racial abuse" being mixed up here? both very bad, by the way, in case this is not clear. (and i'm not white, if that matters)
my post you quoted was jokes btw (some kind of parody of an earlier post, or something)
my post you quoted was jokes btw (some kind of parody of an earlier post, or something)
editor
hiraethified
I think you're reading far, far, far too much into this screenshot thing. Some people like to quote Twitter comments, some like to use a screenshot. I've done both depending on what I'm using to post on these boards (desktop/phone) and if I can be arsed to grab a screen shot or not.
As for the suggestion that there's some sort of sexism running rampant around here, I suggest you take a look around at some of the threads on the topic.
Rushy
basically a scrotum
Both are clearly sexist.
Saw the whole thing, and didn't hear any racist language used by Saemus (and she's the type of person that would be totally disgusted if he had) did say that Saemus was quite rough in throwing her out, but only because she was trying to lash out at him as he was doing so. The police came down and defused it all, but it was mostly handbags in her opinion.
I've heard direct from a witness that this Nadia tried to throw a huge punch at Saemus and totally missed, which only made her more wound up and aggressive.
Once you throw a punch at a landlord I don't think you have ANY grounds to be moaning about how rough they were in trying to remove you.
I do not see how your secondary data is far more credible than plenty of other people's primary accounts of what happened. Your witness seems to glaze over how Nadia's hair was pulled and how she was chased around the venue. Other accounts have stated how Nadia's behaviour was out of control, if you bothered to read them, but yours appears completely one-sided.
wurlycurly
diss member
Sorry; missed that. You're absoulety right.
Rushy
basically a scrotum
He is relaying a first hand account from someone he trusts. Don't take it personally.
FROM FACEBOOK -
from now on i am never stepping foot in the Brixton Windmill again. Seriously BOYCOTT IT. Old man landlord assaulted lead singer of The Tuts, pulled her hair and about 5 people had to get him off her. He then used RACIST TERMINOLOGY. Police had to be called. Been to some great gigs there in the past but now I can't let my money go to a racist who assaults women.
I didn't say it was any more credible, but this was from someone who was a neutral observer that I trust 100%, and who happened to be in the Windmill last night.
- Status
Similar threads
